Initial Business Response /* (1000, 5, 2015/05/20) */
At the time of the [redacted]'s move, one of our packers was trying to disconnect one of the computer peripherals when he pulled out the hutch portion of the desk. The right side of the hutch had separated from the shelves and rear panel. When...
the customer called, we informed them to make note of the damage and we would repair the item when it arrived to their new destination in FL.
The customer was convinced that the desk was beyond repair and it made no sense to take it on to FL. After discussing several options, the customer decided to keep the desk in IL and take it to Ms. [redacted]'s parents to wait for repairs. This made no sense to any of our staff, unless the [redacted]'s intended for it not to go at all.
Several months passed when Ms.[redacted] called us to inquire about repairs the first part of the year. We made arrangements for our wood repair person to perform the repairs once he returned in March. When the repair person arrived at the parents house, he said he could not get to the desk stored in their garage because of numerous items stacked in and around the desk and desk parts. He notified that there was not enough space to clear out and repair the Hutch part. We advised the repair person that we would go back out later and take the desk sections and hutch out of the parent's garage and over to his wood shop for repairs. Our crew members also acknowledged the fact that the desk was literally buried in the garage and they had to take time to excise it out.
The repairs were eventually made and the desk and hutch were brought back to our warehouse for further instructions from Ms. [redacted].
Ms. [redacted] wanted us to ship the desk back down to FL at our cost. We told her we would not do that because it was her decision to keep the desk back in IL instead of forwarding it on to FL to have repairs done there.
I, personally went back to our warehouse to inspect the repairs. Considering the desk was made with engineered wood, I thought the repairs were acceptable. If there were any tell-tale signs of repair they would not have been visable unless you got very close to inspect. Also at that time, I did notice a scratch on the front of the desk, but I also noticed a lot of dust where the desk had been stored in the garage. It would be assumable that the scratch occurred in the parents garage according to the descriptions of the repair person and our crews on the way it was stored and placed.
Ms. [redacted] came by the warehouse to inspect the repairs to the damage and later told me via email that the repairs were unacceptable. Mr. [redacted] then became involved and became so vocal and argumentative that our representative had to abruptly end the call. He eventually followed up with a strong email to myself demanding payment for a new hutch.
We then reached out to the dealer who sold the desk to them and retrieved the model number for the desk. We found out since the desk was modular, we could order parts.
We emailed Ms. [redacted] with this information as an alternative to the repairs. We also invited Ms. [redacted] back out to our warehouse to show us where she was dissatisfied with the damages. We are still awaiting for her reply.
In regards to the other damaged items during their moved to FL, [redacted] Lines Claims Department settled this claim
As we mentioned earlier, at the time of the move, we advised the Hatfields to move the desk on to FL where we could make arrangements for repairs. They declined and opted to leave the desk back here in IL. That was their prerogative.
Also, as a gesture of goodwill, after their move, we moved the desk at no cost back to Ms. [redacted]'s parents residence. We also, are storing the desk at no charge at our warehouse until the Hatfields decide what to do with the desk.
Until we hear back from the Hatfields, we are still at a standstill. We believe that replacing the parts for the hutch part may be the best solution at this time.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 7, 2015/05/22) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Hutchcrafts response if full of non-true facts and he leave a lot of information out. First, his movers were not trying to remove a computer peripheral. Mr. [redacted] had already removed all items from the desk and pack those himself. The movers could not lift the hutch due to how sturdy, heavy and quality the desk was. Instead, they attempted to pull the hutch from one side off the desk causing it to break.
Second, blaming us for the quality of the desk is untrue. This desk was so heavy and sturdy his movers could not lift it.
His assumption of why the desk was not moved to Florida is completelyl wrong as he attempts to defend his poor business practices. We did not move the desk because we did not want to pay to move an item that was destroyed before it every went on the moving truck. Paying extra weight for something destroyed and we could not use made no sense to us. We also felt that something like this would happen and the desk would be in Florida. Knowing we would be able to move the desk to Florida at a later time if fixed properly.
We asked for $895 the cost of the hutch only from the very start we were told they would fix it. They have not done so in even a remotely satisfactory manner nine months later. This prooves we were right not to move it 1800 miles away.
