Keener Insulating & Supply

April 21, To Whom it May Concern:
In response to the rejection sent by the customerWe would have no reason to explain that aluminum siding cannot be done if we are not aware that it is there Many factors come into play when completing existing work which we do not list on every proposal that we send since we are normally able to look at the entire job prior to placing a bid.
Regardless or where the dogs were we did not explain that we would not look at the entire job but the homeowner said we could not have access to the entire property because of the dogsAgain our GPS shows that the installers were on site at 8:a.mBlown work requires set up time Including setting up the truck, setting up the blowing machine, checking hoses, opening material, etc, so just because the men did not start actually blowing the job until 10:did not mean workingThere is a process to setting up machinery to do the workI apologize for the time that it took to get a response but we had to involve the estimator, the installers and the President of the companyWe also had to go over all of the paperwork and recost the job to ensure we were being fair in pricingAnd although I apologize for the response time, it really has no bearing on the price of the job which seems to be the concernWe clearly showed both the Revdex.com and the customer how much time was spent to do this work and feel as though we have been fair considering we were not permitted the proper access to the entire job prior to doing the jobOriginal offer of credit still stands but that is the most refund we can give without losing money to complete the areas that were insulated.Sincerely,

[To assist us in bringing this matter to a close, you must give us a reason why you are rejecting the response. If no reason is received your complaint will be closed Administratively Resolved] Complaint: [redacted]I am rejecting this response because:I have chosen to reject the company's reply due to several factors. The estimator did not explain the work could not be completed if the siding was aluminum. If he would have told me that I would have had him check the siding as I don't know the differnece between vinyl and aluminum. I would have put my dogs inside my home, however, the dogs were leashed in my yard and they could not reach my home. The estimator and mysyelf were on my rear porch briefly as he was telling me about the dog park he visits in [redacted].The estimator had to enter my property by the front gate and the dogs did not bother him. My home sits on the city sidewalk which is not in my yard and that siding could have been checked as I know now that is aluminum.
When the workers arrived at my home on December 11, 2013 I was at work as my mother was at my home and she stated they had arrived?started at approximately 10:00 AM. I understand the GPS stated 8:53 am but that doesn't necessarily mean the workers began the job at that time.
We called the company repeatedly on a weekly basis to discuss the bill due to our disstisfaction and most of the times the estimator was not available. On one occasion we spoke with the president of the company voicing our dissatisfaction with the bill and the damaged siding, he stated he would look into it and get back to us. He did not get back to us.
As far as, the work being done on the outside of the home. We did have the estimator complete an estimate and the bill was higher than it would have been if the work was done on the outside and that would be minus the two walls they worked on. The estimator stated it would cost less to complete from inside the home.
Over all the communication with the company has been very frustrating most of our calls were unreturned. the work was completed on December 11, 2013 and we received the bill shortly thereafter. We have disputed the bill for approximately 60 days which brings me to my complaint filed March 26, 2014. Sincerely,
[redacted]

April 4, 2014
To Whom It May Concern:| arm writing in response to complaint ID [redacted] for [redacted], The phase of the job that the customer is referring to was completed to the best of our ability on 12/11/13. The customer states that our installers did not come until 10:00 a.. and...

