Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response submitted by the business and have determined that the response does not satisfy or resolve my issues and/or concerns in reference to complaint # [redacted]. Please add your rejection comments below.
We do not accept [redacted] response, which continues to avoid the bottom line: he gave us a fixed price for a job whichwe paid in full. As first-time users of the Revdex.com, we would like to commend its staff for excellent service andassistance. Despite years of working with companies across the U.S. and in Europe, this is the first time we’ve felt the need to issue a complaint. Based on information relayed to us by the Revdex.com, we have also filed a complaint with the Law Center’s Local Consumer Program through Middlesex County, andthank the Revdex.com for informing us about this other additional resource for customers.?
Regards,
[redacted]
I have read the response. For clarification - when I described the first estimate via phone, I was indicating that no property walk through had been done with the client nor was there one requested and that the estimate was based off the previous work done on the property and no indications were made to us otherwise. These transactions did happen over email. I believe that that this mis-understanding stems from the initial communications. I stated this in my original response. Mary indicates in her own words that she emailed the office to "confirm" pricing. Again, pricing was based off the previous work that had been done. See below:2010-Fall Clean Up-$5752011-Spring Clean Up-$375 & Fall Clean Up-$5752012-Fall Clean Up-$6752013-no work doneWe had assumed that she would have had work done in 2013, perhaps by another company, but nothing was done. The latest fall clean up in 2012 was $675.00. The spring clean up in 2011 was $375.00. We are not currently offering 2011 rates to any client. The 2014 spring clean up estimate was inline with the 2011 fall clean up, 2012 fall clean up ASSUMING that work had been done on the property in 2013, which none was. A common courtesy would have been to explain to us that the property had not been touch since we last did work in 2012, was this the clients responsibility, No, however in my experience in working with clients from year to year (even ones who leave and come back) people are honest and upfront as to the situation that we may be walking into. Did it not strike the client as odd, that the fall clean up in 2012 was $675 and with NO work being done in 2013 the spring clean up in 2014 would be less? That would basically equal a 2013 spring clean up, 2013 fall clean up both lumped into a 2014 spring clean up for less than the cost of the last clean up done by us?I initially addressed this situation as a mis-understanding / mis-communication and tried to work with this client to resolve the situation. Those efforts on my part were flat out rejected and then the threat of online complaints and bad reviews were dangled against us in exchange for us forgiving the full cost of the job. Additionally, in conversations she said that she planned to do a bigger project in the future and wanted to consider using us for this, another sort of threat dangled. Please understand that there is no incentive for me to pursue this if I did not believe the we were being taken advantage of. The difference is $400 after I reduced my hourly man rate do to any mis-understanding. If I felt that I had done any "bait and switch" would I really have rejected this clients offers not to write a bad review or file a complaint? If I were doing something wrong or deceitful why would I persist in defending? There would be no reason for me to do so.It should be noted that there were no complaints with the work that had been completed and that outside of the billing dispute they were happy with the service and work completed. I would be happy to agree as I initially proposed that there was a mis-communication / mis-understanding here on both of our parts and that no one was trying to deceive anyone and work to come to a settlement that leaves neither of us taken advantaged of. [redacted]PresidentJohn's landscape Service inc.
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response submitted by the business and have determined that the response does not satisfy or resolve my issues and/or concerns in reference to complaint # [redacted]. Please add your rejection comments below.
This is a
predictable, possibly scripted response from [redacted] which excludes
important facts and contains statements which are untrue and/or irrelevant.
Bottom line: he gave a fixed-price quote in writing for a Spring Clean
Up, not a renewed service (we have never had a Service Agreement with John's
Landscape), and then deviated significantly from it with multiple bills
inflated up to 248% after the fact. We paid him the quoted price of $575.
He states in his response to Revdex.com
that a quote was given over the phone. This is not true. It was all done
in writing. He tries to suggest that the quote he gave was the 'same' as for
previous work. That is untrue. Contrary to what John tries to claim to
support his behavior, the upfront price his company gave us in writing for the
2014 Spring Clean Up ($575.00) was 53% higher than the price he gave us for
the Spring 2011 Clean Up ($375.00). We trusted this increase was based on
his judgment as a landscaper, agreed to it, and scheduled the work. We are not landscapers.
It is not our job to determine the price. It is our right to request the price
in advance, review, and decide whether or not to proceed.
