I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] , and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below Regards, [redacted] September 15, Re: ID [redacted] I would appreciate it if Lorain County Community College would not treat this matter so lightly in their response Please do not evade or make worse the problem created This is simple These are elements of a contract If you know what good faith is, LCCC has broken it Other students and I were led to believe by LCCC employees if we followed procedures and requirements it would lead to a completed Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology and if sought further, a degree as Surgical Assistant I personally followed the requirements, paid my tuition and kept my grade point well above average LCCC now states after completing these requirements I was never considered formally accepted into the Surgical Technology program I originally signed up for The bottom line has not changed It was simple for LCCC to distribute their decision through a form letter to students cancelling this program It should be just as simple for LCCC to reimburse funds to these same students for making it impossible to graduate This decision is beyond the student’s authority and we are not asking administration at LCCC to change their decision, therefore, the students should not be held accountable to pick up the debt Students decide what college they will attend by their specific career interests, programs offered, cost and reputation of the education providedI chose LCCC because a friend of mine took the Surgical Technology program, graduated and has worked successfully for [redacted] If it were not for this specific program alone I would not have chosen to attend LCCC If I may make a suggestion, it will do well for the RevDex.com to warn future enrollees of LCCC that contracts made with LCCC are not binding and not made in good faith The contracts, whether verbal or written, are subject to LCCC’s administration’s private discretion only as to whether a student is considered formerly accepted into a program despite the student doing everything in their power to comply with program requirements In order to respond to MrKeith [redacted] B***, when I decided to submit an application through an Academic Counselor into the Surgical Technology Program and work my way through pre-requisite courses, it was not mentioned that LCCC had a 100% hire rate after graduation This policy, I believe, does not existEvery student takes a chance of getting hired after graduation, which is why grade point averages are so important with employment competition I was not aware as stated by MrB [redacted] employment statistics I am being limited to employment in the Cleveland, Ohio area only For MrB [redacted] information, Surgical Tech students befriend other Surgical Tech students When one student makes an appointment with a counselor regarding the cancelling of a program that information is shared with the other students I don’t believe one counselor would give one student information over another on why the program was cancelled and what your options are In this case LCCC tried to amend their decision by turning away the student’s original area of interest and convincing them into another career avenue I am not sure what other advice you would have for me If you cancel one program on your students why would you not cancel another without any prior warning? If there were no guarantees of being accepted into one program then there is no guarantee students would be accepted into another? This information will due me well in all my future endeavors Again, LCCC’s administration has the privacy discretion if and when an expected date comes along for a program seat opening, after a student signs an application and meets program requirements That student is still not considered formally accepted I believe this particular quote needs to be extremely emphasized more to students when they first discuss LCCC’s program choices with counselors and advisers What LCCC did was wrong, plain and simple MrKeith B [redacted] sounds as though I should monitor the job market on a regular basis and if I have obtained year of education on a Surgical Technician Program I should dismiss the second year of clinicals I should take all of the effort, time and money invested in stride and settle for a general degree in arts because the college decided for me it was not the appropriate route I should take to pursue for my futureWhich skills are immediately more marketable, an Associate’s of Arts Degree or an Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology? It is also suggested instead of finishing an Associate’s Degree in year in the medical field I should pursue even more yearsYet it was okay to keep pursuing a surgical tech degree and investing in it plus more months prior to this If unemployment in Surgical Technology is abundant why are other higher education facilities still implementing their programs? I am sorry and you have to forgive me as I am a person who likes to start what I finish especially when money, time and sacrifice are invested If I had more money and time to throw away on courses that lead to a dead end I would probably be more sympathetic to LCCC’s administrative decision In regards to LCCC contacts, I assure you many avenues have been pursued in seeking guidance with this extremely difficult dilemma I was forced intoI actually made several calls and talked to faculty but specifically three inquiry calls, before and after my workplace hours, week apart were placed After leaving a specific message all three times asking for a contact person’s phone number or to make an appointment with those who chose to make this decision, no recorded return phone calls or messages were left (366-June at 4:pm; June at 7:am and again at 4:pm)In regards to the scheduled counseling appointment on April 13, 2015, the appointment was made and cancelled As the day approached for the scheduled appointment I was still involved in Microbiology lab and lecture classes preparing for exams Dealing with LCCC’s cancelled college program demise, my distracted attitude needed attention and faculty had to encourage me to finish the course I was already involved in; which resulted in the letter grade of “A” Upon calling to reschedule the appointment I now wanted help in transferring credit courses to another college I told the receptionist I was part of the Surgical Tech program revampingThe first receptionist was not sure if she should make the appointment, when a second receptionist was handed the phone I was told, “we do not make appointments for that” With the benefit of all the doubts I still signed up for two classes this past fall semester One was a pre-requisite class reserved for Radiology program students only; I accepted I was not permitted to take it The next was an evening class of credit hours in Medical Terminology Periodically I checked the status of the class online ALHN was scheduled to start on Tuesday, August from 