American Burglary & Fire

Revdex.com: I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] , and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me Sincerely, [redacted]

(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.) I am answering this compliant response by paragraph as ABF's response was quite lengthy as well as rather disingenuous In regards to: Paragraph ABF states "Good business practices require that we always work under contractNo monitoring services are performed unless there is an agreement evidenced in writing for the protection of the customer and ensure that ABF provide the agreed level of serviceThe complaint states that during the meeting there was never a verbal discussion regarding a five (5) year agreementAt the same time the customer never inquired to the length of contract" In my original complaint I as well stated that I felt a contract necessary to ensure proper protection of my home, that being said, a contract of any length should be clarified by the salesman he and I understand the constraints of my service, this is just good business practiceI beg the reader to notice that here the five is both written and numeric for clarification Paragraph 3; I don't feel there is any need to expand upon this, it merely states that it is the salesman's obligation the clarify the terms of the agreement since all of the contract can't be boldIn essence confirming my claim that if the important obligations are not bolded each paragraph should require initials, if clarity was their concern Paragraph 4; I have three points, As attached I have included the prop for my installation, I would like to see what the cost reduction is considering (when under contract) labor hours are clearly stated at what appears to be a low level tech billing rate and the fact that it was a prewired installation, as statedAs a reasonable customer, I would challenge ABF to find a contract of that length (with or without equipment provided) in this fieldAs to the self-serving comment, of course it is, as is the lengthy discourse they provided to them Paragraph and 6; no comment, the length and content speak for themselves Paragraph 7; ah paragraph 7, never once did I claim I did not sign the contract, I stated that with the big zeros (0) written all around the paragraph in question, I never saw the font saying five (5) yearsAnd the ABF rep never mentioned it to say otherwise would be incorrect Paragraph 8; since their extensive monitoring complex retains important contractual data I would like to see the phone records of their calls to me vice mine to them concerning the issues with both hardware and softwareIt is my guess that you will see many more unreturned calls from me than from themThe communication issues are why their service manager (official title unknown) Mr [redacted] needed to be engaged to fix all of my concernsI believe I have the email the was sent to me by ABF's [redacted] with the software package associated with the camera equipment THEY provided since he was to busy to come install itAfter numerous complaints from me, both of the aforementioned individuals did come out and I had to help them with my router configuration, all the while hearing about their need to hurry off to other appointments There is more but I feel it unnecessary to comment as it is a longwinded rehash of the previous paragraphs, but I do want to say that I wrote to "insure that when people look for a home security provider, they understand your contractual practices" because I expected their response to be as it was, useless In closing I have one more question, how do you part amicably when you had to buy out a contract for dollars for nothing in return when the cost to them was zero dollars and really just a lost client? Add to that the fact that the quality of service during the contract enforcement period was at best suspect and at worst negligentI say negligent as the fact that the house power input monitoring limitation was NEVER discussed at contract signingBefore, and even more so now, I feel my buy-out monies should be refundedIf not to the letter of contractual law, than by reasonable standards I should not have to pay for services not received

After reviewing the documentation involved in this matter, we believe that based on the signed agreement with [redacted] ***, we went above and beyond by allowing the client to cancel her services. Our contract states that “The initial term of this Agreement is one year from the date each system... is installed and becomes operative and thereafter for consecutive terms of one year until such time as either party upon 30 days written notice advises the other party of its intent to terminate the Agreement at the end of the then current term.” Ms. [redacted] called to cancel services on November 15, 2016 which were paid through December 31, 2016. We only required Ms. [redacted] to give us a thirty (30) day notice of cancellation. We did refund Ms. [redacted] $13.71 for prepaid services from December 15 – December 31.

They did sign a contract with our company, they signed a five year agreement clearly stated in the contractThe contract clearly states to read entire contract before signingThe contact was signed without any additional questions to the terms of the contractAt no time did they tell us the length of the lease agreement they were in with the facility they occupied The person that signed the contract is listed with the Missouri Secretary of State as managing memberWe would have no reason to believe a ,managing member of the company would not realize what he was signingHe never asked for any clarification on any part of the contract he signedThe express problem she had with our system, had no effect on the alarm signal, the signal was always working as it is designed to, the problem was in regards to open and closed reports that the customer requested, that was not included in the priceThat was always an option for them to add, however we never received a request for that serviceAs an accommodation we provided open and closed reports for this customer The report we provided them was incorrect due to date and time setting within the systemThis was immediately corrected upon our knowledge of the errorUnfortunately there was no way for us to retroactively correct reports that were already submitted before the settings were correctedWe did provide them with instructions on how to manually adjust the report to show the correct date and timesThe system was leased, so we owned and maintained the equipment Without our permission someone came in and removed the equipment and never returned it to our company, this is in direct violation of the agreements within the contract,which prohibits others from tampering or removing the equipmentThe reason for them discontinuing the service was for not receiving a report that was not part of their contract We feel that this was not just cause to cancel a service,nor to breach their contract with our companyOur Sales Manager for this consumer, Is no long with our company due to moving out of state, therefore we can not confirm the communications between the twoOur sales manager was very reliable and professional by the time our Sales Manager turned this account over internal collections had turned this account over to our currant Sales Manager the consumer had already switched to another provider, at this point we had to turn the account over to a third party collection service

Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because: While I accept their agreeing to terminate my contract so that I can move on with the completion of the work in my house, their reply has inaccuraciesABF states that they never
received notification by the contractor that drywall was going upFirst of all, the agreement was with me and not through the contractor, ** *** ***All communications were through me and ABF; the contractor was never involved in any way except in the end when I needed my contractor's assistance to find/located the missing smoke detector wiresThen, and only then, did my job superintendant, *** ***, speak to ABF's technician, ***I spoke to *** several times letting her know that we were nearing drywall phase*** was completely aware
ABF claims the smoke detector wiring for the lower level was installed and that my contractor removed them during demo*** ***, disputes this claimI believe *** especially since ** *** * *** is a very reputable and professional companyIn an effort to help me, my contractor removed portions of the floor above the location where ***, ABF's technician, says the wire should beUpon removal of the floor in a number of areas, there was no indication of any wiring*** ***'s photos prior to drywall show no evidence of wiringIn addition, the new company I contracted with to install the wire showed me where my floor joist run a direction where it would be obvious if the wires had existed*** with ABF claims that *** has photos of his wiringI asked for her to forward them to me and she has never produced the photos which would have cleared up any question of the wiring being there.ABF was unable to install the missing wiring after four weeks of patiently and politely askingYet, in less than an hour, my new security company was able to complete the work.This company has a problem with communication. Clearly evident with the way no one told me their tech changed my alarm security code, failed to call in a rough inspection, and failed the simple task of installing the missing wiring.No homeowner should be give such a hard time when it comes to security and peace of mind of their family and peace of mindI am a newly single mother of two young childrenABF has caused me a lot of anxiety and stress with the way they treated meOther homeowners should us caution in dealing with this company.Thank you for the opportunity to make this statement.Sincerely,*** ***
Sincerely,
Karinn Granger

We called the customer May and May and left messages, but have not received a responseWe have relieved the customer of his contract

