I am rejecting this response because: Inver Grove Ford has an obligation to stand by there workmanship through there 25mo WarrantySince there was other suspicious issues while working with them I had the vehicle evaluated and repaired elsewhereThis cost additional expense that was caused by this dealer
Initial Business Response / [redacted] (1000, 6, 2015/09/24) */ We are unable to buy Mr [redacted] 's Car back for what he owes on itHe brought to our attention on 9/23/that it has frame damage as noted on a vehicle history reportIt does state frame/unibody damage as a result of a minor to moderate damage impactThe title is clean and we sold the car as suchEfforts to work with Mr [redacted] were futileThe value of the car is not determined by what he owes on it Initial Consumer Rebuttal / [redacted] (2000, 8, 2015/09/25) */ (The consumer indicated he/she ACCEPTED the response from the business.) OkWe will not being business anymore
Initial Business Response / [redacted] (1000, 6, 2015/09/25) */ Vehicle is out of all factory warranty coverage. The estimate to replace the engine was $7213.90. Ford offered assistance that brought the customers cost down to $3012.98 plus tax. This doesn't include the initial bill of $634.01. Service... records provided indicate 4 oil changes in 64,000 miles, with one gap being 29,338 miles. No other assistance can be offered at this time. Initial Consumer Rebuttal / [redacted] (3000, 8, 2015/09/28) */ (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.) Please see attached response for not accepting the response from Inver Grove Ford/Ford Motor Company. BBB Note: Response from customer reads as follows: In reviewing the fault codes provided to the dealer at the time the vehicle was presented, the codes indicated misfire on cylinders 4, 5, 6. Other codes were displayed that are related to the basic fault codes of P0304, P0305 and P0306. As noted in the original complaint, the dealer "needed to investigate" because they were "were not sure of what the problem was". Hence, the solution was to do a tune up and replace the spark plugs. Logic would suggest that if the engine is firing, the spark plugs are at the end of the process of ignition and something upstream is at fault vs the spark plugs. When the tune up failed to resolve the issue, the dealer "thought" the problem would be related to the Power Converter Module (PCM) and suggested replacement. Replacing the PCM, again, failed to resolve the issue and the dealer suggested looking at the oil pan sludge. Again, logic seems faulty that if there is an issue with ignition, the problem is in the oil pan. It was suggested to the dealer that they investigate perhaps the issue was related to excess oil that may be on the COP due to poor gasket sealing of the valve covers. This suggesting was made after I commented to the Dealer Service representative that there appeared to be an oil leak as I recently noticed oil drops on the garage floor where the vehicle was parked. Following an internet search for the noted fault codes on the internet, every website, regardless of vehicle type, had the same suggestion of trouble shooting the COP BEFORE doing anything else. Specifically at this website: http://easyautodiagnostics.com/ford/3.0L-3.8L/testing-the-escape-cop-coils-1 suggests that if "The COP coil DID NOT spark and WAS covered in oil: This tells you that the COP coil is BAD and needs to be replaced to solve the misfire condition and that you'll need to replace the valve cover gaskets." This information was completely ignored by the Dealer representative and he insisted that the issue to be determined by checking the oil pan. Following the oil pan check the dealer informed me that the misfire issue was due to "spun bearings". Hence the dealer solution to the electrical problem was engine replacement, totally ignoring the fact of my suggestion of checking the COP and potential issue of a poor valve gasket seal causing the oil leak and COP and subsequent ignition of the spark plugs to malfunction. Additional internet investigation of 'spun bearings' and mechanical symptoms related to spun bearings were not apparent, due to the fact that there was not audible knocking, ticking or mechanical sound noted at the time the vehicle was presented for service. The dealer notes that there is a long gap in mileage between oil changes which suggests this is the result of the mechanical issue. Again, the vehicle was presented with electrical ignition, diagnosed as cylinder misfire issues not mechanical issues. The fact remains that the vehicle had been serviced and owner's manual simply has 'recommended' intervals for