Storage in the garage at Mrs. [redacted] parents is a false claim too. In emails we have from [redacted] he states is was covered in "garbage" that is his term that he used. The desk may have been hard to "walk to", but it was not covered in garbage.
Also, Mr. [redacted] got upset on the phone because his secretary would not allow Mr. [redacted] to talk directly to [redacted].
[redacted] also mentioned to Mrs. [redacted] that she should have been talking to two other men to get this resolved. The two men he named we had never even heard of for 8 months until he mentioned them in an email. He also states in his response they offered to order new parts. What he does not mention is this, why did it take them 9 months to find out they can order parts to fix it properly? Second, he did not mention and email that he received from Mr. [redacted] stating all communitcation regarding the desk would be done with Mr. [redacted] from that point forward as he and his company was causing severe stress to Mrs. [redacted]. He has failed to do so. So Mr. [redacted] has never been notified of his offer because he has failed to make the offer to Mr. [redacted]. His buisness practices are shoddy and his idea of repairs are rediculous as we have photos of the SO CALLED repairds. The damage can still be seen from many feet away.
He talks about storing it for free, like he is doing something for us. He is doing nothing for us. He stated in an email that he took it back to make the repairs and prevent other damage as he calls it. Bottom line is this. 9 months ago he had three options, 1. Replace the hutch for $895. 2. Order parts and fix the desk properly. 3. Send a check for $895 and it be done. He chose none of those. He chose to send someone to fix the desk and the so called repairs were not done at all. His next method was to blame the quality of the desk, as it being cheap, and they type of furniture you can't move often. One time is not often, and when so called professionals were paid nearly $10,000 to move items and broke a a very expenseive heavy duty desk and lost and broke numberous other items, then fail to fix or replacy any of it when the claim is filed, that is just poor poor business.
[redacted] has the opportunity still to make this right but he chooses not too.
Last, [redacted] was provided proper phone numbers and emails but they chose to drag this out and then blame us. From day one they have never spelled Mr. [redacted]'s name correctly even when notified numberous times. That is how little they care about their customer. Sadly, a customer pays so much money for a service and yet this is what they get once they get their money. We will not rest until this is done and fixed PROPERLY. His misleading statements and near lies are more examples of his horribly business practices. We have photos of before his workers touched the desk and after pictures and also after pictures of his SO CALLED repairs. No one would accept that poor quality of workman ship and the desk is worthless until done correctly. He is only storing the desk because he knows they screwed up but he was you to think they are doing us some kind of a favor. If he had done any of the three simple options listed above he wouldn't have had to store anything. That is his fault. As a matter of fact all of this is Hutchcrafts fault, yet he takes no responsibility and his response proves exactly that. Greedy person who does not care about the customer.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 9, 2015/06/03) */
In regards how specifically how the desk hutch was damaged is neither here nor there. We admitted from the start of our liability in the matter. However, we still adamantly state that we told the Hatfields to continue to move the desk on to FL for subsequent repairs. It is United Van Lines responsibility to repair or replace any damaged item(s) that our tendered for shipment. By leaving the desk behind, they forfeited that right.
Still that did not release us from our responsibility to repair the damaged hutch part. The desk and return were not damaged at the time, only the hutch portion. Why would someone leave the complete unit behind, when only one part was damaged?
It is never in our nature to criticize a customer's belongings. By instructing the Hatfields to Google "Inherent Vice Manufactured Wood Furniture", it was our intent to educate them that these items are more susceptible to damage than real wood items. Repairing them can be difficult, but not impossible. If we see that something is impossible to repair, most manufactured wood manufacturers can supply parts and components because they know that these things can happen.
Since Ms. [redacted] wasn't satisfied with the repairs, we contacted the Rogards Office Supply, where they purchased the item for replacement parts. We are attaching an email request from Rogards, plus their response, and a continuing reply to Ms. [redacted] on May 8th if she wished to continue. We have not heard a reply from neither that Hatfields.
Finally, we have never called anyone's goods "garbage". As stated earlier, we respect everyone's belongings because it is the best they can afford. Reviewing our email string with Ms. [redacted], we are curious if they can produce any email from us calling her stuff "garbage". I think Mr. or Ms. [redacted] may have misread the word "garage' as "garbage in our May 5 email (see attachment).