His claim that the 'conditions of the property had changed significantly'
actually contradicts his argument. In fact, we have spent many thousands of
dollars on tree removal on the property between 2011 and 2014. So if anything,
the scope of the work is less, not more. Fewer trees, less debris.
It is important to note that [redacted] does not provide us with the full scope of
'Spring Clean Up' delineated by his company to include: 'clean up of all
property including beds, thatching the lawn and removing all debris.' We have
no lawn and the majority of our property is wooded. All he has ever done in
Clean Ups for us is blow debris away from the landscaped portions of the
property (minority of the land). Some of this debris they remove. Some of it
they just blow into the wooded areas of the property and never remove.
[redacted] left out of his Revdex.com response the original written correspondence
requesting and confirming the cost of the work. This email documentation
refutes his false insinuations that there was some kind of expectation or
deception on our part. There were no expectations which is why we
requested his price for a service in advance. It is strange and ridiculous to
accuse a customer of 'deception' in regards to a request for a quote. It is his
job to come up with the price. It is his right to offer or not offer the
service. The correspondence was clear, simple, and in writing:
On May 1, 2014, I emailed John’s Landscape: "We are wondering if we could
have a spring clean up – if you could confirm the prices first, that would be
great." Note there is no reference by us to any prior services,
expectation of pricing, etc. He was untruthful in his response to the
Revdex.com when he wrote "you were quite clear with telling the office that you
wanted to know if the "spring clean up" would be the same rate as in
the past." Neither I nor my husband ever said anything of the sort. In
fact, we did not discuss the rate prior to the service by phone. This was done
via email as copied here. Perhaps [redacted] is confusing us with a different client.
But he should not lie about us. Additionally, the rate he did give and
which we agreed to was not the 'same rate as in the past,' contrary to his
confabulation. It was 53% higher ($575.00 vs. $375.00) than the only other
Spring Clean Up he had ever done for us in 2011.
On May 2, 2014, [redacted] from John’s Landscape wrote: "The price for a
Spring Clean Up would be $575.00. Please let me know if you would like us to
schedule this service for you."
We agreed to the price of $575.00
given to us by John's Landscape in writing on May 2nd, 2014 (which was 53%
higher than the price we paid for Spring Clean Up in 2011), scheduled the work,
and once completed, paid in full the $575.00 his company gave to us in writing.
We received variable bills and requests for amounts inflated up to 248%
($1,425.00, $1175.00, $920.00).
There was nothing stopping [redacted] from viewing the property prior to giving the
quote in writing (for all we know, he did view the property between the May 1 request and May 2nd response).
There was nothing thwarting him from giving a different price or billing
methodology in writing when requested up front. As he notes in his Revdex.com
response, he is well aware of the previous dates he has performed Clean Ups on
our property. His company chose to respond in writing to the written May 1st request with a fixed price without contingencies at
$575.00 (53% higher than the last Spring Clean Up he did in 2011, not the
'same' as he tries to claim).
He clearly misled the client by giving a fixed price which the client agreed to
(reminiscent of the 'bait and switch' negative review on Revdex.com referred to below),
and then he charged far above and beyond that price ($1425.00, $1175.00,
$920.00 vs. the price agreed upon upfront of $575.00). He tries to blame the
client and accuses us of deception instead of taking responsibility for the
actions of his staff and himself. His company gave a fixed-price quote, the
basis on which we agreed to hire him for the work. He could have given a
different price, or a range estimate, or an hourly rate card. He could have and
may have viewed the property in advance. We may or may not have agreed to the
work. That would have been our prerogative, and that would have been honest
business.
We did not miscommunicate with
John's Landscape when we requested the price of work, scheduled it, and paid
the full $575.00. We requested whether a service was available and what it
would cost. When the service was completed, we paid that amount in full. If
there was any miscommunication here, it was between [redacted] and his own staff.
Instead of admitting and addressing those internal company issues, he tries to
place blame on and obtain additional funds (of varying amounts and rates) from
the client.
The untruths in his statements to Revdex.com continue. [redacted] writes: "I followed
up with the client (at their request) and had a long conversation with [redacted]
[redacted] regarding the situation. He understood where I was coming from as I
understood where he was coming from. He said he would discuss it with his wife
and that I should outline my proposed solution in an email, which I did."
