El Paso Concrete Works

Initial Business Response / [redacted] (1000, 5, 2015/07/23) */ Customer had approved the size and dimensions and shape of this project before pouringCustomer had picked a set of colors from a palate and a color from said palate was usedAll contractual obligations were met and the size, dimensions, color, and design were all approved prior to pouringThe project was poured to code and industry standardIt met all requirements set forth by the customerThere is nothing I can do if customer chooses to not be satisfied with there own choicesCustomer picked colors from a color palate all of which would have cured close to the sameI was not presented with any pictures or examples of how this cuustomer wantedthew finishThe only term used was a "tan" colorWhich was poured and which is considered tanThe customer also notified me prior to pouring that she and her husband were o.k and fully satisfied with how the framing had been setCustomer was told that the finished dimensions would be less or more than specified in contract due to how far our form could bend without snappingSo everything was formed then customer approved said forms and expressed that she was satisfied how forms were laid outSo we el Paso concrete works will not assume any responsibility for a project that was approved.In terms of shape and size and colorNow if the customer is not satisfied with there own choicesThere is nothing we can doMaybe the customer did not communicate exactly what she wantedApparently what she wanted was something "tan"She was given a tan porchAnd what she had in mind was not tan because we provided tan and she is not happyAnd without a picture or physical representation of what she wantedWe went by the term tanWhich in the cement industry is what we pouredWe strive to provide a quality product that follows code and we strive to keep and uphold the industry standardBut there is nothing we can do when a customer approved a project and chooses to be dissatisfied after what they envisioned and what they communicate is differentAnd we el Paso concrete were instructed to not communicate with the customer unless to Adress her complaintsWell we still needed to return to her property to do final cuts to said porchBut since we aren't allowed to communicate with the customer in order to gain permission to eneter the property the porches warranty has been void for this reason Initial Consumer Rebuttal / [redacted] (3000, 7, 2015/07/24) */ (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.) I chose colors I would be happy with off of a palate sheet of approximately If what Mr [redacted] says is appropriate business practice, then he could have chosen any off of that sheet and I was supposed to be happy with that? And if that's the case, why even show me color options!? He acknowledges that I picked colors, but then reports I was too vauge by saying "tan"I picked colors from a sheet he provided! How much clearer could I be in relation to what I was agreeable to? I showed him colors I would have been happy with, and he picked one that had "brick" added, and was darker WITHOUT asking my approval Additionally, the contract said 24xI have a picture of thatThe patio I received was 21xThis is unacceptableI thought that mr [redacted] would honor his contract and give me a product that met that, so when I was asked how the frame work completed at the time looked, I assumed it was to the dimentions he agreed toHe never told me it would be smallerIf he had, then I would have INSISTED on a contract renegotiationWhy would I pay the same price for a smaller product?! That makes no sense Final Business Response / [redacted] (4000, 10, 2015/07/29) */ Customerpickers colors from a book containing a total .Of colorsShe approved a set amount of colors and was not satisfied with her choiceAnd the customer was told that the dimensions of the pation would have a possibility of being smaller or larger depending on how far our boards could bendThe customer had approved all dimensions sizes shapes and colors prior to pouring We will not provide a refund on the grounds that a customer is not happy with what they approved and picked No attempt will be made by El Paso concrete to refund any amount of money to this customerYou can't just have concrete done and expect to make a simple complaint and get a refundEspecially when the job is done right, to code, and to the industry standardAnd approved by the customer .Through our many years of experience and just by using common sense.We at el Paso concrete know that once concrete is poured it is permanentWe have never and do not plan to ever pour any of our jobs without getting full consent and approval from our customers regarding size dimension and colorsSo it is absurd to think we would risk a dollar patio by making our own descisions without pre approval by all our customers .It's one thing to get a complaint over quality which we have never gottenBut color choice and shapeWe have never and will never pour concrete without approval by customersIf that was the case we would be getting complaints left and rightAny one using common sennse can tell this is a poor attempt to get free concrete workSo without any viable and reasonable complaintEl Paso concrete will be ignoring any further attempts by this customer to get free concrete work on the grounds that we decided to in the first time in years just go and do whatever we wantIt's not how we operate and not how any good concrete contractor operatesOur long flawless track record with quality of product will speak for itself