Also, in answering the [redacted]'s remarks as to spending "nearly $10,000 to move... only to have numberous (sic) other items, then fail to fix or replacy (sic) any of it when the claim is filed is just poor business" is unfounded. Attached is the claim settlement letter from United Van Lines. Also, the [redacted]'s moving charges were only $6554.91 not nearly $10,000, as stated. I hope they understand their embellishment of such charges can weaken their arguments.
For now, we believe a payment for the right side panel and back panel for $256.00 is in order to settle this issue. Had they heeded our instruction and forwarded the desk set to FL, this issue would have been resolved last November, 2014 with the other United Van Lines claim instead of the present.
Final Consumer Response /* (4200, 11, 2015/06/04) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
We do not accept the proposed resolution for the following reasons:
First, we were given the OPTION to leave the desk behind to be dealt with by [redacted]/United Van Lines. Had we been told from the beginning it was going to cause this much issue and that it needed to be fixed in Florida we would have taken the desk with us. As we had and have EVERY intention of taking the desk with us to Florida, in contrary to what [redacted] has said and implied.
Second, our first quote from [redacted] to move our belongings to Florida was approximatly $9,000. However, we sold numerous items bringing the final moving cost down to $6554.91. For [redacted] to say "it ONLY cost $6554.91" is insulting, just as all of the other conversations have been with him. He has insulted the quality of our furniture, our means of storage, our money, our choices and words. $6554.91 is A LOT of money to us and many other people. To a million dollar company it may seem like a small amount. This is just simply poor customer service.
Third, on 5/5/2015 [redacted] asked in an email for all further communications to be through him and via phone. That did not happen and is why [redacted] has not responed to his email regarding the replacement pieces at Rogards.
Fourth, we believe to settle this issue we should be paid the amount it would cost us to replace and repurchase the hutch that was broken(approximatly $895). We do not want replacement pieces. The desk was brand new and in perfect condition when [redacted] movers damaged it. When we recieve the money, we will be more than happy to pick up the desk from [redacted] and move it to Florida ourselves.
Fifth, we have pictures we would like to share of the unacceptable repairs that [redacted] believes we should accept, however there is not an option for attachments on our response. We hope Hutchcrat understands how unprofessional this repair work makes their claims against us. As you will see, no one would accept this type of repair work on a $2300 desk that was in brand new condition. We also do not agree with replacing just the pieces. We have already witnessed the type of repair work done by Timberline and do not want to deal with more issues from shotty repair work.
Sixth, you can see in the attachements from [redacted] that we had several other items damaged and that only one item was paid for and the others denied. We reluctanlty settled on those. Yet, we are paying money out of our own pocket to have those items repaired.
Seventh, we are just as ready as [redacted] to settle this issue. We would like to have the desk in Florida to use as we have been without it for nine months.
Eighth, the words "buried in" was used in the email from [redacted] on 5/5/2015 in regards to how the desk was stored in the garage. This was taken in a deragatory and insulting manner. [redacted] from Timeberline, who came to see the desk at my fathers and later did the repairs, told my father (who was there to let him in to see the damage) that the repairs would have to be done at his shop. The desk was not moved and picked up by [redacted] and taken to Timberline because [redacted] couldn't get to it. It was because it needed to be repaired at his shop. Why would [redacted] think the desk would not need to be moved to be repaired? Why would repairs be done in someone's garage without tools and equipment? In regards to the scratch, it was placed in my parents garage by [redacted] and was not again moved or touched until they picked it up again to take it to Timberline. So we believe the scratch happened when [redacted] movers moved the desk for the third time.
Ninth, we would like to reiterate we have used [redacted] movers in the past and had zero complaints or issues. We used their services for our move to Florida because we felt they did a good job in the past. This current experience is not what we expected from them based on our previous interactions.
Lastly, if we cannot settle this issue amicably and reasonably we will be forced to seek legal action. As we have already discussed this ongoing issue with an attorney and are ready to move forward if needed. We have opted to wait to use that option in hopes we can settle this issue amongst ourselves.
