Land Rover North Scottsdale

Mr*** and I have spoken many times and met yesterdayTHe dealership purchased the car in question from him yesterdayWe have come to a resolutionThanksBobby P***General ManagerLand Rover North Scottsdale

Review: My air conditioning system is inoperative after dealership technicians performed an electrical procedure on the vehicle (called a reflash of the ECM - engine control module/main engine computer). When I spoke to the manager ([redacted]) about it he informed me that the technician has 27 years of automotive repair experience and that the proper equipment was used for the procedure. He then insisted that these 'things' break all the time, the vehicle has over 100,000 miles and he would not be responsible for any reimbursement or repairs as they did not interfere or do anything in anyway to the vehicles' air conditioning system - which is fully electronic in this vehicle. Why would he think an electrical procedure to a main computer would/could not affect any other electrical circuits in the vehicle? If these 'things' break all the time why didn't his service advisor advise me of the possibility of this fault occurring BEFORE the procedure was carried out, had I known of this I would not have allowed them to perform the service and instead would have pursued other repair alternatives for the subtle and occasional misfire, which was not preventing the vehicle from being driven.Desired Settlement: I would like a new Dual Flow Control Valve (an electronic heater control valve) necessary for my air conditioning system to properly operate like it used to, and my money refunded for the reflash procedure. The vehicles' a/c had no faults prior to this reflash procedure, however hot air now blows out of the drivers vent and the a/c system does not cool efficiently, matter of fact it has to be kept off while driving. I will take my vehicle elsewhere for repair, I no longer trust the Jaguar team

Business

Response:

Mr. [redacted]’s vehicle was a “night drop” on the morning of 8/20/2013. The keys were in the lock box with a different name and phone number.

I called the number on the envelope and discovered that the owner was Mr. [redacted]. He had an apt. set with [redacted], but [redacted] and I agreed that I would work on the vehicle since I had already entered it in the system. I it is a black 2003 S-Type with 180,899 miles. I noticed that

It still had a temp tag when I wrote it up.

He had set the apt. with [redacted] to perform an ECU update. I called the number on the envelope and recommended that they perform diag. prior to the update. The lady that answered told me to perform the update because [redacted] is a mechanic.

We proceeded and the ECU accepted the update. We performed an MPI that revealed several safety related items, i.e., free play in the front hubs, right front steering rack control arm bent. I called Mr. [redacted] with the results of the MPI and asked him if he would like to proceed with diag. to determine the cause of the malfunction lights. He declined repairs at the time.

Mr. [redacted] called me after he had left the dealer and stated that his a/c was not working. I stated that the update could not have affected his

a/c system. Since he was a new customer and I wanted to make him feel comfortable coming to the dealer I offered him “one free hour of diag.” I told him that he could use I towards the check engine light issue or towards the a/c concern. I made it clear that it was a goodwill

gesture. I also offered a sedan ride from our dealership to his work and back.

When he arrived the next day he claimed that we had shorted out the heater control valve while performing the download. I explained to him that we are required to use a JLR approved charger while performing downloads. He wanted us to diagnose the a/c issue. My tech and our shop foreman spent several hours going through the entire a/c system. He determined that the electrical readings for the heater valve are

Fine, but the mechanical portion is blocked. I called Mr. [redacted] with the results. I explained that a mechanical issue could not occur during a

download. He insisted that it was our responsibility to repair it since “it happened while in our shop.”

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

Regards,

The air conditioning system in this vehicle worked fine with absolutely no problems prior to North Scottsdale Jaguar dealership technicians handling. The electrical portion of the valve currently is NOT operating as intended and indicates an open circuit until 'manually powered' to a closed position for the mechanical portion to allow air conditioning to occur.

This particular circuit has little/no fault protection (fuses) and a 'requirement' to use JLR voltage supply for the ECM reflash procedure does not necessarily mean that one was actually used. This reflash procedure pays .3 hour (20 minutes) yet I was charged for an hour of labor time, significant inducement for a 'quickie fix'- and a negating of 'requirements' by the servicing technician. Also when the vehicle was initially inspected by Jaguar technicians no reference to a malfunctioning or broken air conditioning system was ever mentioned, because there WAS NO problem with it when the vehicle arrived at the dealership.

For dealership personnel to allege that they found areas of the steering/suspension in disrepair does NOT make their case that they are not liable for any mishap(s) that occurred during an electrical procedure that ultimately affected an electrical circuit.