6:00pm – 9:00pm The last time I looked into Mycampus was the Thursday prior, August 20th Mycampus now revealed I was not enrolled in any classes for the fall I called LCCC enrollment services and was told the class just got cancelled that same Thursday I inquired to why I was not notified to the cancellation but found out by pure happenstance that my class was deleted from the system for me LCCC employees could not tell me who deleted the enrolled class I asked my workplace to cancel the voucher for the class tuition and the textbook was returned for refund without issue This is not the first time I have experienced this It is sad I had to resort to the Revdex.com to even gain a response to this particular problem I thank you I received oneThere are no other choices for me but to seek reimbursement from LCCC to obtain funding invested in LCCC courses for a degree LCCC’s administration has made impossible to complete I only regret the song and dance LCCC will now give me as I try to retrieve those funds and apply them to courses that did not have to be taken or will not transfer to another college
Lorain County Community College September 24, 2015 *** *** ***Dispute Resolution SpecialistRevdex.comEuclid Ave., 4th FloorCleveland, OH 44115-2408 Subject: Case No*** *** *** ***: This letter is in response to the additional information provided for Case No*** Please know that Lorain County Community College (LCCC) takes all student concerns seriously and strives to follow our policies and procedures in providing good service to our studentsAs explained previously, LCCC placed the Surgical Technology Associate of Applied Science Program on hiatus for the 2015-Academic Year due to decreased employment opportunities in the fieldLCCC is responsive to our immediate community and to the regional employment needs of Northeast Ohio and not able to consider employment needs outside of our service areaWhile the Surgical Technology Program is on hiatus, students that were officially accepted into the program are able to complete the program. Please note, while the student did apply for program application in the Surgical Technology Program, she was never admitted into the program and, therefore, does not have catalog rights to the Surgical Technology ProgramIn addition, there is no breach of contract in this situation as the student had applied to the program but was not admittedIn addition, the credit hours that the student accumulated at LCCC are transferable to other LCCC special admission programs like Associate Degree Nursing, Physical Therapy Assisting, Clinical Lab Science Technology, Respiratory Care, Radiologic Technology, or Occupational Therapy AssistantWith her transfer credits LCCC accepted from *** ***, she is three courses away from completing an Associate of Arts Degree which would allow her to transfer to any four year program of her choosingAlso, the courses the student registered for and completed at LCCC are transferable to any other public college or university in Ohio. With the additional information the student provided on the phone number she attempted to contact with no response, we were able to verify that this was the case and the calls were not returnedWe are apologetic that the staff person at LCCC did not return the call and are using this as a coaching lesson in a continuous improvement spiritLCCC's goal is to return all students' phone callsThe student does mention that she was not referred to an appropriate counselor to learn about additional options, but our records do show that the student scheduled an appointment with an academic counselor for April 13, for which she was a "no show." This would have been and currently is the appropriate staff member for the student to meet with. We do appreciate that the student attempted to attend LCCC for Fall and are sorry that this did not work out for the student While we strive to run all class sections that scheduled, this is not always possible based on number of students enrolled Unfortunately, the ALHN course the student registered for did get cancelled due to low enrollment numbers on 8/18/ The student was notified by the Allied Health and Nursing Division via email of the class cancellation that same day as soon as the decision to cancel was made.While we understand the student's frustration with this situatuon, we have internal processes for grievances that would help the student voice her concerns The formal process that the student should adhere is attached below and is Procedure V-220: Complaints, Problems, Grievances, and Appeals by StudentsThe Procedure can also be found online at http://www.lorainccc.edu/Current+Students/Campus+Policies/Grievance.htmWe strive to deliver good service to all of our students and have the mechanisms in place to address complaints through our internal process We would appreciate you directing this student to our process. Sincerely,Keith ** B*** MPADirector, Human Resources & Campus Security
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.Reality is LCCC states it is for the community around it but does not care about the students involved nor their problems once LCCC creates them. LCCC's response only repeats what was said in the first letter with no regard for solving the immediate problem and still no guarantees which lets LCCC off the hook. That is why I at least tried to get involved with the Revdex.com. It is sorry LCCC is so business minded that they do not see the community (people) needs around them. A little advise may help you. Care for your students whom you make money off of and you won't have to worry about the business succeeding. Take the time to hire quality student-minded instructors and staff, you will get you a lot farther (check out rate your instructor stats). Do you do anything about the class evaluations students submit or is it just to make the student feel better.? I don't believe my fellow students or I, who actually gave our money to the college, were asked if we wanted the program cancelled. I don't believe we were asked for opinions on what other options the students would consider to compensate their inconvenience LCCC created. I believe LCCC is "this is our business and this is how we run it, here are your options whether you like them or not this is all you can get. This is not asking the community this is telling them. If you want to keep your clients, you ask your client what they want. I don't believe LCCC even considered the students personal conditions surrounding the debt for taking these courses like I do because LCCC didn't want to take the time. I don't believe LCCC took the time to locate the ones who moved to another state after losing hope of never graduating to refund money or apologize for creating such a devastating effect on their lives. LCCC would not even know where to send the grievance papers. LCCC did not help these students lives they created more problems for these students and now to deal with them on their own. LCCC probably thinks I am making these students up, I wish