We covered it late so the covers will not scratch the surfaceAnd as for the first nightThe exothermic reaction known as curing keeps it warmWe could of covered it earlierBut then we would be dealing with a complaint about the surface being scratched by coversThere is nothing more that could have been done to pour this concrete in cold weatherAll precautionary measures were takenWe could do the driveway more timesAnd we would handle it the same way every timeAnd our quality of work and how we handle cold weather pouring should not be in questionother driveways look goodDone around the same timeSince there is no definite proof of why it spalledWhich is salt in most casesWe will not warranty the workWithout definite proof that we are at faultWe cannot warranty the workConcrete was poured at a good timeConcrete was coveredAnd only this one of is badIt's safe to say this was not labor relatedWe have covered plenty of slabs at midnight after a pourAnd those are in great conditionWe believe the customer applied salt to his driveway after the pour during the following snow stormsAnd that is most likely what made the concrete spall

Due to the time of the year in which the concrete was pouredOur warranties only cover extreme cases of cracking and spalling due to the concrete being bad or the concrete being finished improperlyAs the customer explainedother driveways were poured around that timeAll given including his
The same attention to detail and the same quality products and prep workWe are sorry to say but our warranties do not cover acts of GodAnd that is because many other factors play in when pouring in cold climateThe driving over colorado roads and picking up salt with your vehicle then it touching the surface of the concrete could have been the problemBut since there is no definitive proof that we had something to do with the spallingBut there is definitive proof of the quality of work that we did done around the same timeAt this time we will be offering no replacement of his drivewayMinor spalling can be due to many things of which our company is not at faultExtreme cases fall under warranty and are immediately taken care of and repaired or replacedWe have seen the driveway and the current state in which it is inAnd as of right now we believe that it does not fall under warranty

Initial Business Response /* (1000, 5, 2015/07/23) */
Customer had approved the size and dimensions and shape of this project before pouring. Customer had picked a set of colors from a palate and a color from said palate was used. All contractual obligations were met and the size, dimensions,...

color, and design were all approved prior to pouring. The project was poured to code and industry standard. It met all requirements set forth by the customer. There is nothing I can do if customer chooses to not be satisfied with there own choices. Customer picked colors from a 6 color palate all of which would have cured close to the same. I was not presented with any pictures or examples of how this cuustomer wantedthew finish. The only term used was a "tan" color. Which was poured and which is considered tan. The customer also notified me prior to pouring that she and her husband were o.k and fully satisfied with how the framing had been set. Customer was told that the finished dimensions would be less or more than specified in contract due to how far our form could bend without snapping. So everything was formed then customer approved said forms and expressed that she was satisfied how forms were laid out. So we el Paso concrete works will not assume any responsibility for a project that was approved.In terms of shape and size and color. Now if the customer is not satisfied with there own choices. There is nothing we can do. Maybe the customer did not communicate exactly what she wanted. Apparently what she wanted was something "tan". She was given a tan porch. And what she had in mind was not tan because we provided tan and she is not happy. And without a picture or physical representation of what she wanted. We went by the term tan. Which in the cement industry is what we poured. We strive to provide a quality product that follows code and we strive to keep and uphold the industry standard. But there is nothing we can do when a customer approved a project and chooses to be dissatisfied after what they envisioned and what they communicate is different. And we el Paso concrete were instructed to not communicate with the customer unless to Adress her complaints. Well we still needed to return to her property to do final cuts to said porch. But since we aren't allowed to communicate with the customer in order to gain permission to eneter the property the porches warranty has been void for this reason.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 7, 2015/07/24) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
I chose 6 colors I would be happy with off of a palate sheet of approximately 30. If what Mr [redacted] says is appropriate business practice, then he could have chosen any off of that sheet and I was supposed to be happy with that? And if that's the case, why even show me color options!? He acknowledges that I picked 6 colors, but then reports I was too vauge by saying "tan". I picked 6 colors from a sheet he provided! How much clearer could I be in relation to what I was agreeable to? I showed him colors I would have been happy with, and he picked one that had "brick" added, and was darker WITHOUT asking my approval.
Additionally, the contract said 24x13. I have a picture of that. The patio I received was 21x13.. This is unacceptable. I thought that mr [redacted] would honor his contract and give me a product that met that, so when I was asked how the frame work completed at the time looked, I assumed it was to the dimentions he agreed to. He never told me it would be smaller. If he had, then I would have INSISTED on a contract renegotiation. Why would I pay the same price for a smaller product?! That makes no sense.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 10, 2015/07/29) */
Customerpickers colors from a book containing a total .Of 60 colors. She approved a set amount of colors and was not satisfied with her choice. And the customer was told that the dimensions of the pation would have a possibility of being smaller or larger depending on how far our boards could bend. The customer had approved all dimensions sizes shapes and colors prior to pouring . We will not provide a refund on the grounds that a customer is not happy with what they approved and picked . No attempt will be made by El Paso concrete to refund any amount of money to this customer. You can't just have concrete done and expect to make a simple complaint and get a refund. Especially when the job is done right, to code, and to the industry standard. And approved by the customer .Through our many years of experience and just by using common sense.We at el Paso concrete know that once concrete is poured it is permanent. We have never and do not plan to ever pour any of our jobs without getting full consent and approval from our customers regarding size dimension and colors. So it is absurd to think we would risk a 4200.00 dollar patio by making our own descisions without pre approval by all our customers .It's one thing to get a complaint over quality which we have never gotten. But color choice and shape. We have never and will never pour concrete without approval by customers. If that was the case we would be getting complaints left and right. Any one using common sennse can tell this is a poor attempt to get free concrete work. So without any viable and reasonable complaint. El Paso concrete will be ignoring any further attempts by this customer to get free concrete work on the grounds that we decided to in the first time in 20 years just go and do whatever we want. It's not how we operate and not how any good concrete contractor operates. Our long flawless track record with quality of product will speak for itself.