Initial Business Response /* (1000, 5, 2015/05/20) */
At the time of the [redacted]'s move, one of our packers was trying to disconnect one of the computer peripherals when he pulled out the hutch portion of the desk. The right side of the hutch had separated from the shelves and rear panel. When...
the customer called, we informed them to make note of the damage and we would repair the item when it arrived to their new destination in FL.
The customer was convinced that the desk was beyond repair and it made no sense to take it on to FL. After discussing several options, the customer decided to keep the desk in IL and take it to Ms. [redacted]'s parents to wait for repairs. This made no sense to any of our staff, unless the [redacted]'s intended for it not to go at all.
Several months passed when Ms.[redacted] called us to inquire about repairs the first part of the year. We made arrangements for our wood repair person to perform the repairs once he returned in March. When the repair person arrived at the parents house, he said he could not get to the desk stored in their garage because of numerous items stacked in and around the desk and desk parts. He notified that there was not enough space to clear out and repair the Hutch part. We advised the repair person that we would go back out later and take the desk sections and hutch out of the parent's garage and over to his wood shop for repairs. Our crew members also acknowledged the fact that the desk was literally buried in the garage and they had to take time to excise it out.
The repairs were eventually made and the desk and hutch were brought back to our warehouse for further instructions from Ms. [redacted].
Ms. [redacted] wanted us to ship the desk back down to FL at our cost. We told her we would not do that because it was her decision to keep the desk back in IL instead of forwarding it on to FL to have repairs done there.
I, personally went back to our warehouse to inspect the repairs. Considering the desk was made with engineered wood, I thought the repairs were acceptable. If there were any tell-tale signs of repair they would not have been visable unless you got very close to inspect. Also at that time, I did notice a scratch on the front of the desk, but I also noticed a lot of dust where the desk had been stored in the garage. It would be assumable that the scratch occurred in the parents garage according to the descriptions of the repair person and our crews on the way it was stored and placed.
Ms. [redacted] came by the warehouse to inspect the repairs to the damage and later told me via email that the repairs were unacceptable. Mr. [redacted] then became involved and became so vocal and argumentative that our representative had to abruptly end the call. He eventually followed up with a strong email to myself demanding payment for a new hutch.
We then reached out to the dealer who sold the desk to them and retrieved the model number for the desk. We found out since the desk was modular, we could order parts.
We emailed Ms. [redacted] with this information as an alternative to the repairs. We also invited Ms. [redacted] back out to our warehouse to show us where she was dissatisfied with the damages. We are still awaiting for her reply.
In regards to the other damaged items during their moved to FL, [redacted] Lines Claims Department settled this claim
As we mentioned earlier, at the time of the move, we advised the Hatfields to move the desk on to FL where we could make arrangements for repairs. They declined and opted to leave the desk back here in IL. That was their prerogative.
Also, as a gesture of goodwill, after their move, we moved the desk at no cost back to Ms. [redacted]'s parents residence. We also, are storing the desk at no charge at our warehouse until the Hatfields decide what to do with the desk.
Until we hear back from the Hatfields, we are still at a standstill. We believe that replacing the parts for the hutch part may be the best solution at this time.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 7, 2015/05/22) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Hutchcrafts response if full of non-true facts and he leave a lot of information out. First, his movers were not trying to remove a computer peripheral. Mr. [redacted] had already removed all items from the desk and pack those himself. The movers could not lift the hutch due to how sturdy, heavy and quality the desk was. Instead, they attempted to pull the hutch from one side off the desk causing it to break.
Second, blaming us for the quality of the desk is untrue. This desk was so heavy and sturdy his movers could not lift it.
His assumption of why the desk was not moved to Florida is completelyl wrong as he attempts to defend his poor business practices. We did not move the desk because we did not want to pay to move an item that was destroyed before it every went on the moving truck. Paying extra weight for something destroyed and we could not use made no sense to us. We also felt that something like this would happen and the desk would be in Florida. Knowing we would be able to move the desk to Florida at a later time if fixed properly.
We asked for $895 the cost of the hutch only from the very start we were told they would fix it. They have not done so in even a remotely satisfactory manner nine months later. This prooves we were right not to move it 1800 miles away.