they weren't true stories. I actually walked among them and heard their stories and there was nothing else for them to do. I have randomly asked people on the street of their opinions of LCCC. Most responses were negative. Without mentioning a college I simply asked one medical worker where they learned to do their job, their immediate response was "I wouldn't go to LCCC" I went to . LCCC states they have a grievance policy. Why don't you just sit down and work it out, the college created the problem why don't you admit it (come out of denial) and try to solve it. Oh, wait, you don't have time. LCCC can't admit it, it was a business decision, it will make us look bad It is expected for the college to make future endeavors but consider the students attending right now. It is ok to waste the students time to fill out your paperwork, let me guess, you can complain but no guarantees. LCCC is a business and is run like a business, they do not have time for anything else. Students will fall through the cracks during your business revamping but oh well, it will make us look good for those who have not yet attended. LCCC does not lose money for cancelling programs, the courses leading up to them were already paid for, the students have already lost it so why should LCCC care about resolving anything. My case is a prime true account example, I am with the other losers, but I am at least letting LCCC know what they have been missing, the student. Students who have been involved in your college experience know how you run it, which is why, on the streets, it has a bad reputation. I have accepted what LCCC has done to me and still stay in contact with other students by their choice I knew this would get me nowhere and I was right, but I did it as other students have not gotten over it yet and wanted to at least try. I no longer participate at LCCC personally but I hope them good wishes
Regards,
*** ***
January 9,
Revdex.com Serving Greater Cleveland Euclid Ave4th FlCleveland, OH
Re: Complaint ID ***
Dear *** ***:
Lorain County Community College has received your communication regarding the complaint submitted to the Revdex.com on
1/4/by *** ***In order for our institution to respond to this complaint, we need your organization to obtain *** ***'s signature on our FERPA (Family Education Rights and Privacy Act) release formFERPA is a federal law that prohibits institutions of higher education from discussing a student's education records without their permission
I have attached the form for your conveniencePlease contact me at (440) 366-if you would like to discuss this further
Thant you,
Keith *B*** Director, Human Resources NAbbe Road Elyria, Ohio 440-365-www.lorainccc.edu 1-800-995-Fax 440-365-
VITIN Lorain County Community College September 10, 2015 *** *** ***Dispute Resolution SpecialistRevdex.comEuclid Ave., 4th Floor Cleveland, OH 44115-2408 Subject: *** ** *** (Assigned ID ***) *** *** *** The letter serves as a response
to the complaint from *** *** regarding Lorain County Community College's (LCCC) hiatus of the Surgical Technology ProgramAs background, LCCC placed the Surgical Technology Associate of Applied Science Program on hiatus for the 2015-Academic Year due to decreased employment opportunities in the fieldAccording to Economic Modelling Specialist International Career Coach, there are currently close to 1,employed as Surgical Technicians in the Cleveland Metropolitan Service Area and only current openings (less than 5%)*** was notified via letter on March 26, about this change and encouraged to meet with LCCC Counseling staff. *** *** scheduled an appointment with Lindsey M***, Academic Counselor, for April 13, for which she was a "no show." In researching email and phone records, we have no evidence of additional contact from ***As background, *** had submitted a program application for the Surgical Technology Program on July 19, She renewed her application on September 12, However, it is important to note that while she filed applications in the past she was never formally accepted into the program. The credit hours that *** earned at LCCC are transferable to other LCCC special admission programs like Associate Degree Nursing, Physical Therapy Assisting, Clinical Lab Science Technology, Respiratory Care, Radiologic Technology, or Occupational Therapy AssistantWith her transfer credits LCCC accepted from *** ***, she is three courses away from completing an Associate of Arts Degree which would allow her to transfer to any four year program of her choosingAlso, the courses *** registered for and completed at LCCC are transferable to any other public college or university in Ohio. While we sympathize with ***'s disappointment, we have no record of her contacting LCCC and going through our official grievance policy, writing to the LCCC Refund Committee, or following up with other offices on campus that could have directed her to other optionsWe do welcome the opportunity to talk with *** and help her with a new direction that would have better career opportunitiesPlease let me know should you have additional questions. Sincerely, Keith ** B***, MPA Director, Human Resources and Campus Security *** *** *** *** *** *** * *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** * *** * *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** * *** *** *** *** *** NAbbe Road Elyria, Ohio 44035 440-365-www.lorainccc.edu 1-800-995-Fax 440-365-
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
Regards,
[redacted]
September 15, 2015
Re: ID [redacted]
I would appreciate it if Lorain County Community College
would not treat this matter so lightly in their response. Please do not evade or make worse the problem
created. This is simple. These are elements of a contract. If you know what good faith is, LCCC has
broken it. Other students and I were led
to believe by LCCC employees if we followed procedures and requirements it
would lead to a completed Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology and if
sought further, a degree as Surgical Assistant.
I personally followed the requirements, paid my tuition and kept my
grade point well above average. LCCC now
states after completing these requirements I was never considered formally
accepted into the Surgical Technology program I originally signed up for. The bottom line has not changed. It was simple for LCCC to distribute their
decision through a form letter to students cancelling this program. It should be just as simple for LCCC to reimburse
funds to these same students for making it impossible to graduate. This decision is beyond the student’s authority
and we are not asking administration at LCCC to change their decision, therefore,
the students should not be held accountable to pick up the debt.
Students decide what college they will attend by their
specific career interests, programs offered, cost and reputation of the
education provided. I chose LCCC because a friend of mine took the Surgical
Technology program, graduated and has worked successfully for [redacted].
