Invision Power Services, Inc.

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response offer made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below
During the purchase of Invision's services back in 2009, their agreement and terms of service indicated that we, the customer, would be provided download access to what we rightfully paid for indefinitely, even after the subscription endedThe agreement clearly stated the subscription would cover support on their website and ticket system only usable to subscribed membersWe were fully aware that once the subscription ended, that support would end, however the downloads to the products that we purchased would be available for us if we so needed it anytime after the subscription
Since then, Invision has changed their practices as well as their terms of service (which is not what we agreed to back in 2009)They are also known for strong-arming people out of previous payments for things such as life time subscriptionsTheir business practices have been less than stellar since their "renovation" of staff and company imageTheir feedback forums show a handful of unsatisfied customers as Invision is going back on their own agreements in many different cases because they are more interested in money then their customers.
I do not accept this response from Invision because it does not adhere to the contract and agreement I agreed to when I made my purchase
Regards,
*** ***

They finally did the right thing even though they were rude to me through the whole process, They need to change their attitude towards long time customers before they loose all of us and become like vbulletin, a dead project
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and find that this resolution would be satisfactory to me. I will wait for the business to perform this action and, if it does, will consider this complaint resolved
Regards,
*** ***

As a gesture of sheer goodwill, a refund of $has been processedIPS will have no further business with Mr*** and we consider this matter closed

The customer purchased a license for our community forum software nearly a decade ago. As the Internet has progressed, so too has our product line. "Invision Power Board" will no longer exist with the next major release. IPS4 Community Suite is a brand new, from the ground up, product line that Mr....

[redacted]'s license is not compatible with. Because of the goodwill built with earlier customers, we extended an offer to upgrade "legacy" licenses to our new product and platform free of charge and in fact, with a $100 account credit. This would essentially provide yet 2 more years of renewals. Unfortunately, a select few believe that a purchase made a decade ago should entitle one to everything our company does -- in fact, Mr. [redacted] indicates just that in his complaint. I'm afraid that's not a realistic expectation. 
 
The alternative to upgrading is to retain the legacy license and continue using Invision Power Board (3.x) which will be maintained and supported for the foreseeable future. Given Mr. [redacted]'s discontent, we are going to suggest that approach and not extend the offer of upgrade.

The customer is not being accurate with his fact reporting. :)On January 17 - customer downloaded the core software: [redacted]_Customers_[redacted] The customer then tried to download third party modifications (not tied to the license) - however,...

that system was temporarily offline for maintenance. The warning of a "fine" in the future was related to the customer submitting an emergency support request because he could not download applications from third parties unrelated to IPS. Per the customer's own correspondence, he immediately opened a [redacted] dispute claim and said he would close it once the system undergoing maintenance was back online: [redacted]_Support_Requests__Why_no_access_[redacted]Because we sell electronic service and not tangible goods, there is no guarantee that we would "win" a [redacted] chargeback and occasionally, we don't. The funds to cover the disputed transaction are immediately debited from the company - so in essence, we have not been paid for the transaction. Our policy, as noted at [redacted] indicate that a chargeback will result in account termination. From our perspective, the customer electronically downloaded what he paid for - OUR software - then proceeded to file a chargeback against the transaction with us on the premise that he couldn't immediately download from third parties, unrelated to his transaction with us. We would not be interested in reversing this transaction at this time as the customer was able to download the software as evident from the first attached screenshot which includes the customer's IP address. He was also able to contact technical support and those two items are the only two obligations bound to the license agreement / purchase. The third party marketplace downloads are provided as a convenience service independent of the IPS software license. The customer was not within right to perform a chargeback and this complaint is without merit. Regards, [redacted]Chief Executive OfficerInvision Power Services, Inc.