left by 100 pm. I have attached a copy of our GPS report for our truck at the customers job location that clearly indicates our truck parking on site at 8:53 a.. and leaving at 1:03 p.m. Further, we also must account for all load, travel and fueling time that it takes to do any work, Our report also indicates an additional 1 hour and 45 minutes for that time loading, fueling and travel time involved for this job. While on site we did in fact insulate 2 walls that had vinyl siding. The rest of the home had aluminum siding. At the time of the estimate (prior to the job being bid and scheduled) our estimator was told he was not able to walk around the sides of the house due to dogs that were on the property. When we created the estimate (also attached) it clearly states that the job would entail removing vinyl siding in order to insulate. Had we been able to look at the entire property at the time of the estimate we could have informed the customer that we could not do the aluminum siding areas and further, upon receipt of the proposal the customer could have informed us that there was aluminum siding. The customer also states that some of the siding was damaged. As you can see on the proposal it also states that customer is responsible for any damaged siding. These situations can arise when we are working with an existing property, which is why we make the customer aware of this at the time the proposal is sent. While on site the installers had to set up the equipment necessary to perform the job, did insulate the areas that we were able to do and checked the remaining areas to make sure that the job could not be completed. In all we are billing only for the amount of time spent on the job, travel time, load time, fueling time and for the material that was used by our installers with a very small mark up. After informing the customer that the job could not be done due to the fact that there was aluminum siding we also offered the option to do the work from the inside of the home which the customer chose not to do. The $275.00 charge if the job cannot be done became void due to the fact that we were able to do 2 of the walls on the property. Upon billing the invoice does not change as far as wording, The invoice shows the work areas that were proposed to be done (1st and 2nd floors) but the price was changed to reflect that the entire job was not completed. This is how our bidding and billing system is set up and there is nothing we can do to change the billing format and wording that shows. When areas are not done, we change the price accordingly and note our paperwork the areas that are done or not done so we have that information available if needed in the future which is what was done in this situation. As a good gesture we are willing to deduct $75.,00 from the price of the job and issue a refund to the customer, Due to the fact that we did spend time on he job and used material to complete the areas we were able to do we are not willing to take a loss on the job which is what we would be doing if we took any more money off than the proposed $75.00, apologize for the inconvenience but this could have been easily avoided had we been able to look at the entire job at the time of the proposal or if the customer would have corrected the information that was clearly stated on the proposal prior to scheduling. If you have any further questions please feel free to call our office Monday thru Friday 8:00 a.. until 4:30 pm.Sincerely,

Please see attached response.

[To assist us in bringing this matter to a close, you must give us a reason why you are rejecting the response. If no reason is received your complaint will be closed Administratively Resolved] Complaint: [redacted]I am rejecting this response because:To Whom It May Concern:
In my twenty seven years of employment whether in management or local government, customer service has always been something I have prided myself on and taken very seriously. I am offended that the company continues to point the finger at me.
It appears now it is regardless of whether the dogs were in the yard, regardless of whether the estimator had access to the property and regardless of whether the siding is aluminum or vinyl. However, these are the reasons we are to this point. I did sign the proposal with the assumption that the estimator provided an accurate estimate/proposal of the work to be completed. I would not have signed the proposal or asked the company to complete the work to the home if I would have known the work could not be complete. The company can continue to state they can not be held accountable do to pre-exisiting conditions. I can understand if a glitch comes up along the way and maybe a piece of the siding could not be removed, that I would understand. However, the fact that an estimate was completed and the fact that the siding was not checked to me is more than a pre-exisiting condition. I would not have had the company come to the home to insulate two walls out of twenty-nine walls. So the company is incorrect in their  statement that I knew when I signed the proposal that the work may not be completed in full. Again as I stated I can understand a bump in the road that is at times expected but not to this degree. I do not think anyone would have a company come to their home and only do 10% of the work only to have another company come out to complete the remaining 90% of the work.
The matter of the $275 fee due to work not being completed due to pre-existing conditions was discussed with the estimator after the work could not be completed. The estimator stated the fee did not apply to this job because some of the work was completed.
My issue remains the same. Looking at the entire job, the proposal, and the bill for part of the work it appears to be high. I know I have stated this over and over but the fact remains. The company can provide whatever they choose in writing but because I do not have a whole lot of trust or faith in them it means nothing to me. The estimate/proposal was in writing and it clearly stated vinyl siding and we know that was incorrect since it was never looked at to determine what kind of siding it was.
Regards,[redacted]

Review: I contacted keener last summer. [redacted] keener came to my home to provide me with an estimate. He took measurements inside my home & briefly looked at the outside of my home. I received the estimate a few weeks later in the approximate amount of $2200.00. I made attempts to schedule installation of the insulation. Eventually it was scheduled for Dec. 10, 2013. Two crews were to arrive at approximately 8 am. One crew arrived at approximately 10:30 am. They worked on the basement & completed it in 2 hours. [redacted] arrived to check their work as they were finishing. I asked about the 2nd crew who was to be working on the outside of the home. He made a phone call & notified me they weren't coming & they would be here tomorrow at approximately 8 am. They arrived at approximately 10 am. I arrived at my home at 1 pm to see no workers. I called the workers & they said they were done & could not complete the job because the siding was aluminum with the exception of the 2 walls they did. I made several calls & eventually reached [redacted]. He would follow up. He later called me to inform me they do not work on aluminum siding so they can not complete the job. While they working on the job they damaged my siding & did not inform me. They sent me an invoice in the amount of $614.00 for 2 walls when they entire estimate was $2200.00. The bill states they worked on 1st &2nd floor walls. They did no work on the 2nd floor walls. The estimate makes note they will charge $275.00 if a job can not be complete due to a pre-existing condition. I tried to dispute the bill however, I feel they are over ill ing me for their time & because they could not complete the job. However the job was not completed because of their ignorance and not paying attention to whether the siding was vinyl or aluminum.Desired Settlement: Billing adjustment