If it were not for this specific program
alone I would not have chosen to attend LCCC.
If I may make a suggestion, it will do well for the RevDex.com to warn future enrollees of LCCC that contracts made with LCCC
are not binding and not made in good faith. The contracts, whether verbal or written, are
subject to LCCC’s administration’s private discretion only as to whether a
student is considered formerly accepted into a program despite the student
doing everything in their power to comply with program requirements.
In order to respond to Mr. Keith ** B[redacted], when I decided to
submit an application through an Academic Counselor into the Surgical
Technology Program and work my way through pre-requisite courses, it was not
mentioned that LCCC had a 100% hire rate after graduation. This policy, I believe, does not exist. Every
student takes a chance of getting hired after graduation, which is why grade
point averages are so important with employment competition. I was not aware as stated by Mr. B[redacted] employment statistics I am being limited to employment in the Cleveland, Ohio
area only.
For Mr. B[redacted] information, Surgical Tech students befriend
other Surgical Tech students. When one
student makes an appointment with a counselor regarding the cancelling of a
program that information is shared with the other students. I don’t believe one counselor would give one
student false information over another on why the program was cancelled and
what your options are. In this case LCCC
tried to amend their decision by turning away the student’s original area of
interest and convincing them into another career avenue. I am not sure what other advice you would
have for me. If you cancel one program
on your students why would you not cancel another without any prior warning? If there were no guarantees of being accepted
into one program then there is no guarantee students would be accepted into
another? This information will due me well in all my future endeavors. Again, LCCC’s administration has the privacy
discretion if and when an expected date comes along for a program seat opening,
after a student signs an application and meets program requirements. That student is still not considered formally
accepted. I believe this particular
quote needs to be extremely emphasized more to students when they first discuss
LCCC’s program choices with counselors and advisers.
What LCCC did was wrong, plain and simple.
Mr. Keith B[redacted] sounds as though I should monitor the job
market on a regular basis and if I have obtained 1 year of education on a
Surgical Technician Program I should dismiss the second year of clinicals. I should take all of the effort, time and
money invested in stride and settle for a general degree in arts because the
college decided for me it was not the appropriate route I should take to pursue
for my future. Which skills are immediately more marketable, an Associate’s of
Arts Degree or an Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology? It is also suggested instead of finishing an
Associate’s Degree in 1 year in the medical field I should pursue even 2 more
years. Yet it was okay to keep pursuing a surgical tech degree and investing in
it 1 plus more months prior to this. If
unemployment in Surgical Technology is abundant why are other higher education
facilities still implementing their programs?
I am sorry and you
have to forgive me as I am a person who likes to start what I finish especially
when money, time and sacrifice are invested.
If I had more money and time to throw away on courses that lead to a
dead end I would probably be more sympathetic to LCCC’s administrative decision.
In regards to LCCC contacts, I assure you many avenues have
been pursued in seeking guidance with this extremely difficult dilemma I was
forced into. I actually made several calls and talked to faculty but specifically three inquiry calls, before and after my
workplace hours, 1 week apart were placed. After
leaving a specific message all three times asking for a contact person’s phone
number or to make an appointment with those who chose to make this decision, no
recorded return phone calls or messages were left (366-7593 June 19 at 4:16 pm;
June 24 at 7:18 am and again at 4:30 pm). In regards to the scheduled
counseling appointment on April 13, 2015, the appointment was made and cancelled. As the day approached for the scheduled
appointment I was still involved in Microbiology lab and lecture classes
preparing for exams. Dealing with
LCCC’s cancelled college program demise, my distracted attitude needed
attention and faculty had to encourage me to finish the course I was already
involved in; which resulted in the letter grade of “A”. Upon calling to reschedule the appointment I
now wanted help in transferring credit courses to another college. I told the receptionist I was part of the
Surgical Tech program revamping. The first receptionist was not sure if she
should make the appointment, when a second receptionist was handed the phone I
was told, “we do not make appointments for that”.
With the benefit of all the doubts I still signed up for two
classes this past fall semester. One was
a pre-requisite class reserved for Radiology program students only; I accepted
I was not permitted to take it. The next
was an evening class of 3 credit hours in Medical Terminology. Periodically I checked the status of the
class online. ALHN 110 was scheduled to
start on Tuesday, August 25 from 6:00pm – 9:00pm. The last time I looked into Mycampus was the Thursday
prior, August 20th . Mycampus
now revealed I was not enrolled in any classes for the fall. I called LCCC enrollment services and was
told the class just got cancelled that same Thursday. I inquired to why I was not notified to the
cancellation but found out by pure happenstance that my class was deleted from
the system for me. LCCC employees could not tell me who deleted the enrolled class. I asked my workplace
to cancel the voucher for the class tuition and the
textbook was returned for refund without issue.
This is not the first time I have experienced this.
It is sad I had to resort to the Revdex.com to
even gain a response to this particular problem. I thank you I received one. There are no other choices for me but
to seek reimbursement from LCCC to obtain funding invested in LCCC courses for
a degree LCCC’s administration has made impossible to complete. I only regret the song and dance LCCC will now give me as I try to retrieve those funds and apply them to courses that did not have to be taken or will not transfer to another college.