I have reviewed the response offer made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
I have not received any moneys back and they have banned me from their site.
[redacted] does not do chargebacks as as this was not a credit card purchase, [redacted] is waiting for response from IPSin regards to the funds but IPS has still not refunded the money they owe me. The license money is for 6 months license of which only 10 days have been used on it, not a single download of their software.They have cancelled my license without giving the funds back to paypal. If they pay [redacted] my moneythe [redacted] dispute will end, but they have not.

Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response offer made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
The company claims that Invision Power Board will no longer exist but their own site shows otherwise:
[redacted]
"The new Suite approach will see IP.Board become an application under the Suite"
 
While the license structure is changing a new Invision Power Board will exist and my existing license entitled me to all future versions of Invision Power Board. It shouldn't matter when I purchased my license because there was no limit on the term of the license.
You can also see how difficult the company is to work with since they are rescinding the offer to me that they offered to all the people that have my license just because I have a disagreement with their policy and opened a complaint with the Revdex.com.
 
I stand by my previous statement: This issue will only be resolved with me if they offer the updated application as promised or terminate the license from their end and issue a full refund (this is part of the license).
Regards,
[redacted]

When you contacted us not even two weeks ago, you claimed the buyer did a chargeback "a couple weeks later." In this ticket you claim within 4 days. You reported to the Revdex.com that "the startup fees of their blog and gallery software, and the monthly payments made thereafter for $30 a month to keep my...

services from expiring." 1. According to our records, you never bought blog. 2. The fee was $30 per YEAR. 3. You only paid that fee one time... in 2012 and you then did a chargeback on that, which is why your license was indefinitely terminated per our Standards of Service, even in 2012. [redacted] This is the dialogue from 2012: ----------------[redacted]Hello, I tried logging in with my account details, but it wouldn't let me login. When I tried to reset the password, it said my account couldn't be found.--Hello,That license is under [redacted] - is this an email address you have access to?-[redacted].Invision Power Services, Inc.--[redacted]01 July 2012 - 04:42 PMHello, I actually don't recognize that email. I don't recall changing it.--Hello,Is it possible you sold the account to someone else, perhaps?-[redacted].Invision Power Services, Inc.--[redacted]04 July 2012 - 04:32 PMNo.I haven't done anything with my account since 2008 since I haven't needed my license # until recently.--Hello, [redacted]---------------- You now admit you did sell the license and thus were dishonest about the account being compromised, which wasted our time in chasing something that didn't exist. Your pattern of honesty here is not particularly stellar. Ultimately, you sold the license and provided access to your account. The buyer purportedly did a chargeback and you expected us to recover your license for you, even after you transferred it without authorization and provided access to the software against the terms of the license agreement. Because we have no way of knowing whether the scheme is on the buyer or seller's end (many buyers would sell a license, then claim it was "stolen", take it back and sell it again) - we did not and do not intervene. Our current transfer mechanism provides for owner verification via security Q&A challenge and e-mail verification. If a license is transferred via that mechanism, it is deemed permanent and irreversible. You stated "loss of my purchases were due to theft which I could not prevent" but in fact, you could have prevented your account takeover by not selling the license and providing your access details. Perpetual licenses were non-transferrable and this is of course why you chose that method to "transfer" the license. I'm sorry you chose to be dishonest with us from the beginning rather than simply being straightforward and enlisting our potential assistance. You sold your license and the buyer purportedly "scammed" you. While indeed unfortunate, I suggest accepting appropriate responsibility for your decision. I believe you would be best served by seeking the guidance from legal counsel before proceeding with further claims.

