Cascade Windows

response to complaint ID of [redacted] We are sorry that Mrs [redacted] is having problems with her windowsAfter she talked to DJ she also talked to me.I understand her disappointment, but it was explained that we are now honoring the EPW warranty as it is writtenHer warranty included free replacement glass but not the labor to install itThe company that she purchased the windows through (EPW) changed their warranty in to include laborShe has been given both warranty copies so that she could see the warranty she purchased as well as the change.For several years Cascade honored the EPW warranty with labor as we mistakenly thought is was the same as our ownIt was pointed out to us late last year that it was not the same and that labor was not includedUpon learning that, Cascade changed to honor the warranty as writtenWe do the same for EPW's and later warranty and include labor with that.Many people benefited from our mistake and received free labor from us as we over-honored the warranty, but we have to fix our mistakes as we recognize them and we have done so.To help Mrs [redacted] find labor to install the replacement glass, DJ has produced a short list of potential vendors for her and to help her further I will waive the $fee we normally charge to field measure the failed glass.I hope this is satisfactory so we can move forward and get here windows fixedRegards,Miles S*Warranty manager

Revdex.com: I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] , and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me Sincerely, [redacted] ***

Mr [redacted] , this is getting old and what seems logical to you is not a fact in the real world of windows and glassIf a window is dropped flat, the chances are the glass will break and the corners will remain intactHowever, if a window is dropped on its corner, the corner will break, but most likely the glass will not as it is suspended in the glazing pocket by foam glazing tape and soft durometer setting blocksIt is not touching the frame and does not receive the same shock impact when dropped like the frame corner itselfYou are right that a welded corner is considered as strong as the rest of the extrusion, but shock/impact is its worst enemy.I am not aware of the history of your original order and cannot comment on itHowever, if they had been repaired with new glass as sent back to you as you said, you had hours to report a problemGlass can have micro-fractures along its edges because of the way it is cut with a wheelVinyl cannot as it is molten when it is joined/weldedVinyl is cut 1/4” longer than the desired window size and any potential flaws in the corner miter cuts are gone after 1/8” of material is melted and fused by heat at each corner.As I said before, Cascade Windows goes out of their way to resolve issues that are manufacturing defects and this does not fall in that category.My previous offer still stands Although we do not market and sell this product line anymore, I can sell Mr [redacted] a new replacement sash at our costIt is a painted window and will have significant lead-time, but if he would like to purchase a replacement he can contact me for detailsHowever, since we do not manufacture this product, supplies are limited and once they are gone they are gone for good and I will no longer stand behind this offer.Miles S***

To: Revdex.comConcerning: Complaint [redacted] From: Miles S***-Service/Warranty Mgr@ Cascade WindowsI have looked into [redacted] concerns and I find no basis for a complaintWe have an active service order and the customer was made aware early in the process that due to limited technicians in the area and the volume of business, the two step process (investigation and acquisition of replacement glass) may take to weeksThe [redacted] investigation was completed earlier and they were scheduled for last Friday 10-to be completed Unfortunately, there was a problem with the glass being delivered from Spokane and they were given the option to get done what we could or to wait until the final pane came in and get it done all at onceThey chose the second option and we will reschedule as soon as the glass is confirmed available and in good shape which should be early this week.Again, I apologize for the time it has taken, but at no time have we given them reason to suspect we weren’t going to stand behind our warranty and take care of this issue.Miles S*Service and Warranty Mgr.509-789-

[redacted] ,We are sorry that you are having difficulty with your windows and that you received the wrong components. I am out of the office today, but hope to be back tomorrow so I can investigate the details of what you ask for and what we sent. Please realize the the "Lifetime... Warranty" that you purchased stated that it covered factory and material defects. Components like the balances you described that have given nearly 20 years of good service would be neither a factory defect or a material issue. It is more like the belts and tires on your car that wear out over time. Normal "wear and tear" is not covered under the warranty, but maybe we don't make it clear to the homeowner that we send do components at "no charge" when we can as an act of good will, not a requirement of the warranty. We do not build the EPW products and do not carry the wide variety of balance components that they apparently carried. However, we should have parts close enough to the original size to make them work. As soon as I am back in the office I will look into this for you and see what we can do. Miles S*Service and Warranty Manager

Complaint: [redacted] I am rejecting this response because:information had to be requested several times before we were given all paperwork. Three times we have requested a supervisor call us and we still have not received a phone call. We now understand that the windows are no longer under warranty. It never should have taken so long to get our question resolved and to still not have a phone call from a supervisor is not ok. Sincerely, [redacted] And [redacted]

Was sold a Cascade Window with a bead crack under the frame. According to two separate people who worked install the glass into the frames, the resulting cracks were caused by this defect. It took three months of trying to even get a response. And then I was told that it was my fault for installing it with the crack in the window. This is hidden under the frame. Poor customer service. Poor quality. And horrible communications.