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] , and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below Regards, [redacted] September 15, Re: ID [redacted] I would appreciate it if Lorain County Community College would not treat this matter so lightly in their response Please do not evade or make worse the problem created This is simple These are elements of a contract If you know what good faith is, LCCC has broken it Other students and I were led to believe by LCCC employees if we followed procedures and requirements it would lead to a completed Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology and if sought further, a degree as Surgical Assistant I personally followed the requirements, paid my tuition and kept my grade point well above average LCCC now states after completing these requirements I was never considered formally accepted into the Surgical Technology program I originally signed up for The bottom line has not changed It was simple for LCCC to distribute their decision through a form letter to students cancelling this program It should be just as simple for LCCC to reimburse funds to these same students for making it impossible to graduate This decision is beyond the student’s authority and we are not asking administration at LCCC to change their decision, therefore, the students should not be held accountable to pick up the debt Students decide what college they will attend by their specific career interests, programs offered, cost and reputation of the education providedI chose LCCC because a friend of mine took the Surgical Technology program, graduated and has worked successfully for [redacted] If it were not for this specific program alone I would not have chosen to attend LCCC If I may make a suggestion, it will do well for the RevDex.com to warn future enrollees of LCCC that contracts made with LCCC are not binding and not made in good faith The contracts, whether verbal or written, are subject to LCCC’s administration’s private discretion only as to whether a student is considered formerly accepted into a program despite the student doing everything in their power to comply with program requirements In order to respond to MrKeith [redacted] B***, when I decided to submit an application through an Academic Counselor into the Surgical Technology Program and work my way through pre-requisite courses, it was not mentioned that LCCC had a 100% hire rate after graduation This policy, I believe, does not existEvery student takes a chance of getting hired after graduation, which is why grade point averages are so important with employment competition I was not aware as stated by MrB [redacted] employment statistics I am being limited to employment in the Cleveland, Ohio area only For MrB [redacted] information, Surgical Tech students befriend other Surgical Tech students When one student makes an appointment with a counselor regarding the cancelling of a program that information is shared with the other students I don’t believe one counselor would give one student information over another on why the program was cancelled and what your options are In this case LCCC tried to amend their decision by turning away the student’s original area of interest and convincing them into another career avenue I am not sure what other advice you would have for me If you cancel one program on your students why would you not cancel another without any prior warning? If there were no guarantees of being accepted into one program then there is no guarantee students would be accepted into another? This information will due me well in all my future endeavors Again, LCCC’s administration has the privacy discretion if and when an expected date comes along for a program seat opening, after a student signs an application and meets program requirements That student is still not considered formally accepted I believe this particular quote needs to be extremely emphasized more to students when they first discuss LCCC’s program choices with counselors and advisers What LCCC did was wrong, plain and simple MrKeith B [redacted] sounds as though I should monitor the job market on a regular basis and if I have obtained year of education on a Surgical Technician Program I should dismiss the second year of clinicals I should take all of the effort, time and money invested in stride and settle for a general degree in arts because the college decided for me it was not the appropriate route I should take to pursue for my futureWhich skills are immediately more marketable, an Associate’s of Arts Degree or an Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology? It is also suggested instead of finishing an Associate’s Degree in year in the medical field I should pursue even more yearsYet it was okay to keep pursuing a surgical tech degree and investing in it plus more months prior to this If unemployment in Surgical Technology is abundant why are other higher education facilities still implementing their programs? I am sorry and you have to forgive me as I am a person who likes to start what I finish especially when money, time and sacrifice are invested If I had more money and time to throw away on courses that lead to a dead end I would probably be more sympathetic to LCCC’s administrative decision In regards to LCCC contacts, I assure you many avenues have been pursued in seeking guidance with this extremely difficult dilemma I was forced intoI actually made several calls and talked to faculty but specifically three inquiry calls, before and after my workplace hours, week apart were placed After leaving a specific message all three times asking for a contact person’s phone number or to make an appointment with those who chose to make this decision, no recorded return phone calls or messages were left (366-June at 4:pm; June at 7:am and again at 4:pm)In regards to the scheduled counseling appointment on April 13, 2015, the appointment was made and cancelled As the day approached for the scheduled appointment I was still involved in Microbiology lab and lecture classes preparing for exams Dealing with LCCC’s cancelled college program demise, my distracted attitude needed attention and faculty had to encourage me to finish the course I was already involved in; which resulted in the letter grade of “A” Upon calling to reschedule the appointment I now wanted help in transferring credit courses to another college I told the receptionist I was part of the Surgical Tech program revampingThe first receptionist was not sure if she should make the appointment, when a second receptionist was handed the phone I was told, “we do not make appointments for that” With the benefit of all the doubts I still signed up for two classes this past fall semester One was a pre-requisite class reserved for Radiology program students only; I accepted I was not permitted to take it The next was an evening class of credit hours in Medical Terminology Periodically I checked the status of the class online ALHN was scheduled to start on Tuesday, August from 6:00pm – 9:00pm The