Mengel Floor and Window Fashions

Complaint[redacted]Mengel was contracted to do flooring in our basement after a sewer back up. Flooring was installed May 2014. In July 2014, the laminate flooring, had humped at both ends of our basement. We contacted [redacted] at Mengel Flooring immediately with our concern, and he didn't come out until Sept. At this point, the insurance company has already pd their bill. It took another month for them to send out an employee to fix the flooring, at which time, the employee took a skill saw to the ends of our basement floor and cut the flooring away from the baseboards, leaving at least an 1" gap between the flooring and the baseboard. At this point, our painter had already been here and our baseboards were seamless and finished. The employee removed baseboards and then nailed them back on with a pneumatic nailer, missing the stud in the wall with 4 out of 5 nails. The employee also left a mess, came with no broom or vacummn to clean up his mess. Upon inspection of the work done, we again, contacted Mengel and informed him of the mess left by his employee. Mengel then decided to call in the flooring rep for [redacted] (the flooring manufacturer) bc he now believes it was due to moisture that the floor buckled on each end, and nothing in between. The [redacted] rep and [redacted] came out in November 2014. The rep, based on what [redacted] told him, indicated he wanted to wait till spring and come again in May 2015 to see if anything had changed. [redacted] ensured he would be in contact with us to set this up in May 2015. We heard nothing. June 1st, we emailed him to see when we can expect the visit. After much scheduling and re-scheduling and 3 cancellations, and no regard for our work schedule, they came out finally in August 2015. The rep indicated he didn't know why the flooring had buckled, couldn't for sure say it was moisture. They did a moisture read that day and it was 40% which is not un normal for a basement, and falls within the guidelines and installation instructions of the laminate flooring. During the visit, the [redacted] rep agreed to replace the flooring that remains humped at both ends (it's never laid down properly even since the tradesperson cut the ends back in Sept 2014. In that same visit, [redacted] agreed to take care of the baseboard repair. Now, 3 weeks to a month after their visit, we had to call the [redacted] rep to remember the conversation that took place in our basement that day because [redacted] now is refusing to do anything about our baseboards and is again, claiming moisture is to blame and he isn't doing anything about the baseboards. [redacted] we still have a basement floor that needs to be fixed properly. [redacted]Desired SettlementThe only amicable agreement would be boxes of flooring that we can pick up and install ourselves, and $ 500 for the damage done to our baseboards because we have to hire a contractor to fix the mess his employee has left. [redacted] Business Response [redacted] As [redacted] said; we did install the laminate (along with carpeting) in their basement . [redacted] called us in the summer to say the laminate was a problem. I attended to the home. I immediately believed it to be a "water/moisture" issue due tothe amount the laminate has raised up on two ends. I offered to have the laminate cut along the walls enough in hopes that it would settle down as it dried out. If it was a "water/moisture" issue; there was no warranty. We told [redacted] that it would be cut back beyond the baseboards; as it needed more room to settle (if it could) My installer went out to review with [redacted]. They discussed putting in t-molds across the room also. We would also order two t-molds to install across the room (again to allow more settling). We told [redacted] that when we install the baseboards; we do not "silicone and touch up"; we just nail them back on. [redacted] allowed us to come out and do this. On the installers second trip; he made the cuts and re-installed the existing baseboards. When my installer made the cuts in the laminate along the walls; he noticed the under pad was wet; along with the laminate. He brought the cut samples back to [redacted] to show me. I had the samples examined by three flooring representatives ([redacted] and [redacted]); who all agreed that it was "water/moisture" damage and it would not be covered under any warranty with them. The product is "[redacted]" manufactured; so these representative's would have been independent of the issue. After we were done; [redacted] was not happy due to two issues 1- the "t-mold" was in two pc's aross the room I told [redacted] that they do not make them that long in one pc 2- He said we "butchered" the baseboards in putting them back on. This work and return trips were done at no expense to [redacted] or [redacted] in an effort to try and make there issue go away. I told [redacted] that I was trying to help out as best as possible. [redacted] was not happy; so I offered to have the [redacted] rep come out. [redacted] was not happy with the time line. I also offered to have an "independent" flooring inspector come to [redacted] and [redacted]'s home. I told them that the "inspector" would charge them for the inspection; but if it was found to have been not "water/moisture"; [redacted] would re-imberse. I told them there was an "independent" flooring inspector in Saskatoon and Winnipeg. They agreed to let the [redacted] rep come The [redacted] rep scheduled an appointment to come out to the home. Upon inspection he asked if they would wait until the spring to