servicing, not required. However, that is an easy scapegoat and out for any responsibility by the dealership. The vehicle was just slightly 4,000 miles in warranty and once again, logic would suggest that engine replacement as a solution to a diagnosed misfire condition is excessive. Although the dealership did offer partial consideration to replace the engine, the reasons cited for not covering the full amount is due to the extended time between one of the oil changes and that I did not have a "high customer loyalty score". Please, simply by offering some consideration is apparent that Ford acknowledges some responsibility, but is not willing to accept full responsibility of either failing to diagnose the root cause of the misfire or the fact that spun bearings may be more related to poor quality and workmanship. How does Ford expect me, or anyone else, to be a "loyal customer" if they do not accept responsibility and truly taking care of customers? I am a responsible consumer and with the decision by the dealership have dissipated the consumer's dealer loyalty. In conclusion, I respectfully request the dealership and Ford Motor Company to reconsider full consideration of engine replacement and I would be responsible for the amount of consideration due to diagnosis that I agreed to for the initial trouble shooting and tune up, which again, did not result in any resolution to the issue of misfire. With favorable reconsideration, both "customer" "dealer" loyalties are maintained and there is a win for both parties. Final Business Response / [redacted] (4000, 11, 2015/10/13) */ I appreciate and understand Mr. [redacted] 's concerns however the vehicle is 4000 miles out of warranty (Not in warranty as he states). Mr. [redacted] may not agree with the process that the Ford certified technician followed to diagnose the repair but he ultimately did find the cause. Ford has offered a partial consideration as goodwill and will not cover 100% of the repairs. Inver Grove Ford does not warrant the vehicle and is unable to absorb the cost to repair. The suggestion that maintenance is only recommended and not required is ludicrous. Vehicles require regular oil changes. Inver Grove Ford is in no way responsible for the engine damage on the vehicle and cannot offer any financial assistance at this time.
I am rejecting this response because: Inver Grove Ford has an obligation to stand by there workmanship through there 25mo WarrantySince there was other suspicious issues while working with them I had the vehicle evaluated and repaired elsewhereThis cost additional expense that was caused by this dealer
Initial Business Response / [redacted] (1000, 6, 2015/09/24) */ We are unable to buy Mr [redacted] 's Car back for what he owes on itHe brought to our attention on 9/23/that it has frame damage as noted on a vehicle history reportIt does state frame/unibody damage as a result of a minor to moderate damage impactThe title is clean and we sold the car as suchEfforts to work with Mr [redacted] were futileThe value of the car is not determined by what he owes on it Initial Consumer Rebuttal / [redacted] (2000, 8, 2015/09/25) */ (The consumer indicated he/she ACCEPTED the response from the business.) OkWe will not being business anymore
Initial Business Response / [redacted] (1000, 6, 2015/09/25) */ Vehicle is out of all factory warranty coverage. The estimate to replace the engine was $7213.90. Ford offered assistance that brought the customers cost down to $3012.98 plus tax. This doesn't include the initial bill of $634.01. Service... records provided indicate 4 oil changes in 64,000 miles, with one gap being 29,338 miles. No other assistance can be offered at this time. Initial Consumer Rebuttal / [redacted] (3000, 8, 2015/09/28) */ (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.) Please see attached response for not accepting the response from Inver Grove Ford/Ford Motor Company. BBB Note: Response from customer reads as follows: In reviewing the fault codes provided to the dealer at the time the vehicle was presented, the codes indicated misfire on cylinders 4, 5, 6. Other codes were displayed that are related to the basic fault codes of P0304, P0305 and P0306. As noted in the original complaint, the dealer "needed to investigate" because they were "were not sure of what the problem was". Hence, the solution was to do a tune up and replace the spark plugs. Logic would suggest that if the engine is firing, the spark plugs are at the end of the process of ignition and something upstream is at fault vs the spark plugs. When the tune up failed to resolve the issue, the dealer "thought" the