Revdex.com Case# ***
American Burglary and Fire Response to *** ***
The ABF contract is alleged by the customer to be misleadingA copy of the contract is included in this response for the Revdex.com to review and examineThe security systems at this site included a
burglary/fire/carbon monoxide system and a closed circuit TV system
Good business practices require that we always work under contractNo monitoring services are performed unless there is an agreement evidenced in writing for the protection of the customer and ensure that ABF provide the agreed level of serviceThe complaint states that during the meeting there was never a verbal discussion regarding a five (5) year agreementAt the same time the customer never inquired to the length of contractIf there was a concern or question raised about the length of contract, we certainly would have discussed it forthrightly and honestlyHowever, no such question was raised, and the customer by law had ample time to review the contract after he signed the agreementThat the customer did not elect to read what he signed, cannot be our responsibilityFurthermore, it is impossible for the salesperson to anticipate what any customer will raise as an objection laterThe term of contract is not hidden, but is on the front of the contract as the first line of paragraph #labeled TERM OF AGREEMENT in bold capital letters
It is unfortunate that a specific portion of the contract, which has now become important to this particular customer, is not highlighted to his specificationsOther customers may in their circumstances want other aspects of the contract highlighted such as limitation of liability and testing requirementsTo so anticipate the potential demands of thousands of our customers could easily create a situation where all, or nearly all, of the contract would have to be written in bold typeAccordingly, what is written is in clear type in cogent paragraphs with bold font headings
Indeed the customer by signing a five (5) year agreement locked his monthly monitoring price for that period of timeIn so doing, ABF is able to take into consideration the five year agreement when calculating the installation cost of new equipmentAccordingly, when the customer receives the benefit of installation when combined with a five year alarm agreement, we find it disingenuous that he should complain about the beneficial agreement as he freely signedA reasonable customer expecting to live long term at the residence in question would find it sensible and desirable to be under contract for future services to be rendered at a set price and to obtain the best installation priceThat this customer alleges this as poor business practice is in our opinion unreasonable and self serving
Our contract is typical of the industry throughout North AmericaIn fact this same contract is used by many security companies across the United StatesEntering into an agreement for alarm monitoring services can be a complex event as there are many legal issues with regard to liability as well as the inherent issues concerning alarm systems that are custom designed, installed and monitoredThe verbiage of the contract is such because the agreement requires the understanding to be complete and in writing for the benefit of both partiesThat is why I informed the customer when he arguably broke the agreement, that our contract is a valid legal document that has been upheld in court
With regard to the customer's statement that the CFO asked his staff, "Does the customer understand that he is under contract?, we wonder what the concern isThat is a legitimate question to ensure that all parties understand the situation created by the customer prematurely and without warning disconnecting service and breaching the contractHad that question not been asked, the customer could just as easily have complained that he was not reminded that he was under contractIn essence the customer could be setting up a potential argument that ABF is wrong either way
The customer in essence is admitting in his complaint that he never read the contractHe contended that he never signed a five (5) year agreement and evidently did not retain the copy that was presented to him at the time of signingABF out of professional courtesy provided him with a true and exact copy of the contract and the complete record of monitored signals for his site, which is digitally retained in our automated monitoring station archives
The installation mentioned by the customer was for a closed circuit TV system, which we installed in September This new closed circuit TV system was independent of the existing security alarm system, which was installed by others and which was previously monitored by ABF
Our salesman told the customer that he would be able to view images from the closed circuit TV system in his home and remotely on his smart phone through an internet connectionWe planned on using his existing DSL service for the internet connectionAfter we installed the system, the customer informed us that he did not want to use the DSL service for the connectionRather, he insisted on using a satellite internet service that was incompatibleWe were eventually able to provide remote access to cameras located inside the house, but no connectivity was possible for cameras outside the houseWe repeatedly called to schedule an appointment to attempt to solve the satellite internet connection problem but were either delayed by the customer or our calls were not returnedReportedly, in the meantime the customer changed internet providers, which complicated the situationIn early the customer complained to us that he could not view the images from cameras as promised, as if we had not made attempts to contact himAccordingly, in March our installation manager visited the customer on site to correct the situation as a no charge, warranty itemThe customer had a separate modem and router that were not furnished or installed by us and that were maintained by the customerThese devices were in conflict with each other, as the IP addresses were mismatched by othersOur installation manager diagnosed and corrected the IP address conflict on the customer's equipmentHe then tested the closed circuit TV system locally and remotely in the presence of the homeownerAt that time the remote access for cameras located inside the house was restored and tested properlyEven though the IP mismatch was not our fault there was no charge for this service callWe were never able to make the satellite connection for the phones as he demanded, even though a DSL connection would have solved the problemThis apparently is the primary reason the customer complaint says the installation did not go well
Subsequently, there were no more calls for service from the customer
To the best of our knowledge any problems with the separate security alarm system were never brought to our attentionAccording to the complaint, the security system interfered with the operation of his gateWe were never called to assist with any correction that may or may not have been appropriateWithout consulting with us, the customer on his own accord physically disconnected the alarm system from his landline phone serviceThis severed any connection from the alarm systemFor some reason he assumed we would know that he had taken that actionThe alarm system is designed as a passive system as most residential alarm systems areThat is the system does not send a periodic test signal to the monitoring station to verify connectionWe had no way of knowing that he had cut the connectionAccordingly, we never called the customer as he expected to notify him that his phone connection had been severedAs a result the customer, without discussing the matter with us, decided to seek another alarm company to monitor his systemHe considered it to be our fault for not being aware that he cut his own line
We have for several years offered wireless connectivity from alarm systems directly to our monitoring stationUnlike the passive landline systems as this customer has used, the wireless connection does provide for a daily connection test, which notifies our monitoring station of a problemIt should be noted that a wireless connection carries a higher monthly fee than a landline connectionAlthough we routinely upgrade existing land line systems with wireless connectivity and furnish new systems with the same, the customer claims that we told him clearly that we do not offer such serviceI find no evidence that he ever asked anyone at ABF about a daily test of his alarm system or about wireless connectivity
In summary, ABF provided the customer with a written contract, which he did not readThe customer failed to notify ABF of changes in equipment that he owned and maintainedABF at our expense fixed the problem caused by that equipmentThe customer did not consult with ABF about problems that he had with the alarm system, and took it upon himself to disconnect without consideration of how the system is designed to operateThrough all of this the customer held us responsible and found fault with our professionalismAfter we agreed on a mutually acceptable settlement to amicably part ways, the customer filed this complaint with the Revdex.com to in his own words "to insure that when people look for a home security provider, they understand your contractual practices"*** Contract.pdf)