Storage in the garage at Mrs. [redacted] parents is a false claim too. In emails we have from [redacted] he states is was covered in "garbage" that is his term that he used. The desk may have been hard to "walk to", but it was not covered in garbage.
Also, Mr. [redacted] got upset on the phone because his secretary would not allow Mr. [redacted] to talk directly to [redacted].
[redacted] also mentioned to Mrs. [redacted] that she should have been talking to two other men to get this resolved. The two men he named we had never even heard of for 8 months until he mentioned them in an email. He also states in his response they offered to order new parts. What he does not mention is this, why did it take them 9 months to find out they can order parts to fix it properly? Second, he did not mention and email that he received from Mr. [redacted] stating all communitcation regarding the desk would be done with Mr. [redacted] from that point forward as he and his company was causing severe stress to Mrs. [redacted]. He has failed to do so. So Mr. [redacted] has never been notified of his offer because he has failed to make the offer to Mr. [redacted]. His buisness practices are shoddy and his idea of repairs are rediculous as we have photos of the SO CALLED repairds. The damage can still be seen from many feet away.
He talks about storing it for free, like he is doing something for us. He is doing nothing for us. He stated in an email that he took it back to make the repairs and prevent other damage as he calls it. Bottom line is this. 9 months ago he had three options, 1. Replace the hutch for $895. 2. Order parts and fix the desk properly. 3. Send a check for $895 and it be done. He chose none of those. He chose to send someone to fix the desk and the so called repairs were not done at all. His next method was to blame the quality of the desk, as it being cheap, and they type of furniture you can't move often. One time is not often, and when so called professionals were paid nearly $10,000 to move items and broke a a very expenseive heavy duty desk and lost and broke numberous other items, then fail to fix or replacy any of it when the claim is filed, that is just poor poor business.
[redacted] has the opportunity still to make this right but he chooses not too.
Last, [redacted] was provided proper phone numbers and emails but they chose to drag this out and then blame us. From day one they have never spelled Mr. [redacted]'s name correctly even when notified numberous times. That is how little they care about their customer. Sadly, a customer pays so much money for a service and yet this is what they get once they get their money. We will not rest until this is done and fixed PROPERLY. His misleading statements and near lies are more examples of his horribly business practices. We have photos of before his workers touched the desk and after pictures and also after pictures of his SO CALLED repairs. No one would accept that poor quality of workman ship and the desk is worthless until done correctly. He is only storing the desk because he knows they screwed up but he was you to think they are doing us some kind of a favor. If he had done any of the three simple options listed above he wouldn't have had to store anything. That is his fault. As a matter of fact all of this is Hutchcrafts fault, yet he takes no responsibility and his response proves exactly that. Greedy person who does not care about the customer.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 9, 2015/06/03) */
In regards how specifically how the desk hutch was damaged is neither here nor there. We admitted from the start of our liability in the matter. However, we still adamantly state that we told the Hatfields to continue to move the desk on to FL for subsequent repairs. It is United Van Lines responsibility to repair or replace any damaged item(s) that our tendered for shipment. By leaving the desk behind, they forfeited that right.
Still that did not release us from our responsibility to repair the damaged hutch part. The desk and return were not damaged at the time, only the hutch portion. Why would someone leave the complete unit behind, when only one part was damaged?
It is never in our nature to criticize a customer's belongings. By instructing the Hatfields to Google "Inherent Vice Manufactured Wood Furniture", it was our intent to educate them that these items are more susceptible to damage than real wood items. Repairing them can be difficult, but not impossible. If we see that something is impossible to repair, most manufactured wood manufacturers can supply parts and components because they know that these things can happen.
Since Ms. [redacted] wasn't satisfied with the repairs, we contacted the Rogards Office Supply, where they purchased the item for replacement parts. We are attaching an email request from Rogards, plus their response, and a continuing reply to Ms. [redacted] on May 8th if she wished to continue. We have not heard a reply from neither that Hatfields.
Finally, we have never called anyone's goods "garbage". As stated earlier, we respect everyone's belongings because it is the best they can afford. Reviewing our email string with Ms. [redacted], we are curious if they can produce any email from us calling her stuff "garbage". I think Mr. or Ms. [redacted] may have misread the word "garage' as "garbage in our May 5 email (see attachment).