Complaint: [redacted]
I am rejecting this response because:I reject the contractor's response of 4/17/17. First, I adamantly reject his accusation, without a shred of evidence, that I used salt as a deicer on my driveway. He insinuates that I am the one at fault for the spalling of my driveway. For the record, in my 42+ years of owning this property, I have never used salt or any other deicer on my driveway. There is no need. My driveway faces west and I am diligent about removing snow promptly. The sun does the rest. Besides, the spalling has only appeared on the area over which I parked my car during the 2015-2016 winter period, thereby proving that it was road chemicals that damaged the weak surface. Reiterating, my driveway is the only one of the ten poured on my street by the contractor during the early 2015 time period that exhibits the spalling. I asked two specific questions for the contractor to answer. One question, about me being entitled to the same quality driveway as the other nine poured by the contractor during this time period, was ignored completely. The other question, about why he waited until 1:15 AM, after the rain and light snow started, was answered by him saying that he didn't want to scratch the concrete. My response to that statement is this: If the concrete was so fragile and susceptible to scratching that the contractor delayed covering my driveway until after the rain and light snow began, than it may also be possible that the cold temperatures had slowed the initial setting process of the concrete and the rain washed some of the cement out of the concrete mixture, thereby resulting in a weakened concrete surface. This issue is addressed by "Rain's effect on fresh concrete" at [redacted]  On the other hand, if the concrete was sufficiently hardened so as to be not affected by rain, why cover it at all?  My contention all along has been that it was the contractor's failure to protect the concrete before it rained that caused a weak concrete surface. As stated before, of the ten driveways replaced by the contractor, only my driveway was unprotected before rain and only my driveway exhibits spalling. A thoughtful response by the contractor will expedite the closure of this complaint process.
Sincerely,
[redacted]

We covered it late so the covers will not scratch the surface. And as for the first night. The exothermic reaction known as curing keeps it warm. We could of covered it earlier. But then we would be dealing with a complaint about the surface being scratched by covers. There is nothing more that could have been done to pour this concrete in cold weather. All precautionary measures were taken. We could do the driveway 10 more times. And we would handle it the same way every time. And our quality of work and how we handle cold weather pouring should not be in question. 9 other driveways look good. Done around the same time. Since there is no definite proof of why it spalled. Which is salt in most cases. We will not warranty the work. Without definite proof that we are at fault. We cannot warranty the work. Concrete was poured at a good time. Concrete was covered. And only this one of 10 is bad. It's safe to say this was not labor related. We have covered plenty of slabs at midnight after a pour. And those are in great condition. We believe the customer applied salt to his driveway after the pour during the following snow storms. And that is most likely what made the concrete spall.