This customer appears perpetually confused. Customer acknowledges that the license expires in six months, but seems to be confused that.... the license expires in six months from the purchase date. Customer purchased the license in May of 2009, which allowed access to downloads, support,...

upgrades until November 2009. He/she never renewed and thus, never had access to further downloads or updates. The version that would have been available in November of 2009, has been EOL (End of Life) for several years now and thus not available. The customer may upgrade by renewing the license under the terms. [redacted]

Review: On October 2 2006, I purchased an IPB Forum license for the amount of 185.00 USD. At that time, it was considered a perpetual license which did not require renewal, something which you cannot buy from this company. Around October. June 1 2012, I made the decision to sell the account at an Auction to [redacted] for 220.00 USD on [redacted]. The selling of a forum license is supported within the terms of the company. In 2012 they did not have a policy/method of transferring license internally, so the seller had to do it themselves. The account was transferred over to the buyer as per the agreement and the funds of 220 USD were received through [redacted]. 4 days after the transaction, the buyer disputed their bank in order to reverse charges. [redacted] didn't offer any support to resolve the issue and the amount of 220 USD was posted to my collections. When I confronted the company to recover my license they told me 'Nice try. You sold it in an auction.' When I confronted the company regarding the theft of my license, they told me they could not be bothered and told me to buy a new license. As a company that uses any means to prevent the theft of their software, they do not protect their customers from theft themselves even though they openly support the resale of their product, even providing official means of doing so today.Desired Settlement: As as a perpetual license can no longer be purchased, I want my license, account, and services restored to me as the loss of my purchases were due to theft which I could not prevent and the arrogance and neglect of the company's staff. If an agreement can not be met, I want a reimbursement of 'all services' I have ever purchased through this company. This includes the refund of my Forum License for 185 USD, the startup fees of their blog and gallery software, and the monthly payments made thereafter for $30 a month to keep my services from expiring.

Business

Response:

When you contacted us not even two weeks ago, you claimed the buyer did a chargeback "a couple weeks later." In this ticket you claim within 4 days. You reported to the Revdex.com that "the startup fees of their blog and gallery software, and the monthly payments made thereafter for $30 a month to keep my services from expiring." 1. According to our records, you never bought blog. 2. The fee was $30 per YEAR. 3. You only paid that fee one time... in 2012 and you then did a chargeback on that, which is why your license was indefinitely terminated per our Standards of Service, even in 2012. [redacted] This is the dialogue from 2012: ----------------[redacted]Hello, I tried logging in with my account details, but it wouldn't let me login. When I tried to reset the password, it said my account couldn't be found.--Hello,That license is under [redacted] - is this an email address you have access to?-[redacted].Invision Power Services, Inc.--[redacted]01 July 2012 - 04:42 PMHello, I actually don't recognize that email. I don't recall changing it.--Hello,Is it possible you sold the account to someone else, perhaps?-[redacted].Invision Power Services, Inc.--[redacted]04 July 2012 - 04:32 PMNo.I haven't done anything with my account since 2008 since I haven't needed my license # until recently.--Hello, [redacted]---------------- You now admit you did sell the license and thus were dishonest about the account being compromised, which wasted our time in chasing something that didn't exist. Your pattern of honesty here is not particularly stellar. Ultimately, you sold the license and provided access to your account. The buyer purportedly did a chargeback and you expected us to recover your license for you, even after you transferred it without authorization and provided access to the software against the terms of the license agreement. Because we have no way of knowing whether the scheme is on the buyer or seller's end (many buyers would sell a license, then claim it was "stolen", take it back and sell it again) - we did not and do not intervene. Our current transfer mechanism provides for owner verification via security Q&A challenge and e-mail verification. If a license is transferred via that mechanism, it is deemed permanent and irreversible. You stated "loss of my purchases were due to theft which I could not prevent" but in fact, you could have prevented your account takeover by not selling the license and providing your access details. Perpetual licenses were non-transferrable and this is of course why you chose that method to "transfer" the license. I'm sorry you chose to be dishonest with us from the beginning rather than simply being straightforward and enlisting our potential assistance. You sold your license and the buyer purportedly "scammed" you. While indeed unfortunate, I suggest accepting appropriate responsibility for your decision. I believe you would be best served by seeking the guidance from legal counsel before proceeding with further claims.

