Initial Business Response /* (1000, 12, 2015/06/11) */
Contact Name and Title: [redacted], Manager
Contact Phone: [redacted]
Contact Email: [redacted]
The customer is correct, we did enter into a verbal agreement but it was for a contract price of $5000.00 plus HST. The agreed...
amount was to carry out the following work:
(1) Paint the three hallways and stairwells in a 3 story apartment building. (2) Plaster the many holes in the walls. (3) Attempt to repair a steel door [redacted] so that it would close. (4) Repair and paint 1 wall in the main floor apartment. (5) Repair and paint the ceiling in the main floor bathroom. (6) Replace a rail in one of the stairwells.
During our initial discussion about this work I told the customer that the walls were in a deplorable condition and that the only way this job was going to look good was if the drywall was replaced because the wall had been repaired many times and the work was never done correctly. Holes had been repaired very roughly and then painted over. I also told her that the door really needed to be replaced because it was beyond repair. Her response was that[redacted] she just wanted to patch it up[redacted]. [redacted]
The first day our workers arrived at the jobsite there wasn't any lights working so I called the customer and told her and she said that the lights were on the panel belonging to the second floor apartment [redacted]. My workers had to get a flashlight in order to get up to the second floor apartment [redacted]. [redacted] turned on the lights and the workers got started plastering. [redacted] wall in the main floor apartment, repaired the steel door and purchased $600.00 worth of paint, plaster and painting supplies which could not be returned because the paint was tinted. Our only option was to try to complete the job as best we could. Really we should have left the job but at that point but I already had too much invested to do that. [redacted] refused to turn on the heat and the customer said that she would make arrangements [redacted], which never happened. I even offered to pay a portion of the [redacted] hydro bill (I made this offer directly to [redacted]) and she still refused to turn on the heat so we had to plug into an outlet in the main floor [redacted] and dry the plaster with a heat gun. Needless to say this didn't make for a great job since paint needs heat to cure properly.
The second day back to the jobsite, no lights again [redacted] we didn't get any lights until after 9:00 AM and our workers start at 7:30. So that day more plastering and more drying it with a heat gun. When they went into the first floor apartment to put another coat of plaster on the ceiling of the bathroom the ceiling was ruined again because I guess the toilet or something in the bathroom above had overflowed so they had to cut out the drywall and do the repair all over again. To make a long story short, this went on for 6 days. We never ever got any heat, the customer never showed up first nor last to try to resolve the problem with the heat and lights and every day it was a battle just [redacted] to turn on the lights. After a couple of conversations with the customer it became very difficult to contact her.
The customer mentioned that we didn't replace the rail or repair the screw holes where the rail had been torn off the wall. She's right, we didn't replace the rail because it was our intention to cover the screw holes with pine sconces and attach the rail to the sconces. When I invoiced the customer I did give her a credit for the rail. We would have had to cut the rail because it was 12' long and we couldn't make the turn into the stairwell and of course no windows to pass it in through. We would have had to attach the pine sconces with construction adhesive and join the rail with construction adhesive as well. As I said earlier there was no heat and it was [redacted] and while there would have been screws used as well it wouldn't stay in place because the main strength would be the construction adhesive. When I first went to the building there was pieces of the rail still there in splinters,[redacted]
My guys did the best job that they could given the circumstances and the budgetary restraints.
After [redacted] I approached the customer to get paid and she said that she wasn't happy with the work. [redacted] told the customer that I would settle for $3000.00. She didn't come out and say she wasn't going to pay for the job, [redacted]. [redacted]
I am sorry that this worked out this way but if she had responded to my many requests to solve the hydro problem [redacted], none of this would have been necessary and the completed job would have been at least as good as I promised.
Mrs. [redacted] stated in her complaint that she hired us by the hour. If we were hired by the hour, why would I buy the paint, plaster and supplies. On an hourly contract the materials are supplied by the customer. This was not an hourly contract.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 14, 2015/06/21) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
The Contractor has falsified the information he has submitted. The contract was hourly but the $4000 - $5000 was his extremely high guesstimate - not a verbal contract amount. I asked how much he charges per hour replying $80. When I asked why so much he stated that the men were journeymen and excellent at what they do. Stated I would pay that if the job was completed by [redacted]. Thus he called [redacted] to notify me of its completion. I went there and noted that it was not completed and that there was extreme poor quality workmanship and it wasn't finished. [redacted]
The Contractor states that there were many holes in the hall walls. [redacted]I decided to go with plastering a few indentations which weren't that noticeable, as I needed the holes repaired where the railing was
It wasn't a big job and I was getting it all painted.
The steel door was fixed by the Contractor in 15 - 20 min and this was done before I decided to hire him. He stated that he told me I needed to replace the door. My maintenance man had the hinges adjusted and it has worked fine ever since. We were there to show him what needed to be done.[redacted].