last time I looked into Mycampus was the Thursday prior, August 20th Mycampus now revealed I was not enrolled in any classes for the fall I called LCCC enrollment services and was told the class just got cancelled that same Thursday I inquired to why I was not notified to the cancellation but found out by pure happenstance that my class was deleted from the system for me LCCC employees could not tell me who deleted the enrolled class I asked my workplace to cancel the voucher for the class tuition and the textbook was returned for refund without issue This is not the first time I have experienced this It is sad I had to resort to the Revdex.com to even gain a response to this particular problem I thank you I received oneThere are no other choices for me but to seek reimbursement from LCCC to obtain funding invested in LCCC courses for a degree LCCC’s administration has made impossible to complete I only regret the song and dance LCCC will now give me as I try to retrieve those funds and apply them to courses that did not have to be taken or will not transfer to another college
Lorain County Community College September 24, 2015 *** *** ***Dispute Resolution SpecialistRevdex.comEuclid Ave., 4th FloorCleveland, OH 44115-2408 Subject: Case No*** *** *** ***: This letter is in response to the additional information provided for Case No*** Please know that Lorain County Community College (LCCC) takes all student concerns seriously and strives to follow our policies and procedures in providing good service to our studentsAs explained previously, LCCC placed the Surgical Technology Associate of Applied Science Program on hiatus for the 2015-Academic Year due to decreased employment opportunities in the fieldLCCC is responsive to our immediate community and to the regional employment needs of Northeast Ohio and not able to consider employment needs outside of our service areaWhile the Surgical Technology Program is on hiatus, students that were officially accepted into the program are able to complete the program. Please note, while the student did apply for program application in the Surgical Technology Program, she was never admitted into the program and, therefore, does not have catalog rights to the Surgical Technology ProgramIn addition, there is no breach of contract in this situation as the student had applied to the program but was not admittedIn addition, the credit hours that the student accumulated at LCCC are transferable to other LCCC special admission programs like Associate Degree Nursing, Physical Therapy Assisting, Clinical Lab Science Technology, Respiratory Care, Radiologic Technology, or Occupational Therapy AssistantWith her transfer credits LCCC accepted from *** ***, she is three courses away from completing an Associate of Arts Degree which would allow her to transfer to any four year program of her choosingAlso, the courses the student registered for and completed at LCCC are transferable to any other public college or university in Ohio. With the additional information the student provided on the phone number she attempted to contact with no response, we were able to verify that this was the case and the calls were not returnedWe are apologetic that the staff person at LCCC did not return the call and are using this as a coaching lesson in a continuous improvement spiritLCCC's goal is to return all students' phone callsThe student does mention that she was not referred to an appropriate counselor to learn about additional options, but our records do show that the student scheduled an appointment with an academic counselor for April 13, for which she was a "no show." This would have been and currently is the appropriate staff member for the student to meet with. We do appreciate that the student attempted to attend LCCC for Fall and are sorry that this did not work out for the student While we strive to run all class sections that scheduled, this is not always possible based on number of students enrolled Unfortunately, the ALHN course the student registered for did get cancelled due to low enrollment numbers on 8/18/ The student was notified by the Allied Health and Nursing Division via email of the class cancellation that same day as soon as the decision to cancel was made.While we understand the student's frustration with this situatuon, we have internal processes for grievances that would help the student voice her concerns The formal process that the student should adhere is attached below and is Procedure V-220: Complaints, Problems, Grievances, and Appeals by StudentsThe Procedure can also be found online at http://www.lorainccc.edu/Current+Students/Campus+Policies/Grievance.htmWe strive to deliver good service to all of our students and have the mechanisms in place to address complaints through our internal process We would appreciate you directing this student to our process. Sincerely,Keith ** B*** MPADirector, Human Resources & Campus Security
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ***, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.Reality is LCCC states it is for the community around it but does not care about the students involved nor their problems once LCCC creates them. LCCC's response only repeats what was said in the first letter with no regard for solving the immediate problem and still no guarantees which lets LCCC off the hook. That is why I at least tried to get involved with the Revdex.com. It is sorry LCCC is so business minded that they do not see the community (people) needs around them. A little advise may help you. Care for your students whom you make money off of and you won't have to worry about the business succeeding. Take the time to hire quality student-minded instructors and staff, you will get you a lot farther (check out rate your instructor stats). Do you do anything about the class evaluations students submit or is it just to make the student feel better.? I don't believe my fellow students or I, who actually gave our money to the college, were asked if we wanted the program cancelled. I don't believe we were asked for opinions on what other options the students would consider to compensate their inconvenience LCCC created. I believe LCCC is "this is our business and this is how we run it, here are your options whether you like them or not this is all you can get. This is not asking the community this is telling them. If you want to keep your clients, you ask your client what they want. I don't believe LCCC even considered the students personal conditions surrounding the debt for taking these courses like I do because LCCC didn't want to take the time. I don't believe LCCC took the time to locate the ones who moved to another state after losing hope of never graduating to refund money or apologize for creating such a devastating effect on their lives. LCCC would not even know where to send the grievance papers. LCCC did not help these students lives they created more problems for these students and now to deal with them on their own. LCCC probably thinks I am making these