Complaint: ***I am rejecting this response because:
I don’t agree with Mr*** on his conclusion that window was “mishandled, dropped or hit in some way”. I know for the fact that I didn’t do it and if the contractor who installed this widow have done this it would be obvious right away not after years. Furthermore, I can’t even imagine how it is possible to drop or hit the window and break durable plastic frame but not fragile glass inside the window. I think physically it is impossible. In my opinion it is clear manufacturer defect and no more than that and it has to be covered under advertised “Lifetime warranty” of the product.
Sincerely,
*** ***

Subject: ID ***Regarding complaint ID ***, the window was replaced today, Sept7, 2016. Thank you,*** ***

To: Revdex.com
Concerning: Complaint ***
From: Miles S***-Service/Warranty Mgr@ Cascade Windows
I have looked into Mr*** *** complaint and I am embarrassed that we have had so much difficulty in satisfactorily closing his request for a relatively simple service
repair
I sincerely apologize and without airing our laundry I will say that Cascade has made multiple mistakes both in order entry and delivery in our effort to get the new product to our Third Party Vendor so they could do the workThis was in no way a fault of our partner doing the work, Glass Services, as they also have communicated with us trying to get the product they need for this job
That being said, we are on this today and I will be monitoring the progressOur plan is to have the glass delivered to Glass Services this Thursday Sept They have been informed of this and will be fitting the reglaze into their schedule as soon as possible
Again, I apologize for what has gone before and will do our best to remedy Mr*** glass issue to his satisfaction
Miles S***
Service and Warranty Mgr
509-789-

Ms***,I don't know what you read, but it is wrongThe warranty of our recently acquired facility in Tempe AZ does not have a lifetime warranty, but that does not come into play hereIf you had bought Cascade Windows in Oregon rather than EPW, we would not be having this discussionIt is clear in Cascades warranty that labor is coveredIn EPW's warranty it is clear that it is not.As I explained earlier, your products do not have a material or factory defect and that is what was covered in the warrantyYou have had many years of good serviceDoes the auto manufacturer give you labor to replace belts and tires that have worn out? At least the EPW warranty does give you the component.We as a company have a right to fix and not repeat our mistakes and we have done this by honoring the warranty as it is written beginning JanYour understanding that our owners that bought us a year and a half ago had anything to do with the warranty interpretation is also wrong. We have not provided labor for EPW products in the year 2017, except for those that claims were submitted late in The first of this year was our cutoff point to follow the warranty as written.We stand by the EPW warranty as written and are willing to supply replacement units to your installer of choice. Miles S*Service/Warranty MGR

We are sorry that the homeowner is having issues with their glass, however, we have went over their applicable warranty with them a couple times prior to them filing this complaint. A copy of the warranty was provided to themThe transfer clause in the warranty at the time of their
purchase (2008) was five years from the time of purchase. The year transfer clause did not appear in the warranty untill They did not purchase this warrantyThis warranty is listed on our website as it is the governing warranty for current purchases. Again, we are sorry for their issue, but the product is clearly out of warranty and not supported

We sympathize with Mr*** and his failed glass problems,but a lifetime warranty is only good as long as the company promoting it continues to exist.LBL went out of business In and Cascade windows completed an "asset buyout only" of LBL in that same year.We did not buy the
company or Its liabilities,therefore, we do not have an obligation to warrant LBL products during the time of his window purchase in This was clearly explained to Mr***.We do not manufacture the LBL products and do not have the components to service themMuch of the equipment obtained In the buyout was modified to manufacture Cascade products.Mr*** cited a window industry magazine article that he had found on the internet that called the buyout a "merger"We can't control the internet and the article does not represent the way the purchase of LBL was structured
Miles S***
Service/Warranty MGRCascade Windows

Mr***,We are sorry you are having issues with the glass in your windows. The warranty you are reading online is our current warrantyIn the first paragraph it says that it applies to all product purchased on or after Jan 1, 2015. I have attached a copy of the warranty that was in
force at the time of the purchase of the original owners and the transfer-ability coverage of the windows at that time was limited years from the date of the original purchase as stated by DJ. Again, I apologize that you are having issues, but in fact your warranty has expired. Miles S*Service and Warranty manager

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me
However, I would not have filed a complaint if the logic and justification about warranty satisfaction had been explained to me earlier
Sincerely,
*** ***

Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because:When a company makes a lifetime warranty on their product and puts it back on the customer to do their own leg work and cannot provide an installer "who will actually install a window sent to them" that leaves the customer with a bad window, and no information. The consumer is not the expert on windows This is poor customer service. You are not standing behind your product and to "interpret" the language used in the warranty as such is a disservice to the consumer. I will ask once again for you to honor what I see at the intent of a warranty and my original request
Sincerely,
*** ***

Again, I am sorry you have window issues, but the question was resolved and someone on the receiving end wanted to push for a different answer. This was not a difficult decision and did not need to be elevated to another level to get the same answer. Regards,

I have attached my response to Mr***'s complaint #***
To: Revdex.comConcerning: Complaint ***From: Miles S***-Service/Warranty Mgr@ Cascade WindowsI have looked into Mr***’s complaint and must agree with our company’s decision on the warranty, however, I am disappointed we
didn’t go a little farther to try to help him out.We did do an investigation into the matterThat was the purpose of the photos that he obligingly sent to usThe welded corners of a window sash don’t just spontaneously break after several years of service and in this case more than one corner is brokenA pressure break that could possibly be created by workmanship, usually happens immediately and is a fine crackIn this case, it is evident by the explosiveness and jaggedness of the breaks that the product was mishandled, dropped or hit in some wayOur warranty covers factory defects and not damage incurred from others.This window series has not been manufactured by us for several years and the Cascade employees that investigated the warranty request last year apparently did not take the extra step to offer any assistance once it was determined not to be a warrantable break.I, however, checked with our plant and although we no longer have components to make the whole window, I can offer to sell Mr*** a new replacement sash at our costIt is a painted window and will have significant lead-time, but if he would like to purchase a replacement he can contact me for details.Miles S*Service and Warranty Mgr.509-***cascadewindows.com

Complaint: [redacted]
I am rejecting this response because: Mr. S[redacted], In your response, you stated that “it is clear in Cascades warranty that labor is covered.  In EPW’s warranty it is clear that it is not”.  The wording in our warranty for the Empire Pacific Windows states “repair or replace”, that wording means there is labor involved and it is covered.  We know that because before Cascade Windows bought Empire Pacific Windows, Empire Pacific replaced defective windows with no charge to us, the consumer.  They honored the warranty as written and as it was intended.  It is obvious that Cascade Windows prefers to distort the warranty to their benefit and not honor their commitment to the consumer. You are wrong in stating that our windows do not have a material or factory defect.  Our warranty explicitly covers defects in materials or workmanship that would cause an obstruction of view due to dust or moisture.  Below is the exact wording of the warranty that came with our windows: “EMPIRE PACIFIC WINDOWS warrants it will repair or replace at its option any EMPIRE PACIFIC product that is defective in materials or workmanship for the life of the home.  EMPIRE PACIFIC warrants that the original sealed units in the EMPIRE PACIFIC WINDOWS in your single family, owner occupied dwelling will be free from defects in materials or workmanship that would cause an obstruction of view due to dust or moisture. “ Also, Mr. S[redacted], your analogy “Does the auto manufacturer give you labor to replace belts and tires that have worn out?”  My auto manufacturer honors the warranty for the timeframe specified and does not charge labor on defective parts and they do not change the warranty after a consumer purchases their product.  If an auto maker tried to do that, it would be all over the evening news, and every consumer advocacy group would be reacting. Mr. S[redacted], your company does not have the right to change a warranty of a product after it’s purchased.  As you stated, “We as a company have a right to fix and not repeat our mistakes and we have done this by honoring the warranty as it is written beginning Jan. 1, 2017”.  Sir, we purchased our windows in the year 2000, you cannot make a change to our warranty in 2017, that is against the law. Cascade Windows has committed unlawful trade practices in the State of Oregon and as a consumer we have been victimized by these practices.  Cascade Windows is in breach of contract on the Empire Pacific Windows warranty.  This issue, could be remedied by Cascade Windows honoring the warranty as it was intended to include labor along with materials in the repair and replacement of defective windows.
Sincerely,
[redacted]

Complaint: [redacted]I am rejecting this response because:
Looks like Mr. [redacted] stuck in his imaginary “world of windows and glass” and does not want to accept simple laws of physics.   Mr. [redacted] needs to understand and accept that anything could have defects. I am tired to prove that Mr. S[redacted]’s theory does not make much sense and does not have any evidences other that his words.
I will not accept Mr. S[redacted]’s offers because I already paid for the window and a lifetime warranty.  I do not want to pay for another window that can fail again within few years.  I simple don’t trust this company’s quality and their warranty promises anymore.
Bottom line, I purchased the window with a lifetime warranty that failed after 4 years of using it and manufacturer failed to fulfill their advertised promise to take care of their product.  On my part, I never dropped this window and I believe if the installer had dropped this window during installation, I would notice it right away, not after 4 years. Sincerely,[redacted]