The Contractor initially said repairs were completed on [redacted] - not so. Also said virtually all apt was painted - not so. I have pictures that verify only spots painted where there was plastering. [redacted] He never mentioned replacing gyproc.
The maintenance man just had to adjust the hinges on the steel door and it has been working since. It never had to be replaced.
When the Contractor called or emailed me I ALWAYS connected with him.
The Contractor viewed the bathroom ceiling with my maintenance man who was told that the reason why the ceiling repair was so bad is because it kept getting wet. The maintenance man went to the above apts and there was no evidence of wetness. [redacted] However the Contractor said that the men had to repair it again and again. If there was wetness then the Contractor should have notified me of this. I would have been able to repair the problem. Only then should the men have repaired the ceiling.
The contractor said he paid $600 for materials etc. All contractors have the tools of the trade and should not be supplied by the client. I would want proof of purchase as there was minimal paint used and a box of plaster approx. $30 would be the amount used if even that. I want a copy of the expenses for the job
The Contractor never mentioned the removal of clutter in order to paint. Told me at first that it had been painted. There was no wall painted - only spot painted.
The heat was available from the first negotiated deal [redacted] which he stated happened on the second day of the job. He said he would pay her $100 for its use. She recently said she contacted him about this and he told her that he paid me - not true. He said that he had approached her but he NEVER contacted me about a heating problem after the first day. He said he used a heat gun. There was heat available on the first day. He also had access to the outlets for the emergency lights which would have given him electricity.and heat supplied by portable heaters. He does construction in the winter and thus must have portable heaters when building new houses. There was no delay due to lack of heat. If the men were qualified journeymen, they would only require one coat of plaster and not have to do it again as there were only 2 areas that were damaged extensively and possibly require more then one lot of plaster. To say that it took 6 days to do this work is not true. he indicated what he did on the first day which left only the railing to fix for the next 6 days as indicated on his response.
A professional notifies the client if there is a leak in the bathroom. He never notified me. A professional would not do the repairs in the ceiling until the leak was fixed first. Yet he stated that the ceiling was repaired again without me being notified. He stated this the leak was noted on his first day on the job. That is when he ethically should have called so as I could get it fixed. He stated they did it a second time and it was ruined again. Yet there was absolutely no evidence of water in either on the above apartments. He also stated that they installed new gyproc in the bathroom ceiling but my maintenance man said there was none done.
The Contractor stated that I never visited the site. I didn't need to visit the site as there were no complaints from the contractor.I was never unavailable to him.
Tearing a rail off the wall resulted to damage to the wall and not just screw holes. Scones would not do the job. He stated that he gave me credit for unfinished work. Using his figure of $5000 indicates there was no credit.[redacted].
[redacted]. The contractor stated that the railing would not last by cutting on an angle and gluing it. It has been 6 mos since it was repaired and it is still in perfect condition.
The $80/hr for the work was only valid if he had the work finished prior to [redacted]. I agreed to the high hourly rate as it was [redacted]. and all contractors would be busy until the [redacted]. As mentioned before he called me [redacted] to notify me that the job was completed. I said that we can settle after [redacted] Several days after [redacted] he called me and I said I was disgusted with the job he had done. At this point I asked for him to invoice me the hours it took to do each part of the repairs. I also said that I was not paying until I got it. He said he would not give me this - NOT SAYING THAT THE PRICE WAS NOT AN HOURLY RATE. We discussed how much I thought that I owed him and I said that I needed to see the hours attached to the job performed and only then could I give him an answer. I said that I couldn't give him how much I thouht I owed him as I needed to see how many hours he had worked. I asked him how much he thought I owed him to which he said $3000 but yet billed me after that for $5000 for the uncompleted job. The Contractor knew that I would only pay him when he supplied me with the invoice itemizing the hours performing each job. [redacted] It could all have been settled had he supplied me with the information. [redacted]
The Contractor sent me an invoice stating that there were 2 men who worked 18hrs and another who worked 12hrs. Why would he even supply the number of hours if it wasn't an hourly rate. As I am paying the hourly rate I have the right to this information.I will not pay for qualified journeymen as I cannot believe that a professional would do such a terrible job.