students up, I wish they weren't true stories. I actually walked among them and heard their stories and there was nothing else for them to do. I have randomly asked people on the street of their opinions of LCCC. Most responses were negative. Without mentioning a college I simply asked one medical worker where they learned to do their job, their immediate response was "I wouldn't go to LCCC" I went to . LCCC states they have a grievance policy. Why don't you just sit down and work it out, the college created the problem why don't you admit it (come out of denial) and try to solve it. Oh, wait, you don't have time. LCCC can't admit it, it was a business decision, it will make us look bad It is expected for the college to make future endeavors but consider the students attending right now. It is ok to waste the students time to fill out your paperwork, let me guess, you can complain but no guarantees. LCCC is a business and is run like a business, they do not have time for anything else. Students will fall through the cracks during your business revamping but oh well, it will make us look good for those who have not yet attended. LCCC does not lose money for cancelling programs, the courses leading up to them were already paid for, the students have already lost it so why should LCCC care about resolving anything. My case is a prime true account example, I am with the other losers, but I am at least letting LCCC know what they have been missing, the student. Students who have been involved in your college experience know how you run it, which is why, on the streets, it has a bad reputation. I have accepted what LCCC has done to me and still stay in contact with other students by their choice I knew this would get me nowhere and I was right, but I did it as other students have not gotten over it yet and wanted to at least try. I no longer participate at LCCC personally but I hope them good wishes
Regards,
*** ***
January 9,
Revdex.com Serving Greater Cleveland Euclid Ave4th FlCleveland, OH
Re: Complaint ID ***
Dear *** ***:
Lorain County Community College has received your communication regarding the complaint submitted to the Revdex.com on
1/4/by *** ***In order for our institution to respond to this complaint, we need your organization to obtain *** ***'s signature on our FERPA (Family Education Rights and Privacy Act) release formFERPA is a federal law that prohibits institutions of higher education from discussing a student's education records without their permission
I have attached the form for your conveniencePlease contact me at (440) 366-if you would like to discuss this further
Thant you,
Keith *B*** Director, Human Resources NAbbe Road Elyria, Ohio 440-365-www.lorainccc.edu 1-800-995-Fax 440-365-
VITIN Lorain County Community College September 10, 2015 *** *** ***Dispute Resolution SpecialistRevdex.comEuclid Ave., 4th Floor Cleveland, OH 44115-2408 Subject: *** ** *** (Assigned ID ***) *** *** *** The letter serves as a response
to the complaint from *** *** regarding Lorain County Community College's (LCCC) hiatus of the Surgical Technology ProgramAs background, LCCC placed the Surgical Technology Associate of Applied Science Program on hiatus for the 2015-Academic Year due to decreased employment opportunities in the fieldAccording to Economic Modelling Specialist International Career Coach, there are currently close to 1,employed as Surgical Technicians in the Cleveland Metropolitan Service Area and only current openings (less than 5%)*** was notified via letter on March 26, about this change and encouraged to meet with LCCC Counseling staff. *** *** scheduled an appointment with Lindsey M***, Academic Counselor, for April 13, for which she was a "no show." In researching email and phone records, we have no evidence of additional contact from ***As background, *** had submitted a program application for the Surgical Technology Program on July 19, She renewed her application on September 12, However, it is important to note that while she filed applications in the past she was never formally accepted into the program. The credit hours that *** earned at LCCC are transferable to other LCCC special admission programs like Associate Degree Nursing, Physical Therapy Assisting, Clinical Lab Science Technology, Respiratory Care, Radiologic Technology, or Occupational Therapy AssistantWith her transfer credits LCCC accepted from *** ***, she is three courses away from completing an Associate of Arts Degree which would allow her to transfer to any four year program of her choosingAlso, the courses *** registered for and completed at LCCC are transferable to any other public college or university in Ohio. While we sympathize with ***'s disappointment, we have no record of her contacting LCCC and going through our official grievance policy, writing to the LCCC Refund Committee, or following up with other offices on campus that could have directed her to other optionsWe do welcome the opportunity to talk with *** and help her with a new direction that would have better career opportunitiesPlease let me know should you have additional questions. Sincerely, Keith ** B***, MPA Director, Human Resources and Campus Security *** *** *** *** *** *** * *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** * *** * *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** * *** *** *** *** *** NAbbe Road Elyria, Ohio 44035 440-365-www.lorainccc.edu 1-800-995-Fax 440-365-
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
Regards,
[redacted]
September 15, 2015
Re: ID [redacted]
I would appreciate it if Lorain County Community College
would not treat this matter so lightly in their response. Please do not evade or make worse the problem
created. This is simple. These are elements of a contract. If you know what good faith is, LCCC has
broken it. Other students and I were led
to believe by LCCC employees if we followed procedures and requirements it
would lead to a completed Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology and if
sought further, a degree as Surgical Assistant.
I personally followed the requirements, paid my tuition and kept my
grade point well above average. LCCC now
states after completing these requirements I was never considered formally
accepted into the Surgical Technology program I originally signed up for. The bottom line has not changed. It was simple for LCCC to distribute their
decision through a form letter to students cancelling this program. It should be just as simple for LCCC to reimburse
funds to these same students for making it impossible to graduate. This decision is beyond the student’s authority
and we are not asking administration at LCCC to change their decision, therefore,
the students should not be held accountable to pick up the debt.
Students decide what college they will attend by their
specific career interests, programs offered, cost and reputation of the
education provided. I chose LCCC because a friend of mine took the Surgical
Technology program, graduated and has worked successfully for [redacted].