Business

Response:

April 4, 2014To Whom It May Concern:| arm writing in response to complaint ID [redacted] for [redacted], The phase of the job that the customer is referring to was completed to the best of our ability on 12/11/13. The customer states that our installers did not come until 10:00 a.. and left by 100 pm. I have attached a copy of our GPS report for our truck at the customers job location that clearly indicates our truck parking on site at 8:53 a.. and leaving at 1:03 p.m. Further, we also must account for all load, travel and fueling time that it takes to do any work, Our report also indicates an additional 1 hour and 45 minutes for that time loading, fueling and travel time involved for this job. While on site we did in fact insulate 2 walls that had vinyl siding. The rest of the home had aluminum siding. At the time of the estimate (prior to the job being bid and scheduled) our estimator was told he was not able to walk around the sides of the house due to dogs that were on the property. When we created the estimate (also attached) it clearly states that the job would entail removing vinyl siding in order to insulate. Had we been able to look at the entire property at the time of the estimate we could have informed the customer that we could not do the aluminum siding areas and further, upon receipt of the proposal the customer could have informed us that there was aluminum siding. The customer also states that some of the siding was damaged. As you can see on the proposal it also states that customer is responsible for any damaged siding. These situations can arise when we are working with an existing property, which is why we make the customer aware of this at the time the proposal is sent. While on site the installers had to set up the equipment necessary to perform the job, did insulate the areas that we were able to do and checked the remaining areas to make sure that the job could not be completed. In all we are billing only for the amount of time spent on the job, travel time, load time, fueling time and for the material that was used by our installers with a very small mark up. After informing the customer that the job could not be done due to the fact that there was aluminum siding we also offered the option to do the work from the inside of the home which the customer chose not to do. The $275.00 charge if the job cannot be done became void due to the fact that we were able to do 2 of the walls on the property. Upon billing the invoice does not change as far as wording, The invoice shows the work areas that were proposed to be done (1st and 2nd floors) but the price was changed to reflect that the entire job was not completed. This is how our bidding and billing system is set up and there is nothing we can do to change the billing format and wording that shows. When areas are not done, we change the price accordingly and note our paperwork the areas that are done or not done so we have that information available if needed in the future which is what was done in this situation. As a good gesture we are willing to deduct $75.,00 from the price of the job and issue a refund to the customer, Due to the fact that we did spend time on he job and used material to complete the areas we were able to do we are not willing to take a loss on the job which is what we would be doing if we took any more money off than the proposed $75.00, apologize for the inconvenience but this could have been easily avoided had we been able to look at the entire job at the time of the proposal or if the customer would have corrected the information that was clearly stated on the proposal prior to scheduling. If you have any further questions please feel free to call our office Monday thru Friday 8:00 a.. until 4:30 pm.Sincerely,

Consumer

Response:

[To assist us in bringing this matter to a close, you must give us a reason why you are rejecting the response. If no reason is received your complaint will be closed Administratively Resolved] Review: [redacted]I am rejecting this response because:I have chosen to reject the company's reply due to several factors. The estimator did not explain the work could not be completed if the siding was aluminum. If he would have told me that I would have had him check the siding as I don't know the differnece between vinyl and aluminum. I would have put my dogs inside my home, however, the dogs were leashed in my yard and they could not reach my home. The estimator and mysyelf were on my rear porch briefly as he was telling me about the dog park he visits in [redacted].The estimator had to enter my property by the front gate and the dogs did not bother him. My home sits on the city sidewalk which is not in my yard and that siding could have been checked as I know now that is aluminum.