[redacted]
At the beginning of his response to my complaint he did not say anything about it not being an hourly rate. I have always entered into an hourly contract. If that was not an hourly contract why did he enter into discussion with me as to how much he paid his men. I have been billed for supplies at the end of the job.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 22, 2015/07/13) */
I have read Ms. [redacted]'s rebuttal and I just want to reiterate what I said in my response. [redacted], Ms. [redacted] has made no attempt to settle this what so ever. [redacted]. I have made every attempt to settle this to no avail...[redacted]
Initial Business Response /* (1000, 12, 2015/06/11) */
Contact Name and Title: [redacted], Manager
Contact Phone: [redacted]
Contact Email: [redacted]
The customer is correct, we did enter into a verbal agreement but it was for a contract price of $5000.00 plus HST. The agreed...
amount was to carry out the following work:
(1) Paint the three hallways and stairwells in a 3 story apartment building. (2) Plaster the many holes in the walls. (3) Attempt to repair a steel door [redacted] so that it would close. (4) Repair and paint 1 wall in the main floor apartment. (5) Repair and paint the ceiling in the main floor bathroom. (6) Replace a rail in one of the stairwells.
During our initial discussion about this work I told the customer that the walls were in a deplorable condition and that the only way this job was going to look good was if the drywall was replaced because the wall had been repaired many times and the work was never done correctly. Holes had been repaired very roughly and then painted over. I also told her that the door really needed to be replaced because it was beyond repair. Her response was that[redacted] she just wanted to patch it up[redacted]. [redacted]
The first day our workers arrived at the jobsite there wasn't any lights working so I called the customer and told her and she said that the lights were on the panel belonging to the second floor apartment [redacted]. My workers had to get a flashlight in order to get up to the second floor apartment [redacted]. [redacted] turned on the lights and the workers got started plastering. [redacted] wall in the main floor apartment, repaired the steel door and purchased $600.00 worth of paint, plaster and painting supplies which could not be returned because the paint was tinted. Our only option was to try to complete the job as best we could. Really we should have left the job but at that point but I already had too much invested to do that. [redacted] refused to turn on the heat and the customer said that she would make arrangements [redacted], which never happened. I even offered to pay a portion of the [redacted] hydro bill (I made this offer directly to [redacted]) and she still refused to turn on the heat so we had to plug into an outlet in the main floor [redacted] and dry the plaster with a heat gun. Needless to say this didn't make for a great job since paint needs heat to cure properly.
The second day back to the jobsite, no lights again [redacted] we didn't get any lights until after 9:00 AM and our workers start at 7:30. So that day more plastering and more drying it with a heat gun. When they went into the first floor apartment to put another coat of plaster on the ceiling of the bathroom the ceiling was ruined again because I guess the toilet or something in the bathroom above had overflowed so they had to cut out the drywall and do the repair all over again. To make a long story short, this went on for 6 days. We never ever got any heat, the customer never showed up first nor last to try to resolve the problem with the heat and lights and every day it was a battle just [redacted] to turn on the lights. After a couple of conversations with the customer it became very difficult to contact her.
The customer mentioned that we didn't replace the rail or repair the screw holes where the rail had been torn off the wall. She's right, we didn't replace the rail because it was our intention to cover the screw holes with pine sconces and attach the rail to the sconces. When I invoiced the customer I did give her a credit for the rail. We would have had to cut the rail because it was 12' long and we couldn't make the turn into the stairwell and of course no windows to pass it in through. We would have had to attach the pine sconces with construction adhesive and join the rail with construction adhesive as well. As I said earlier there was no heat and it was [redacted] and while there would have been screws used as well it wouldn't stay in place because the main strength would be the construction adhesive. When I first went to the building there was pieces of the rail still there in splinters,[redacted]
My guys did the best job that they could given the circumstances and the budgetary restraints.
After [redacted] I approached the customer to get paid and she said that she wasn't happy with the work. [redacted] told the customer that I would settle for $3000.00. She didn't come out and say she wasn't going to pay for the job, [redacted]. [redacted]
I am sorry that this worked out this way but if she had responded to my many requests to solve the hydro problem [redacted], none of this would have been necessary and the completed job would have been at least as good as I promised.
Mrs. [redacted] stated in her complaint that she hired us by the hour. If we were hired by the hour, why would I buy the paint, plaster and supplies. On an hourly contract the materials are supplied by the customer. This was not an hourly contract.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 14, 2015/06/21) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
The Contractor has falsified the information he has submitted. The contract was hourly but the $4000 - $5000 was his extremely high guesstimate - not a verbal contract amount. I asked how much he charges per hour replying $80. When I asked why so much he stated that the men were journeymen and excellent at what they do. Stated I would pay that if the job was completed by [redacted]. Thus he called [redacted] to notify me of its completion. I went there and noted that it was not completed and that there was extreme poor quality workmanship and it wasn't finished. [redacted]
The Contractor states that there were many holes in the hall walls. [redacted]I decided to go with plastering a few indentations which weren't that noticeable, as I needed the holes repaired where the railing was
It wasn't a big job and I was getting it all painted.
The steel door was fixed by the Contractor in 15 - 20 min and this was done before I decided to hire him. He stated that he told me I needed to replace the door. My maintenance man had the hinges adjusted and it has worked fine ever since. We were there to show him what needed to be done.[redacted].