Business

Response:

Client brought us the car for the first time in 3 years. Asked us to program the engine control module for a rough running condition.

We did exactly as he asked.

Client picked up the car, called back and said air conditioning did not work.

We offered to diagnos it, which we did for free.

The system needs a heater control valve to start.

This is a 180,000 + mile car and there are numerous issues with it.

We are a very responsible and well rated dealership. If there were any reason for me to believe that we were at fault, I would step up and do so.

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

Regards,

While there may be a few issues with mechanical parts of the steering and suspension components as the dealership pointed out during their MPI inspection, none of these involve electrical components or systems. The dealership has, and still does refuse to admit liability for damaging the electrical component (heater control valve) in the air conditioning system, which was fault-free prior to their handling. Both myself and my wife, as well as the previous owners of the vehicle can all attest to this fact.

Again, if the a/c system was broken in any way prior to the initial MPI inspection, then their 'allegedly infallible' technicians should/would have identified and documented it, along with the other repairs that the vehicle needed, on the paperwork I received.

If JLR's current position is to step up and offer to repair what was damaged during the reflash procedure then they need to do just that.

In 2011 I purchased an XF Premium Jaguar that had 7,000 miles on it and was used as a program car by this dealership. The salesperson told me several times that since the dealership had used the car as a loaner that they had added a 100,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty that included everything down to the windshield wipers and oil changes up t o 100,000 miles. I had many, many issues with the car including trim issues, mechanical problems and had to replace the brakes twice before 60,000 miles. Finally at 62,000 miles the dashboard came apart in the vehicle. I took it in to have it fixed along with another cracked trim piece, the garage door opener was not working and I needed the oil changed. I got a call telling me the dash would be $5,000 and not covered along with the other cracked trim, the garaged door opener they would cover and they have discovered a water leak that they would pay for. I could not believe they wanted me to pay for the dash and after confronting them with what I was told when I purchased the vehicle they wanted $1,250 from me and they would replace the dash. I contacted Jaguar but they told me there was nothing they could do and I refused to pay the $1,250 so it was not fixed. I went to pick up the car and had to pay $131.00 for the oil change which I was told was now also not covered. I got rid of the car that weekend and would suggest that anyone who is looking for a Jaguar or Landcover NEVER go to this lying dealership. I learned that there were at least 8 other people in time period that I purchased this vehicle that had told the same thing and had the same problem.

Review: I feel that my family and I are victims of bad business tactics because we have been duped by Scottsdale Jaguar. We were given a diagnostic review over a year ago to repair a failed comprehension system problem. After saving the money suggested to have our car repaired, the problem still exist. We had our car towed via Triple A to Scottsdale Jaguar 3 times last month and spent over $5000.00 and the systems failed light continues to show on our dash so we are now concerned and very disappointed.

After recently contacting the Jaguar Corporation and speaking to someone named Lynn at Jaguar, we unfortunately are told to pay more money because the service person is not owning up to the problem. However, we have our request in writing on the initial car report. It was not until after we drove our car off the lot for a few days from the initial serve that we learned that Scottsdale Jaguar repaired other things on our car instead of what we suggested and [redacted], the service writer, did NOT repair the initial problem at all.

Our system lights to this day still shows a yellow light and reads system fail once again. Consequently, we feel our family was placed in unnecessary danger upon leaving the shop due to Scottsdale Jaguar's negligence and these tactics could have been detrimental to our safety. We were not given the correct information at the out set of our first visit and we are now being asked to pay for this same service we requested initially. This means they lied about repairing it simply told us it had been fixed.

All the other services such as wind shield wipers, tires etc. could have been repaired at our local mechanic but instead we exhausted monies that could have been used to repair the comprehension systems failed problem we discussed initially.

Once again, we have spent over $5,000.00 to date since June 2013 and we even purchased an additional car key that cost us over $700.00 as well to discover the system fail mechanism is still not operative. We feel that we didn't receive the proper service due to servicemen running up our cost for services we did not need. It's really upsetting because we've owned Jaguars before and we were treated 1000 times better in California. This Jaguar experience is so disappointing.