let him look at it again to see if it would settle down any more. The [redacted] rep ([redacted]) believed it to be "water/moisture" also. [redacted] allowed this to happen. I made schedules with [redacted] to come out and had to cancel due to issues that were not of [redacted] or [redacted]'s fault. We tried to work around [redacted]'s schedule in doing so each time. I again: through email; told [redacted] that they could have the "independent inspector" come out if they wanted.I told them that [redacted] would abide by the inspector. [redacted] allowed [redacted] and I to come out again. On the last inspection; [redacted] offered to tear all of the laminate up. If; upon tear out; it was determined that it was "water/moisture" damage; there would be no coverage. [redacted] said he would be happy with the ends repaired and his baseboards re-done. [redacted] never offered to do his baseboards that I heard. When we were in the home; we did moisture readings on the floor. All were into the "red: and well above 40%; even after all this time. Most readings were into the 60% range [redacted] said we could schedule the "fix". Once the laminate came in from [redacted] I tried to schedule the fix with [redacted]. I emailed the date of Oct 7th to him; but he did not reply. We would remove damage laminate from the ends and replace. we would also re-nail on the baseboards (no siliconing or painting) [redacted] did not want us to put the baseboards back on and had asked for money to do this. I told [redacted] early on in this; that at the "end" when we were done and he was happy; I would do something for him. I was not trying to leave [redacted] and [redacted] stuck from the beginning. The belief is that it is not a warranty issue do to "water/moisture". I have made three trips out to Edonwold and my installer has made two trips out since their issue. It was not our intention to leave them in any mess. regarding the baseboard "mess". The baseboards were removed as is and nailed back on. They were all cut. We use proper baseboard nails when nailing with an "air gun". This is standard. I am not sure if they were not "straight" or what other issue [redacted] has. [redacted] has declined to have brought in the "in-dependant inspector" ; with the thought of working it out with [redacted] and myself. I thought after the last visit; it would be delt with to a satifactory resolution [redacted] Consumer Response (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)[redacted] gave me two options for our flooring. We chose to have the ends replaced. [redacted] has not been an area of concern on any of this. Yes, there were scheduling problems, as [redacted] said, but [redacted] has come to the table and has agreed to repair the ends - and we are satisfied with that. It's some areas of concern with Mengel's handling of this and issues with workmanship, that, to us, [redacted] is failing in responding to our concerns. Here are a list of our concerns that have accumulated over the past year and a half, [redacted]1) [redacted] insisting his installer, when he cut the floor, that the underlayment and flooring was wet. [redacted] was home that day - why did the installer not show this to me before he left? To me, this seems rather important to show the homeowner, especially when they are in the home at the time. The second part to this complaint is the interesting fact the installer gathered every end piece (64+) that was cut off, apparently bagged them and took them back to [redacted] but had no broom or vacuum to clean up the sawdust. At one point, we've asked [redacted] for some of the ends pieces so we could have a third party look at them - conveniently enough, all the pieces were given away to other flooring reps. He did indicate that we could pay out of our pocket for a certified inspector from Saskatoon or Winnipeg to travel to our home to get samples. [redacted]. [redacted]. We never did decline an independent inspector, as [redacted] indicated. We let the [redacted] rep come. We can't justify paying for this independent service, because honest and truly, if there was water droplets under the flooring that day, we would also have soggy baseboards, cracking paint, soggy drywall - none of which is present. No black mould behind the crooked baseboards either. In the end, [redacted] came up with a solution we can live with. [redacted]2) Now, we will come to the points that caused us to file a complaint. When [redacted] had indicated how they would remedy the situation, which we agreed to, and [redacted] also said "My baseboards re-installed properly" and which [redacted], and [redacted] have had numerous emails back and forth discussing the problem with the way the installer put our finished baseboards back on. No amount of silicone and patching can fix them - they have to be removed and reset. The north wall baseboard is set lower & needs to be pulled off and re-installed. In addition, along the east wall, there are 45 degree lapjoints that needs to be pulled and re-installed as well, because they also do not line up. Also, along the east wall, 14m of baseboard needs to be removed and re-installed, in order to complete the finishing. Believe us, is it was a simple matter of a bit of caulking and patching, I would have no problem with it - we have spent many hours finishing baseboards in our own homes over the years. Yes, they were nailed on with an air nailer, as confirmed by [redacted]. It doesn't change the fact that the majority of the nails are not counter sunk and are protruding, causing a hazard for our young children and potentially pets