Review: In March 2006 I purchased a perpetual license for Invision Power Board which entitled me to "all future versions" of the software. Fast forward to 2014 and they are getting ready to come out with version 4 of Invision Power Board and they are denying anyone with this type of license access because they state that the "software has been rewritten" and "the license structure has changed". I feel that for as long as Invision Poiwer Board is being sold they should be obligated to deliver the product to me.Desired Settlement: I think the right outcome would be Invision Power Services honoring their original agreement and offering all current and future versions of Invision Power Board to anyone who have a lifetime or perpetual license.

If they refuse to do this the only other outcome is they are violating their original agreement with us and have to issue a full refund via check (NOT store credit) to anyone who has this kind of license and requests it since they are not fulfilling what was promised when the order was placed. It shouldn't be on the consumer if the company isn't able to fulfill what they promised.

Business

Response:

The customer purchased a license for our community forum software nearly a decade ago. As the Internet has progressed, so too has our product line. "Invision Power Board" will no longer exist with the next major release. IPS4 Community Suite is a brand new, from the ground up, product line that Mr. [redacted]'s license is not compatible with. Because of the goodwill built with earlier customers, we extended an offer to upgrade "legacy" licenses to our new product and platform free of charge and in fact, with a $100 account credit. This would essentially provide yet 2 more years of renewals. Unfortunately, a select few believe that a purchase made a decade ago should entitle one to everything our company does -- in fact, Mr. [redacted] indicates just that in his complaint. I'm afraid that's not a realistic expectation.

The alternative to upgrading is to retain the legacy license and continue using Invision Power Board (3.x) which will be maintained and supported for the foreseeable future. Given Mr. [redacted]'s discontent, we are going to suggest that approach and not extend the offer of upgrade.

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response offer made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

The company claims that Invision Power Board will no longer exist but their own site shows otherwise:

"The new Suite approach will see IP.Board become an application under the Suite"

While the license structure is changing a new Invision Power Board will exist and my existing license entitled me to all future versions of Invision Power Board. It shouldn't matter when I purchased my license because there was no limit on the term of the license.

You can also see how difficult the company is to work with since they are rescinding the offer to me that they offered to all the people that have my license just because I have a disagreement with their policy and opened a complaint with the Revdex.com.

I stand by my previous statement: This issue will only be resolved with me if they offer the updated application as promised or terminate the license from their end and issue a full refund (this is part of the license).

Regards,

Review: I renewed my 6 month licesne with them for Jan 08 2015, ie:

License to use and have support for forum software which includes

access to extensions to the software. On Jan 17th I tried to access

the licensed download section and was denied access.

I put in a support ticket and was told that he would fine me for

putting wrong level on urgency of ticket, the customer service then

cancelled my license because of this ticket. I put in a [redacted] dispute to get my money back

and went back to IPS Invision Power Services Client area where I received a message: "you are not allowed to visit this comunity"

The [redacted] dispute I then promoted to a claim. No response from IPS.Desired Settlement: Would like my money back since I never got use of license more than 9 days out of 6 months and also had to

stop using the forum software and my site is now offline and I am loosing ad revenue.

Business

Response:

The customer is not being accurate with his fact reporting. :)On January 17 - customer downloaded the core software: [redacted]_Customers_[redacted] The customer then tried to download third party modifications (not tied to the license) - however, that system was temporarily offline for maintenance. The warning of a "fine" in the future was related to the customer submitting an emergency support request because he could not download applications from third parties unrelated to IPS. Per the customer's own correspondence, he immediately opened a [redacted] dispute claim and said he would close it once the system undergoing maintenance was back online: [redacted]_Support_Requests__Why_no_access_[redacted]Because we sell electronic service and not tangible goods, there is no guarantee that we would "win" a [redacted] chargeback and occasionally, we don't. The funds to cover the disputed transaction are immediately debited from the company - so in essence, we have not been paid for the transaction. Our policy, as noted at [redacted] indicate that a chargeback will result in account termination. From our perspective, the customer electronically downloaded what he paid for - OUR software - then proceeded to file a chargeback against the transaction with us on the premise that he couldn't immediately download from third parties, unrelated to his transaction with us. We would not be interested in reversing this transaction at this time as the customer was able to download the software as evident from the first attached screenshot which includes the customer's IP address. He was also able to contact technical support and those two items are the only two obligations bound to the license agreement / purchase. The third party marketplace downloads are provided as a convenience service independent of the IPS software license. The customer was not within right to perform a chargeback and this complaint is without merit. Regards, [redacted]Chief Executive OfficerInvision Power Services, Inc.