First, we never requested any additional follow-up invoicing. When we received
a bill for $1425.00, we wrote a check for $575.00 (price quoted by him) and
noted on the bill which we mailed to him with the check "Will pay agreed
upon $575.00 only (see email) - extra clean up wasn't additional it was b/c
they didn't complete the job the 1st time." [redacted] emailed more than once
trying to initiate further communication, suggesting we meet in person which we
were not comfortable doing given his odd behavior. My husband did communicate
by phone with [redacted]. My husband can and will speak for himself. [redacted] written
sum[redacted] of what my husband said in that conversation is hearsay. My husband has
a different recollection of that conversation. It is only after that phone
call, repeated variable invoices (including late fees), and several emails from
[redacted], that we felt compelled to file a complaint with the Revdex.com. I had written to
John that we would do so if he continued to bill us above and beyond the paid
amount. It is our feeling that John is trying to document a 'script' of some
sort, not based in fact and including false statements, which he can try to use
in small claims court.
Additionally:
* During the Spring 2014 Clean Up, his crew mistakenly spent time on our
neighbor's property rather than our own (there is email and photo
documentation of this), which led to a delay in the job being completed and
most certainly increased time, labor, and disposal fees on his company's part.
As [redacted] noted below, his company had removed leaves from our property on 4
previous occasions. They should be aware of our property lines by now. We
should not be held accountable for his miscommunications with and/or limited
supervision of his own staff, and certainly not for time/labor/disposal
fees incurred because they were doing the wrong property.
* We did
witness his crew blowing debris from the landscaped to the wooded areas of our
property (rather than removing), so the after-the-fact disposal fees John is
trying to claim are additionally suspect.
* Note in the email he included in his Revdex.com response, he states his rating with
the Revdex.com. He left out that he has one and only one review on the Revdex.com. It is a
negative review in which the client describes his behavior as 'bait and
switch,' which rings similarly here.
* He wrote in that same email that
he has an A rating on [redacted]. Anyone interested can join the site, view
[redacted] reviews directly, and make their own judgment as to the veracity
of John's statement regarding his rating.
As concerning as these points may be, here again is the bottom line: His
company gave a fixed price in writing for a job which we agreed to and paid in
full. If he thought he deserved more for the work, he should have communicated
that to us as we requested in advance of the work.
Regards,
[redacted]
[redacted]
Regards,
[redacted]
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response submitted by the business and have determined that the response does not satisfy or resolve my issues and/or concerns in reference to complaint # [redacted]. Please add your rejection comments below.
We do not accept [redacted] response, which continues to avoid the bottom line: he gave us a fixed price for a job whichwe paid in full. As first-time users of the Revdex.com, we would like to commend its staff for excellent service andassistance. Despite years of working with companies across the U.S. and in Europe, this is the first time we’ve felt the need to issue a complaint. Based on information relayed to us by the Revdex.com, we have also filed a complaint with the Law Center’s Local Consumer Program through Middlesex County, andthank the Revdex.com for informing us about this other additional resource for customers.?
Regards,
[redacted]
I have read the response. For clarification - when I described the first estimate via phone, I was indicating that no property walk through had been done with the client nor was there one requested and that the estimate was based off the previous work done on the property and no indications were made to us otherwise. These transactions did happen over email. I believe that that this mis-understanding stems from the initial communications. I stated this in my original response. Mary indicates in her own words that she emailed the office to "confirm" pricing. Again, pricing was based off the previous work that had been done. See below:2010-Fall Clean Up-$5752011-Spring Clean Up-$375 & Fall Clean Up-$5752012-Fall Clean Up-$6752013-no work doneWe had assumed that she would have had work done in 2013, perhaps by another company, but nothing was done. The latest fall clean up in 2012 was $675.00. The spring clean up in 2011 was $375.00. We are not currently offering 2011 rates to any client. The 2014 spring clean up estimate was inline with the 2011 fall clean up, 2012 fall clean up ASSUMING that work had been done on the property in 2013, which none was. A common courtesy would have been to explain to us that the property had not been touch since we last did work in 2012, was this the clients responsibility, No, however in my experience in working with clients from year to year (even ones who leave and come back) people are honest and upfront as to the situation that we may be walking into. Did it not strike the client as odd, that the fall clean up in 2012 was $675 and with NO work being done in 2013 the spring clean up in 2014 would be less? That would basically equal a 2013 spring clean up, 2013 fall clean up both lumped into a 2014 spring clean up for less than the cost of the last clean up done by us?I initially addressed this situation as a mis-understanding / mis-communication and tried to work with this client to resolve the situation. Those efforts on my part were flat out rejected and then the threat of online complaints and bad reviews were dangled against us in exchange for us forgiving the full cost of the job. Additionally, in conversations she said that she planned to do a bigger project in the future and wanted to consider using us for this, another sort of threat dangled. Please understand that there is no incentive for me to pursue this if I did not believe the we were being taken advantage of. The difference is $400 after I reduced my hourly man rate do to any mis-understanding. If I felt that I had done any "bait and switch" would I really have rejected this clients offers not to write a bad review or file a complaint? If I were doing something wrong or deceitful why would I persist in defending? There would be no reason for me to do so.It should be noted that there were no complaints with the work that had been completed and that outside of the billing dispute they were happy with the service and work completed. I would be happy to agree as I initially proposed that there was a mis-communication / mis-understanding here on both of our parts and that no one was trying to deceive anyone and work to come to a settlement that leaves neither of us taken advantaged of. [redacted]PresidentJohn's landscape Service inc.