We obtained the customer information through court proceedings Attached to this response is the Certificate of Ownership of Certain Fire Alarm Customers Accounts I spoke with the customer on June and told him that we would refund his payment of $and will no longer receive
invoices from us The issue was addressed when I spoke with him The customer also called on June to address the same complaint at which time I told him that I spoke with him on Monday, June and the request for a refund had been given to our accounting department to process

Initial Business Response /* (1000, 10, 2015/08/06) */
ABF received by email a request for pricing for a new security system. Our scheduler [redacted] called the number listed on the email which was [redacted] ([redacted]'s Mother, who is a ABF Customer)during the conversation it was documented...

that is was rental property and the owner said the security install was approved and it was also documented the term of the agreement was 3 years. [redacted] sceduled a date and time for me to meet with [redacted] at the home. During our conversation at [redacted] home we discussed the term again,I changed our agreement from 5 years to 3 years, it was also discussed the system could be moved to a new location if they moved. Prior to [redacted] signing the agreement I was told she had authorization from her daughter to take care of this process for her. I have since spoken to [redacted] about the term of this agreement and she said she does recall our conversation about moving the system if they decided to move.(This conversation was recorded on our business line) We have also asked that we be allowed to gain entry to the location to remove our equipment. I actually met with [redacted] after the system was installed to demonstrate the operation of the system to her, I again discussed with her if she decided to move we could move the equipment for her.
[redacted] a ABF customer, I had no reason to believe [redacted] would not follow through with the terms of the agreement. I made sure it was very clear.
[redacted]
ABF Sales Department

ABF regrets that Ms. [redacted] is rejecting our response to her initial complaint.  Obviously, we will not see eye to eye on this matter, but we would like to address her statements briefly.1. While most communication went through Ms. [redacted], ABF still had to work with the contractor in regards to moved, cut, and missing wires.  In fact, when ABF went to remove the temporary system, some of our devices were missing and Ms. [redacted]'s response was that the contractor must have removed or thrown them away.  While Ms. [redacted] states that ABF had poor communication, it seems there was poor communication between Ms. [redacted] and her renovations contractor since our parts were missing.2. ABF maintains that the smoke detector wiring was ran.  The contractor expected us to remove flooring in order to re-wire another smoke detector.  ABF does not remove flooring as we are not that type of contractor.We did not intentionally give Ms. [redacted] a hard time. We did the best we could under the circumstances of her renovations.  Again, our goal is to always make our customers happy.  We wish Ms. [redacted] well with her renovations and hope she has peace of mind with her new security company.

(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
I am answering this compliant response by paragraph as ABF's response was quite lengthy as well as rather disingenuous.
In regards to:
Paragraph 2 ABF states "Good business practices require that we always work under contract. No monitoring services are performed unless there is an agreement evidenced in writing for the protection of the customer and ensure that ABF provide the agreed level of service. The complaint states that during the meeting there was never a verbal discussion regarding a five (5) year agreement. At the same time the customer never inquired to the length of contract" In my original complaint I as well stated that I felt a contract necessary to ensure proper protection of my home, that being said, a contract of any length should be clarified by the salesman he and I understand the constraints of my service, this is just good business practice. I beg the reader to notice that here the five is both written and numeric for clarification.
Paragraph 3; I don't feel there is any need to expand upon this, it merely states that it is the salesman's obligation the clarify the terms of the agreement since all of the contract can't be bold. In essence confirming my claim that if the important obligations are not bolded each paragraph should require initials, if clarity was their concern.
Paragraph 4; I have three points, 1. As attached I have included the prop for my installation, I would like to see what the cost reduction is considering (when under contract) labor hours are clearly stated at what appears to be a low level tech normal billing rate and the fact that it was a prewired installation, as stated. 2. As a reasonable customer, I would challenge ABF to find a contract of that length (with or without equipment provided) in this field. 3. As to the self-serving comment, of course it is, as is the lengthy discourse they provided to them.
Paragraph 5 and 6; no comment, the length and content speak for themselves.
Paragraph 7; ah paragraph 7, never once did I claim I did not sign the contract, I stated that with the big zeros (0) written all around the paragraph in question, I never saw the normal font saying five (5) years. And the ABF rep never mentioned it to say otherwise would be incorrect.
Paragraph 8; since their extensive monitoring complex retains important contractual data I would like to see the phone records of their calls to me vice mine to them concerning the issues with both hardware and software. It is my guess that you will see many more unreturned calls from me than from them. The communication issues are why their service manager (official title unknown) Mr. [redacted] needed to be engaged to fix all of my concerns. I believe I have the email the was sent to me by ABF's [redacted] with the software package associated with the camera equipment THEY provided since he was to busy to come install it. After numerous complaints from me, both of the aforementioned individuals did come out and I had to help them with my router configuration, all the while hearing about their need to hurry off to other appointments.
There is more but I feel it unnecessary to comment as it is a longwinded rehash of the previous paragraphs, but I do want to say that I wrote to "insure that when people look for a home security provider, they understand your contractual practices" because I expected their response to be as it was, useless.
In closing I have one more question, how do you part amicably when you had to buy out a contract for 650 dollars for nothing in return when the cost to them was zero dollars and really just a lost client? Add to that the fact that the quality of service during the contract enforcement period was at best suspect and at worst negligent. I say negligent as the fact that the house power input monitoring limitation was NEVER discussed at contract signing. Before, and even more so now, I feel my buy-out monies should be refunded. If not to the letter of contractual law, than by reasonable standards I should not have to pay for services not received.