When the workers arrived at my home on December 11, 2013 I was at work as my mother was at my home and she stated they had arrived?started at approximately 10:00 AM. I understand the GPS stated 8:53 am but that doesn't necessarily mean the workers began the job at that time.

We called the company repeatedly on a weekly basis to discuss the bill due to our disstisfaction and most of the times the estimator was not available. On one occasion we spoke with the president of the company voicing our dissatisfaction with the bill and the damaged siding, he stated he would look into it and get back to us. He did not get back to us.

As far as, the work being done on the outside of the home. We did have the estimator complete an estimate and the bill was higher than it would have been if the work was done on the outside and that would be minus the two walls they worked on. The estimator stated it would cost less to complete from inside the home.

Over all the communication with the company has been very frustrating most of our calls were unreturned. the work was completed on December 11, 2013 and we received the bill shortly thereafter. We have disputed the bill for approximately 60 days which brings me to my complaint filed March 26, 2014. Sincerely,

Business

Response:

April 21, 2014To Whom it May Concern:In response to the rejection sent by the customer.We would have no reason to explain that aluminum siding cannot be done if we are not aware that it is there. Many factors come into play when completing existing work which we do not list on every proposal that we send since we are normally able to look at the entire job prior to placing a bid. Regardless or where the dogs were we did not explain that we would not look at the entire job but the homeowner said we could not have access to the entire property because of the dogs.Again our GPS shows that the installers were on site at 8:53 a.m. Blown work requires set up time Including setting up the truck, setting up the blowing machine, checking hoses, opening material, etc, so just because the men did not start actually blowing the job until 10:00 did not mean working. There is a process to setting up machinery to do the work.I apologize for the time that it took to get a response but we had to involve the estimator, the installers and the President of the company. We also had to go over all of the paperwork and recost the job to ensure we were being fair in pricing. And although I apologize for the response time, it really has no bearing on the price of the job which seems to be the concern.We clearly showed both the Revdex.com and the customer how much time was spent to do this work and feel as though we have been fair considering we were not permitted the proper access to the entire job prior to doing the job. Original offer of credit still stands but that is the most refund we can give without losing money to complete the areas that were insulated.Sincerely,

Business

Response:

Please see attached response.

Consumer

Response:

[To assist us in bringing this matter to a close, you must give us a reason why you are rejecting the response. If no reason is received your complaint will be closed Administratively Resolved] Review: [redacted]I am rejecting this response because:To Whom It May Concern:

In my twenty seven years of employment whether in management or local government, customer service has always been something I have prided myself on and taken very seriously. I am offended that the company continues to point the finger at me.

It appears now it is regardless of whether the dogs were in the yard, regardless of whether the estimator had access to the property and regardless of whether the siding is aluminum or vinyl. However, these are the reasons we are to this point. I did sign the proposal with the assumption that the estimator provided an accurate estimate/proposal of the work to be completed. I would not have signed the proposal or asked the company to complete the work to the home if I would have known the work could not be complete. The company can continue to state they can not be held accountable do to pre-exisiting conditions. I can understand if a glitch comes up along the way and maybe a piece of the siding could not be removed, that I would understand. However, the fact that an estimate was completed and the fact that the siding was not checked to me is more than a pre-exisiting condition. I would not have had the company come to the home to insulate two walls out of twenty-nine walls. So the company is incorrect in their statement that I knew when I signed the proposal that the work may not be completed in full. Again as I stated I can understand a bump in the road that is at times expected but not to this degree. I do not think anyone would have a company come to their home and only do 10% of the work only to have another company come out to complete the remaining 90% of the work.

The matter of the $275 fee due to work not being completed due to pre-existing conditions was discussed with the estimator after the work could not be completed. The estimator stated the fee did not apply to this job because some of the work was completed.

My issue remains the same. Looking at the entire job, the proposal, and the bill for part of the work it appears to be high. I know I have stated this over and over but the fact remains. The company can provide whatever they choose in writing but because I do not have a whole lot of trust or faith in them it means nothing to me. The estimate/proposal was in writing and it clearly stated vinyl siding and we know that was incorrect since it was never looked at to determine what kind of siding it was.

Regards,[redacted]