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response submitted by the business and have determined that the response does not satisfy or resolve my issues and/or concerns in reference to complaint # [redacted]. Please add your rejection comments below.
This is a
predictable, possibly scripted response from [redacted] which excludes
important facts and contains statements which are untrue and/or irrelevant.
Bottom line: he gave a fixed-price quote in writing for a Spring Clean
Up, not a renewed service (we have never had a Service Agreement with John's
Landscape), and then deviated significantly from it with multiple bills
inflated up to 248% after the fact. We paid him the quoted price of $575.
He states in his response to Revdex.com
that a quote was given over the phone. This is not true. It was all done
in writing. He tries to suggest that the quote he gave was the 'same' as for
previous work. That is untrue. Contrary to what John tries to claim to
support his behavior, the upfront price his company gave us in writing for the
2014 Spring Clean Up ($575.00) was 53% higher than the price he gave us for
the Spring 2011 Clean Up ($375.00). We trusted this increase was based on
his judgment as a landscaper, agreed to it, and scheduled the work. We are not landscapers.
It is not our job to determine the price. It is our right to request the price
in advance, review, and decide whether or not to proceed.
His claim that the 'conditions of the property had changed significantly'
actually contradicts his argument. In fact, we have spent many thousands of
dollars on tree removal on the property between 2011 and 2014. So if anything,
the scope of the work is less, not more. Fewer trees, less debris.
It is important to note that [redacted] does not provide us with the full scope of
'Spring Clean Up' delineated by his company to include: 'clean up of all
property including beds, thatching the lawn and removing all debris.' We have
no lawn and the majority of our property is wooded. All he has ever done in
Clean Ups for us is blow debris away from the landscaped portions of the
property (minority of the land). Some of this debris they remove. Some of it
they just blow into the wooded areas of the property and never remove.
[redacted] left out of his Revdex.com response the original written correspondence
requesting and confirming the cost of the work. This email documentation
refutes his false insinuations that there was some kind of expectation or
deception on our part. There were no expectations which is why we
requested his price for a service in advance. It is strange and ridiculous to
accuse a customer of 'deception' in regards to a request for a quote. It is his
job to come up with the price. It is his right to offer or not offer the
service. The correspondence was clear, simple, and in writing:
On May 1, 2014, I emailed John’s Landscape: "We are wondering if we could
have a spring clean up – if you could confirm the prices first, that would be
great." Note there is no reference by us to any prior services,
expectation of pricing, etc. He was untruthful in his response to the
Revdex.com when he wrote "you were quite clear with telling the office that you
wanted to know if the "spring clean up" would be the same rate as in
the past." Neither I nor my husband ever said anything of the sort. In
fact, we did not discuss the rate prior to the service by phone. This was done
via email as copied here. Perhaps [redacted] is confusing us with a different client.
But he should not lie about us. Additionally, the rate he did give and
which we agreed to was not the 'same rate as in the past,' contrary to his
confabulation. It was 53% higher ($575.00 vs. $375.00) than the only other
Spring Clean Up he had ever done for us in 2011.
On May 2, 2014, [redacted] from John’s Landscape wrote: "The price for a
Spring Clean Up would be $575.00. Please let me know if you would like us to
schedule this service for you."
We agreed to the price of $575.00
given to us by John's Landscape in writing on May 2nd, 2014 (which was 53%
higher than the price we paid for Spring Clean Up in 2011), scheduled the work,
and once completed, paid in full the $575.00 his company gave to us in writing.