Also, in answering the [redacted]'s remarks as to spending "nearly $10,000 to move... only to have numberous (sic) other items, then fail to fix or replacy (sic) any of it when the claim is filed is just poor business" is unfounded. Attached is the claim settlement letter from United Van Lines. Also, the [redacted]'s moving charges were only $6554.91 not nearly $10,000, as stated. I hope they understand their embellishment of such charges can weaken their arguments.
For now, we believe a payment for the right side panel and back panel for $256.00 is in order to settle this issue. Had they heeded our instruction and forwarded the desk set to FL, this issue would have been resolved last November, 2014 with the other United Van Lines claim instead of the present.
Final Consumer Response /* (4200, 11, 2015/06/04) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
We do not accept the proposed resolution for the following reasons:
First, we were given the OPTION to leave the desk behind to be dealt with by [redacted]/United Van Lines. Had we been told from the beginning it was going to cause this much issue and that it needed to be fixed in Florida we would have taken the desk with us. As we had and have EVERY intention of taking the desk with us to Florida, in contrary to what [redacted] has said and implied.
Second, our first quote from [redacted] to move our belongings to Florida was approximatly $9,000. However, we sold numerous items bringing the final moving cost down to $6554.91. For [redacted] to say "it ONLY cost $6554.91" is insulting, just as all of the other conversations have been with him. He has insulted the quality of our furniture, our means of storage, our money, our choices and words. $6554.91 is A LOT of money to us and many other people. To a million dollar company it may seem like a small amount. This is just simply poor customer service.
Third, on 5/5/2015 [redacted] asked in an email for all further communications to be through him and via phone. That did not happen and is why [redacted] has not responed to his email regarding the replacement pieces at Rogards.
Fourth, we believe to settle this issue we should be paid the amount it would cost us to replace and repurchase the hutch that was broken(approximatly $895). We do not want replacement pieces. The desk was brand new and in perfect condition when [redacted] movers damaged it. When we recieve the money, we will be more than happy to pick up the desk from [redacted] and move it to Florida ourselves.
Fifth, we have pictures we would like to share of the unacceptable repairs that [redacted] believes we should accept, however there is not an option for attachments on our response. We hope Hutchcrat understands how unprofessional this repair work makes their claims against us. As you will see, no one would accept this type of repair work on a $2300 desk that was in brand new condition. We also do not agree with replacing just the pieces. We have already witnessed the type of repair work done by Timberline and do not want to deal with more issues from shotty repair work.
Sixth, you can see in the attachements from [redacted] that we had several other items damaged and that only one item was paid for and the others denied. We reluctanlty settled on those. Yet, we are paying money out of our own pocket to have those items repaired.
Seventh, we are just as ready as [redacted] to settle this issue. We would like to have the desk in Florida to use as we have been without it for nine months.
Eighth, the words "buried in" was used in the email from [redacted] on 5/5/2015 in regards to how the desk was stored in the garage. This was taken in a deragatory and insulting manner. [redacted] from Timeberline, who came to see the desk at my fathers and later did the repairs, told my father (who was there to let him in to see the damage) that the repairs would have to be done at his shop. The desk was not moved and picked up by [redacted] and taken to Timberline because [redacted] couldn't get to it. It was because it needed to be repaired at his shop. Why would [redacted] think the desk would not need to be moved to be repaired? Why would repairs be done in someone's garage without tools and equipment? In regards to the scratch, it was placed in my parents garage by [redacted] and was not again moved or touched until they picked it up again to take it to Timberline. So we believe the scratch happened when [redacted] movers moved the desk for the third time.
Ninth, we would like to reiterate we have used [redacted] movers in the past and had zero complaints or issues. We used their services for our move to Florida because we felt they did a good job in the past. This current experience is not what we expected from them based on our previous interactions.
Lastly, if we cannot settle this issue amicably and reasonably we will be forced to seek legal action. As we have already discussed this ongoing issue with an attorney and are ready to move forward if needed. We have opted to wait to use that option in hopes we can settle this issue amongst ourselves.