too. These all need to be set properly. If the nails had hit studs and the bottom plate, as normal, the nails would probably sink properly, but rather, the nails are randomly shot through the drywall, not pulling the baseboards tight against the wall. The baseboards in the rest of our basement were just completed flawlessly by our contractor before this incident, including the ones referenced in this complaint. After numerous conversations and his 2 or 3 visits to our basement, and he still refuses to acknowledge any knowing of what our concerns about the workmanship on the baseboards are. [redacted] 3) The next issue is the manner in which our laminate flooring was cut. [redacted] met with the installer on his first trip here. He seemed surprised the expansion joint was not installed as he indicated "that was supposed to be put in when the laminate was installed." He also shared that he had installed the other flooring (carpet) in our basement, and another installer completed the laminate. Originally, [redacted] had also indicated an expansion joint would be installed as the flooring went down - and it wasn't. It was AFTER the laminate had humped up on both ends that he said the expansion joint wasn't required, but would install one, now, after the fact. On the first visit, the installer had a circular saw. [redacted] said to him that there must be another way to cut it closer to the baseboards, as it'll leave too big of a gap past the baseboards - no small moulding could cover that! He said he had burnt up his tool that would cut closer to the wall - [redacted], the circular saw. [redacted] asked him, at that time, not to cut it with a skilsaw. He left and we assumed that when he returned the following week, that he would be using the proper tool. [redacted] was home at the time of this visit - [redacted] was at work. When he returned to complete the work, he proceeded to cut it the laminate flooring with a skilsaw, which leaves the flooring a VERY long way from the baseboards. We don't know if the installer relayed our concerns about cutting our new floor with a skilsaw to [redacted] - it appeared not. In the end, the installer managed to take every single chunk of laminate flooring from the ends, bagged them and gave them to [redacted], but didn't even clean up his mess of sawdust or leave our baseboards in the condition they were in BEFORE he started. [redacted]. [redacted] has not addressed our concerns. He has committed, in emails to [redacted], which we can still have, to that "in the end, he would offer to do something from Mengel". To date, nothing, and as of a couple of weeks ago, you again, indicated you are doing nothing about the baseboards. [redacted] baseboards will be returned to "as found in" condition. It would be acceptable to us to have the "repair" done, but NOT without assurance that the same lingering problems will not exist. In addition, the ONLY way we would agree to a "repair" at this point, is if [redacted], [redacted] & [redacted] can agree on a satisfactory conclusion to this incident, which ultimately means that we are not left with baseboards that need to be redone/reset or replaced due to poor workmanship. [redacted]Final Business Response [redacted] response to last letter dated Oct 13th; sent Oct 15th This is a "No warranty issue" as far as [redacted] is concerned. The three other suppliers are in agreement of [redacted]. [redacted] believes that the floor has failed only due to "water/moisture"; and no other reason. To achieve any warranty; an "certified in-dependant flooring inspector" would have to come and examine the floor. [redacted] and [redacted] would have to pay for that. If it was determined that it was not "water/moisture"; it would then be a warranty issue. At the beginning; when I told [redacted] that it was "water/moisture" issue; I offered to - re-do his entire laminate at my "cost". I also offered to cut the laminate back from the baseboards in hopes of it settling down.[redacted]; from the beginning said it was not a "water/moisture" issue. He let us cut the laminate back.[redacted] was told by myself, that we do not "re-silicone" or do paint touch ups in doing the baseboards. 1- My installer did have a vacuum with him on his visit. He "thought" he did a clean up at the time; which included taking all of the "pcs" of cut laminate. They were all thrown away except the few pc's he gave me. I gave them to the reps I spoke with earlier. I have gotten one back from a rep if [redacted] wishes to see it.The fact that no pc's were saved means nothing. The certified flooring inspector does not needto see these pc's to make a determination. [redacted]; in good [redacted]; has offered to send in two cases of laminate to fix up the ends and pay for the replacement of the damaged pc's.[redacted] has agreed to this from [redacted]. [redacted] has mentioned it would cost $500 to re-do the baseboards that my installer put on wrong. I have checked with two painting companies and have been given prices of $185 and $200 to "re-set" the baseboards. (the baseboards are already cut to size). This is not siliconing and paint touch ups where the nails are. [redacted]. I believe to resolve the issue; they should let [redacted] do as they said they would (and what they agreed to). [redacted] would arrange for another installer to come in and do "a repair" to the damaged laminate, [redacted] has said they will not cover the baseboards. If, in the end; [redacted] and [redacted] were happy with what [redacted] did; I would still offer to help out with the baseboard price to "install". [redacted]