We received variable bills and requests for amounts inflated up to 248%
($1,425.00, $1175.00, $920.00).
There was nothing stopping [redacted] from viewing the property prior to giving the
quote in writing (for all we know, he did view the property between the May 1 request and May 2nd response).
There was nothing thwarting him from giving a different price or billing
methodology in writing when requested up front. As he notes in his Revdex.com
response, he is well aware of the previous dates he has performed Clean Ups on
our property. His company chose to respond in writing to the written May 1st request with a fixed price without contingencies at
$575.00 (53% higher than the last Spring Clean Up he did in 2011, not the
'same' as he tries to claim).
He clearly misled the client by giving a fixed price which the client agreed to
(reminiscent of the 'bait and switch' negative review on Revdex.com referred to below),
and then he charged far above and beyond that price ($1425.00, $1175.00,
$920.00 vs. the price agreed upon upfront of $575.00). He tries to blame the
client and accuses us of deception instead of taking responsibility for the
actions of his staff and himself. His company gave a fixed-price quote, the
basis on which we agreed to hire him for the work. He could have given a
different price, or a range estimate, or an hourly rate card. He could have and
may have viewed the property in advance. We may or may not have agreed to the
work. That would have been our prerogative, and that would have been honest
business.
We did not miscommunicate with
John's Landscape when we requested the price of work, scheduled it, and paid
the full $575.00. We requested whether a service was available and what it
would cost. When the service was completed, we paid that amount in full. If
there was any miscommunication here, it was between [redacted] and his own staff.
Instead of admitting and addressing those internal company issues, he tries to
place blame on and obtain additional funds (of varying amounts and rates) from
the client.
The untruths in his statements to Revdex.com continue. [redacted] writes: "I followed
up with the client (at their request) and had a long conversation with [redacted]
[redacted] regarding the situation. He understood where I was coming from as I
understood where he was coming from. He said he would discuss it with his wife
and that I should outline my proposed solution in an email, which I did."
First, we never requested any additional follow-up invoicing. When we received
a bill for $1425.00, we wrote a check for $575.00 (price quoted by him) and
noted on the bill which we mailed to him with the check "Will pay agreed
upon $575.00 only (see email) - extra clean up wasn't additional it was b/c
they didn't complete the job the 1st time." [redacted] emailed more than once
trying to initiate further communication, suggesting we meet in person which we
were not comfortable doing given his odd behavior. My husband did communicate
by phone with [redacted]. My husband can and will speak for himself. [redacted] written
sum[redacted] of what my husband said in that conversation is hearsay. My husband has
a different recollection of that conversation. It is only after that phone
call, repeated variable invoices (including late fees), and several emails from
[redacted], that we felt compelled to file a complaint with the Revdex.com. I had written to
John that we would do so if he continued to bill us above and beyond the paid
amount. It is our feeling that John is trying to document a 'script' of some
sort, not based in fact and including false statements, which he can try to use
in small claims court.
Additionally:
* During the Spring 2014 Clean Up, his crew mistakenly spent time on our
neighbor's property rather than our own (there is email and photo
documentation of this), which led to a delay in the job being completed and
most certainly increased time, labor, and disposal fees on his company's part.
As [redacted] noted below, his company had removed leaves from our property on 4
previous occasions. They should be aware of our property lines by now. We
should not be held accountable for his miscommunications with and/or limited
supervision of his own staff, and certainly not for time/labor/disposal
fees incurred because they were doing the wrong property.
* We did
witness his crew blowing debris from the landscaped to the wooded areas of our
property (rather than removing), so the after-the-fact disposal fees John is
trying to claim are additionally suspect.
* Note in the email he included in his Revdex.com response, he states his rating with
the Revdex.com. He left out that he has one and only one review on the Revdex.com. It is a
negative review in which the client describes his behavior as 'bait and
switch,' which rings similarly here.
* He wrote in that same email that
he has an A rating on [redacted]. Anyone interested can join the site, view
[redacted] reviews directly, and make their own judgment as to the veracity
of John's statement regarding his rating.
As concerning as these points may be, here again is the bottom line: His
company gave a fixed price in writing for a job which we agreed to and paid in
full. If he thought he deserved more for the work, he should have communicated
that to us as we requested in advance of the work.
Regards,
[redacted]
[redacted]
Regards,
[redacted]