problem would be related to the Power Converter Module (PCM) and suggested replacement. Replacing the PCM, again, failed to resolve the issue and the dealer suggested looking at the oil pan sludge. Again, logic seems faulty that if there is an issue with ignition, the problem is in the oil pan. It was suggested to the dealer that they investigate perhaps the issue was related to excess oil that may be on the COP due to poor gasket sealing of the valve covers. This suggesting was made after I commented to the Dealer Service representative that there appeared to be an oil leak as I recently noticed oil drops on the garage floor where the vehicle was parked. Following an internet search for the noted fault codes on the internet, every website, regardless of vehicle type, had the same suggestion of trouble shooting the COP BEFORE doing anything else. Specifically at this website: http://easyautodiagnostics.com/ford/3.0L-3.8L/testing-the-escape-cop-coils-1 suggests that if "The COP coil DID NOT spark and WAS covered in oil: This tells you that the COP coil is BAD and needs to be replaced to solve the misfire condition and that you'll need to replace the valve cover gaskets." This information was completely ignored by the Dealer representative and he insisted that the issue to be determined by checking the oil pan. Following the oil pan check the dealer informed me that the misfire issue was due to "spun bearings". Hence the dealer solution to the electrical problem was engine replacement, totally ignoring the fact of my suggestion of checking the COP and potential issue of a poor valve gasket seal causing the oil leak and COP and subsequent ignition of the spark plugs to malfunction. Additional internet investigation of 'spun bearings' and mechanical symptoms related to spun bearings were not apparent, due to the fact that there was not audible knocking, ticking or mechanical sound noted at the time the vehicle was presented for service. The dealer notes that there is a long gap in mileage between oil changes which suggests this is the result of the mechanical issue. Again, the vehicle was presented with electrical ignition, diagnosed as cylinder misfire issues not mechanical issues. The fact remains that the vehicle had been serviced and owner's manual simply has 'recommended' intervals for servicing, not required. However, that is an easy scapegoat and out for any responsibility by the dealership. The vehicle was just slightly 4,000 miles in warranty and once again, logic would suggest that engine replacement as a solution to a diagnosed misfire condition is excessive. Although the dealership did offer partial consideration to replace the engine, the reasons cited for not covering the full amount is due to the extended time between one of the oil changes and that I did not have a "high customer loyalty score". Please, simply by offering some consideration is apparent that Ford acknowledges some responsibility, but is not willing to accept full responsibility of either failing to diagnose the root cause of the misfire or the fact that spun bearings may be more related to poor quality and workmanship. How does Ford expect me, or anyone else, to be a "loyal customer" if they do not accept responsibility and truly taking care of customers? I am a responsible consumer and with the decision by the dealership have dissipated the consumer's dealer loyalty. In conclusion, I respectfully request the dealership and Ford Motor Company to reconsider full consideration of engine replacement and I would be responsible for the amount of consideration due to diagnosis that I agreed to for the initial trouble shooting and tune up, which again, did not result in any resolution to the issue of misfire. With favorable reconsideration, both "customer" "dealer" loyalties are maintained and there is a win for both parties. Final Business Response / [redacted] (4000, 11, 2015/10/13) */ I appreciate and understand Mr. [redacted] 's concerns however the vehicle is 4000 miles out of warranty (Not in warranty as he states). Mr. [redacted] may not agree with the process that the Ford certified technician followed to diagnose the repair but he ultimately did find the cause. Ford has offered a partial consideration as goodwill and will not cover 100% of the repairs. Inver Grove Ford does not warrant the vehicle and is unable to absorb the cost to repair. The suggestion that maintenance is only recommended and not required is ludicrous. Vehicles require regular oil changes. Inver Grove Ford is in no way responsible for the engine damage on the vehicle and cannot offer any financial assistance at this time.