If it were not for this specific program
alone I would not have chosen to attend LCCC.
If I may make a suggestion, it will do well for the RevDex.com to warn future enrollees of LCCC that contracts made with LCCC
are not binding and not made in good faith. The contracts, whether verbal or written, are
subject to LCCC’s administration’s private discretion only as to whether a
student is considered formerly accepted into a program despite the student
doing everything in their power to comply with program requirements.
In order to respond to Mr. Keith ** B[redacted], when I decided to
submit an application through an Academic Counselor into the Surgical
Technology Program and work my way through pre-requisite courses, it was not
mentioned that LCCC had a 100% hire rate after graduation. This policy, I believe, does not exist. Every
student takes a chance of getting hired after graduation, which is why grade
point averages are so important with employment competition. I was not aware as stated by Mr. B[redacted] employment statistics I am being limited to employment in the Cleveland, Ohio
area only.
For Mr. B[redacted] information, Surgical Tech students befriend
other Surgical Tech students. When one
student makes an appointment with a counselor regarding the cancelling of a
program that information is shared with the other students. I don’t believe one counselor would give one
student false information over another on why the program was cancelled and
what your options are. In this case LCCC
tried to amend their decision by turning away the student’s original area of
interest and convincing them into another career avenue. I am not sure what other advice you would
have for me. If you cancel one program
on your students why would you not cancel another without any prior warning? If there were no guarantees of being accepted
into one program then there is no guarantee students would be accepted into
another? This information will due me well in all my future endeavors. Again, LCCC’s administration has the privacy
discretion if and when an expected date comes along for a program seat opening,
after a student signs an application and meets program requirements. That student is still not considered formally
accepted. I believe this particular
quote needs to be extremely emphasized more to students when they first discuss
LCCC’s program choices with counselors and advisers.
What LCCC did was wrong, plain and simple.
Mr. Keith B[redacted] sounds as though I should monitor the job
market on a regular basis and if I have obtained 1 year of education on a
Surgical Technician Program I should dismiss the second year of clinicals. I should take all of the effort, time and
money invested in stride and settle for a general degree in arts because the
college decided for me it was not the appropriate route I should take to pursue
for my future. Which skills are immediately more marketable, an Associate’s of
Arts Degree or an Associate’s Degree in Surgical Technology? It is also suggested instead of finishing an
Associate’s Degree in 1 year in the medical field I should pursue even 2 more
years. Yet it was okay to keep pursuing a surgical tech degree and investing in
it 1 plus more months prior to this. If
unemployment in Surgical Technology is abundant why are other higher education
facilities still implementing their programs?
I am sorry and you
have to forgive me as I am a person who likes to start what I finish especially
when money, time and sacrifice are invested.
If I had more money and time to throw away on courses that lead to a
dead end I would probably be more sympathetic to LCCC’s administrative decision.
In regards to LCCC contacts, I assure you many avenues have
been pursued in seeking guidance with this extremely difficult dilemma I was
forced into. I actually made several calls and talked to faculty but specifically three inquiry calls, before and after my
workplace hours, 1 week apart were placed. After
leaving a specific message all three times asking for a contact person’s phone
number or to make an appointment with those who chose to make this decision, no
recorded return phone calls or messages were left (366-7593 June 19 at 4:16 pm;
June 24 at 7:18 am and again at 4:30 pm). In regards to the scheduled
counseling appointment on April 13, 2015, the appointment was made and cancelled. As the day approached for the scheduled
appointment I was still involved in Microbiology lab and lecture classes
preparing for exams. Dealing with
LCCC’s cancelled college program demise, my distracted attitude needed
attention and faculty had to encourage me to finish the course I was already
involved in; which resulted in the letter grade of “A”. Upon calling to reschedule the appointment I
now wanted help in transferring credit courses to another college. I told the receptionist I was part of the
Surgical Tech program revamping. The first receptionist was not sure if she
should make the appointment, when a second receptionist was handed the phone I
was told, “we do not make appointments for that”.
With the benefit of all the doubts I still signed up for two
classes this past fall semester. One was
a pre-requisite class reserved for Radiology program students only; I accepted
I was not permitted to take it. The next
was an evening class of 3 credit hours in Medical Terminology. Periodically I checked the status of the
class online. ALHN 110 was scheduled to
start on Tuesday, August 25 from 6:00pm – 9:00pm. The last time I looked into Mycampus was the Thursday
prior, August 20th . Mycampus
now revealed I was not enrolled in any classes for the fall. I called LCCC enrollment services and was
told the class just got cancelled that same Thursday. I inquired to why I was not notified to the
cancellation but found out by pure happenstance that my class was deleted from
the system for me. LCCC employees could not tell me who deleted the enrolled class. I asked my workplace
to cancel the voucher for the class tuition and the
textbook was returned for refund without issue.
This is not the first time I have experienced this.
It is sad I had to resort to the Revdex.com to
even gain a response to this particular problem. I thank you I received one. There are no other choices for me but
to seek reimbursement from LCCC to obtain funding invested in LCCC courses for
a degree LCCC’s administration has made impossible to complete. I only regret the song and dance LCCC will now give me as I try to retrieve those funds and apply them to courses that did not have to be taken or will not transfer to another college.