The Contractor initially said repairs were completed on [redacted] - not so. Also said virtually all apt was painted - not so. I have pictures that verify only spots painted where there was plastering. [redacted] He never mentioned replacing gyproc.
The maintenance man just had to adjust the hinges on the steel door and it has been working since. It never had to be replaced.
When the Contractor called or emailed me I ALWAYS connected with him.
The Contractor viewed the bathroom ceiling with my maintenance man who was told that the reason why the ceiling repair was so bad is because it kept getting wet. The maintenance man went to the above apts and there was no evidence of wetness. [redacted] However the Contractor said that the men had to repair it again and again. If there was wetness then the Contractor should have notified me of this. I would have been able to repair the problem. Only then should the men have repaired the ceiling.
The contractor said he paid $600 for materials etc. All contractors have the tools of the trade and should not be supplied by the client. I would want proof of purchase as there was minimal paint used and a box of plaster approx. $30 would be the amount used if even that. I want a copy of the expenses for the job
The Contractor never mentioned the removal of clutter in order to paint. Told me at first that it had been painted. There was no wall painted - only spot painted.
The heat was available from the first negotiated deal [redacted] which he stated happened on the second day of the job. He said he would pay her $100 for its use. She recently said she contacted him about this and he told her that he paid me - not true. He said that he had approached her but he NEVER contacted me about a heating problem after the first day. He said he used a heat gun. There was heat available on the first day. He also had access to the outlets for the emergency lights which would have given him electricity.and heat supplied by portable heaters. He does construction in the winter and thus must have portable heaters when building new houses. There was no delay due to lack of heat. If the men were qualified journeymen, they would only require one coat of plaster and not have to do it again as there were only 2 areas that were damaged extensively and possibly require more then one lot of plaster. To say that it took 6 days to do this work is not true. he indicated what he did on the first day which left only the railing to fix for the next 6 days as indicated on his response.
A professional notifies the client if there is a leak in the bathroom. He never notified me. A professional would not do the repairs in the ceiling until the leak was fixed first. Yet he stated that the ceiling was repaired again without me being notified. He stated this the leak was noted on his first day on the job. That is when he ethically should have called so as I could get it fixed. He stated they did it a second time and it was ruined again. Yet there was absolutely no evidence of water in either on the above apartments. He also stated that they installed new gyproc in the bathroom ceiling but my maintenance man said there was none done.
The Contractor stated that I never visited the site. I didn't need to visit the site as there were no complaints from the contractor.I was never unavailable to him.
Tearing a rail off the wall resulted to damage to the wall and not just screw holes. Scones would not do the job. He stated that he gave me credit for unfinished work. Using his figure of $5000 indicates there was no credit.[redacted].
[redacted]. The contractor stated that the railing would not last by cutting on an angle and gluing it. It has been 6 mos since it was repaired and it is still in perfect condition.
The $80/hr for the work was only valid if he had the work finished prior to [redacted]. I agreed to the high hourly rate as it was [redacted]. and all contractors would be busy until the [redacted]. As mentioned before he called me [redacted] to notify me that the job was completed. I said that we can settle after [redacted] Several days after [redacted] he called me and I said I was disgusted with the job he had done. At this point I asked for him to invoice me the hours it took to do each part of the repairs. I also said that I was not paying until I got it. He said he would not give me this - NOT SAYING THAT THE PRICE WAS NOT AN HOURLY RATE. We discussed how much I thought that I owed him and I said that I needed to see the hours attached to the job performed and only then could I give him an answer. I said that I couldn't give him how much I thouht I owed him as I needed to see how many hours he had worked. I asked him how much he thought I owed him to which he said $3000 but yet billed me after that for $5000 for the uncompleted job. The Contractor knew that I would only pay him when he supplied me with the invoice itemizing the hours performing each job. [redacted] It could all have been settled had he supplied me with the information. [redacted]
The Contractor sent me an invoice stating that there were 2 men who worked 18hrs and another who worked 12hrs. Why would he even supply the number of hours if it wasn't an hourly rate. As I am paying the hourly rate I have the right to this information.I will not pay for qualified journeymen as I cannot believe that a professional would do such a terrible job.
[redacted]
At the beginning of his response to my complaint he did not say anything about it not being an hourly rate. I have always entered into an hourly contract. If that was not an hourly contract why did he enter into discussion with me as to how much he paid his men. I have been billed for supplies at the end of the job.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 22, 2015/07/13) */
I have read Ms. [redacted]'s rebuttal and I just want to reiterate what I said in my response. [redacted], Ms. [redacted] has made no attempt to settle this what so ever. [redacted]. I have made every attempt to settle this to no avail...[redacted]