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Sincerely,
[redacted]

I HAVE READ  AND I AM SATISFIED  , ONLY WHEN I GET MY MONEY BACK I WILL BE SATISFIED , YOU KNOW HOW THEY LIE , WILL LET YOU KNOW WHEN I GET MY MONEY BACK

Attached is ABF's response to Ms. [redacted]'s complaint.

The Delay in disconnection was inadvertent.  Company policy was met with the emailed request to cancel services.  A less experienced staff member thought it was required to speak live to the customer.  Subsequently, this was identified as a training issue and corrected.  The...

disconnection was made immediately and a refund was promptly made to the customer's credit card.  I called the customer to ensure satisfaction and closure.  We regret this inconvenience.  This person has been an excellent customer.  [redacted]Controller

After reviewing the documentation involved in this matter, we believe that based on the signed agreement with [redacted], we went above and beyond by allowing the client to cancel her services.  Our contract states that “The initial term of this Agreement is one year from the date each system...

is installed and becomes operative and thereafter for consecutive terms of one year until such time as either party upon 30 days written notice advises the other party of its intent to terminate the Agreement at the end of the then current term.”  Ms. [redacted] called to cancel services on November 15, 2016 which were paid through December 31, 2016.  We only required Ms. [redacted] to give us a thirty (30) day notice of cancellation.  We did refund Ms. [redacted] $13.71 for prepaid services from December 15 – December 31.

They did sign a contract with our company, they signed a five year agreement clearly stated in the contract. The contract clearly states to read entire contract before signing. The contact was signed without any additional questions to the terms of the contract. At no time did they tell us the...

length of the lease agreement they were in with the facility they occupied . The person that signed the contract is listed with the Missouri Secretary of State as managing member. We would have no reason to believe a ,managing member of the company would not realize what he was signing. He never asked for any clarification on any part of the contract he signed. The express problem she had with our system, had no effect on the alarm signal, the signal was always working as it is designed to, the problem was in regards to open and closed reports that the customer requested, that was not included in the price. That was always an option for them to add, however we never received a request for that service. As an accommodation we provided open and closed reports for this customer . The report we provided them was incorrect due to date and time setting within the system. This was immediately corrected upon our knowledge of the error. Unfortunately there was no way for us to retroactively correct reports that were already submitted before the settings were corrected. We did provide them with instructions on how to manually adjust the report to show the correct date and times. The system was leased, so we owned and maintained the equipment . Without our permission someone came in and removed the equipment and never returned it to our company, this is in direct violation of the agreements within the contract,which prohibits others from tampering or removing the equipment. The reason for them discontinuing the service was for not receiving a report that was not part of their contract . We feel that this was not just cause to cancel a service,nor to breach their contract  with our company. Our Sales Manager for this consumer, Is no long with our company due to moving out of state, therefore we can not confirm the communications between the two. Our sales manager was very reliable and professional by the time our Sales Manager turned this account over internal collections had turned this account over to our currant Sales Manager the consumer had already switched to another provider, at this point we had to turn the account over to a third party collection service.