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response offer made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

I have not received any moneys back and they have banned me from their site.

[redacted] does not do chargebacks as as this was not a credit card purchase, [redacted] is waiting for response from IPSin regards to the funds but IPS has still not refunded the money they owe me. The license money is for 6 months license of which only 10 days have been used on it, not a single download of their software.They have cancelled my license without giving the funds back to paypal. If they pay [redacted] my moneythe [redacted] dispute will end, but they have not.

Business

Response:

As a gesture of sheer goodwill, a refund of $25 has been processed. IPS will have no further business with Mr. [redacted] and we consider this matter closed.

Consumer

Response:

They finally did the right thing even though they were rude to me through the whole process, They need to change their attitude towards long time customers before they loose all of us and become like vbulletin, a dead project.

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and find that this resolution would be satisfactory to me. I will wait for the business to perform this action and, if it does, will consider this complaint resolved.

Regards,

Review: Myself and a business partner purchased a collection of tools from Invision back in 2009 where the agreement (ToS/ToU) stated that our purchase would entitle us to download what we had paid for for life. The contract stated that we were entitled to updates and support for up to 6 months after the purchase date, afterward we would have to renew the license to continue getting updates and support. However, the contract stated and implied that we are entitled to the product we purchased after this six month time period, giving us full access to the product version that was last released within those six months.

Our website has been using this software since 2009 and we have never once had any complaint from Invision or in our admin panel stating that we had to agree to some new contract, or that our service would be shutoff and discontinued.

On October 7, 2014, we attempted to redownload the core files our website was using to fix some bugs and correct some issues. However, we were greeted with a requirement to pay $35 to renew a license that is still valid and active, and has already been paid for and agreed to a previous contract back in 2009 in order to download the files we ALREADY paid for.Desired Settlement: As a settlement, we just want what we already paid for. Full access to the content (IP.Board and IP.Downloads) upto the date that was covered by the contract we paid for and agreed to. If that cannot be reached, a refund would be nice as we are being frauded of a product we already paid for and rightfully own.

Business

Response:

This customer appears perpetually confused. Customer acknowledges that the license expires in six months, but seems to be confused that.... the license expires in six months from the purchase date. Customer purchased the license in May of 2009, which allowed access to downloads, support, upgrades until November 2009. He/she never renewed and thus, never had access to further downloads or updates. The version that would have been available in November of 2009, has been EOL (End of Life) for several years now and thus not available. The customer may upgrade by renewing the license under the terms. [redacted]

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response offer made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

During the purchase of Invision's services back in 2009, their agreement and terms of service indicated that we, the customer, would be provided download access to what we rightfully paid for indefinitely, even after the subscription ended. The agreement clearly stated the subscription would cover support on their website and ticket system only usable to subscribed members. We were fully aware that once the subscription ended, that support would end, however the downloads to the products that we purchased would be available for us if we so needed it anytime after the subscription.

Since then, Invision has changed their practices as well as their terms of service (which is not what we agreed to back in 2009). They are also known for strong-arming people out of previous payments for things such as life time subscriptions. Their business practices have been less than stellar since their "renovation" of staff and company image. Their feedback forums show a handful of unsatisfied customers as Invision is going back on their own agreements in many different cases because they are more interested in money then their customers.

I do not accept this response from Invision because it does not adhere to the contract and agreement I agreed to when I made my purchase.

Regards,