Please call us as soon as possible. we have never experienced such non-professionalism from a Jaguar dealership. We feel that we need your help! We do not want to use this dealership again but the other local mechanics claim that this Jaguar dealership is the only one in this area within 200 miles. SO, if we must use them, we want representation and documentation for our safety.Desired Settlement: Do not mislead and/ or dupe veteran Jaguar customers. Repair Jaguar services discussed as any commercial company would. Repair the problem requested (the problem paid for upon initial request) and restore 2nd and third Triple A towing charges or benefits used.

Business

Response:

Thank you for the opportunity to

respond to the issues outlined by our customer.

The records for the vehicle, a

1998 Jaguar XJ8, have been reviewed and we see that on three separate

occasions, beginning in August 2009, we recommended to the customer that the ABS Module be replaced. On each occasion,

the customer declined the recommended replacement of the

module. The customer is correct that in May 2013

services totaling approximately $5,000 were performed based on our

recommendations after inspecting the vehicle. It is important to note that at

this time the vehicle had sat unused for two years. Many of the services

performed, at this time, were recommended so

as to allow the vehicle to be driven again. The customer was consulted and approved the work to be performed.

The customer requested a key to be ordered, 4 wheel alignment to be

performed among other items needing repair after sitting for two years.

At that time, once again, our recommendations included that the ABS Module will

need to be replaced if the light comes on again but was not authorized to be

replaced at that time. In June 2013 customer brought car in and advised

the warning light is coming on again. We once again recommended

replacement of the ABS Module. Customer declined the repair.

On June 12, 2013 vehicle was

once again towed to our service facility. As a good will gesture to a

repeat customer, our Service Director offered the customer an

adjustment on the pricing of a repaired ABS Module. Instead of labor and

parts totaling approximately $1,700, the price to our customer would be reduced to only $700. This represents the

cost of the parts and no labor would be charged to do the repair. Please note that the customer took

the vehicle to an independent repair facility to receive a price estimate for

the work and found that our offer of a discounted price with no labor charges

was most definitely the lowest price.

The vehicle is currently in our

service department as the

customer has now approved the

repair of the ABS Module. The vehicle will be returned to her once the

repair is complete.

We are sorry that the customer has experienced frustration with regards to the ABS

Module issue and hope that the discounted pricing will resolve the issue.

We can only recommend repairs and must obtain customer approval to act on our

recommendations. Our records are clearly documented with regards to

the module and believe that our discounted pricing to the customer shows our willingness to financially assist her

with the repair of the module.

Thank you.

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

Regards,

Sadly, the company is not telling the truth. The car was brought in for the reasons on the initial receipt. The service man wrote our concerns on the initial statement which should be documented. Please notice our concerns on the initial statement. And the reason the car is being serviced there at this point is for the reason stated [redacted] There is no other Jaguar dealership within 200 miles to do the job. The nearest Jaguar dealership is in Tuscon, AZ. The Jaguar dealership that we used the last few years here in the area has since been closed. This current Jaguar dealership took all of their customers so I guess we are stuck with this establishment. The CSR agents here are fabulous! I just wish the management would own up to the serviceman's mistake. We saved for the ABS module and this was shared upon our first visit. It was not fixed. We simply want others to know that this is how we were treated. PS: Since this complaint has been filed, Jaguar made another mistake. We were given a loaner vehicle and asked to return the loaner when our car was fixed. Yet, we received an email staing we are late returning the loaner. Well, we still do not have our vehicle. Management was notified and

Business

Response:

We will have to leave this as an unresolved complaint.

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this proposed action would not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

Regards,

As a two time owner of Jaguar, it saddens us that such a reputable company as Jaguar has lost its ability to satisfy its customers and take ownership of their mistakes. We feel the public has a right to know what happened to us in an attempt to repair our vehicle. To say we refused the service that we came for and saved for is ridiculous. Interestingly, our neighbor was not surprised at what occurred as he has heard similar complaints. We have since contacted our former Jaguar dealership (400 miles away) with our concerns and their staff assured us that they still respect our patronage and will always make every attempt to satisfy us and their Jaguar customers. This is what we would expect from Scottsdale Jaguar. We hope future customers of Scottsdale Jaguar have better success than we have experienced under the current leadership at this establishment. We are contemplating taking our concerns to yet another source because sadly, there has been no additional contact made to us from Jaguar's corporate office after being forced to not only pay but accept a rebuilt part to satisfy our concern. A corporate employee stated she leaves complaints up to the franchise. Wow! It appears in this economy, companies are doing everything possible to save. Sadly their tactics are at the customers expense. Beware!