Initial Business Response /* (1000, 8, 2016/01/29) */
***
I write in regard to a complaint received by the Revdex.com (***) and forwarded to our office on January 13, and received in our office January
19.*** I sincerely appreciate the opportunity to provide an explanation of the transaction in questionI value each customer and our strong reputation, and I value our strong *** *** it is unfortunate that our customer is dissatisfied, we nonetheless find great benefit in all feedback as we work to improve our business
Regarding *** complaint, I'd like to describe the transaction from our perspective and address the concerns they raise in their letter
Their contact was ***, who handles technical sales in our office*** contacted him inquiring about a water treatment system, and on September 4, 2015, *** emailed *** our quotation number *** (***)*** on this written quotation, the prices for clearly visible for two different systems to treat water from two different source locationsAlso clearly visible under Terms and Conditions is our Goods Return Policy; I draw your attention to the section that says, "Special Order Items: No returns allowed."
Several months passed, and on December 18, 2015, *** contacted us to place a partial order (for the smaller pipe size)*** explained that this equipment was not regular stock for us, and as special order equipment would have to be ordered inWe do not stock this type of equipment given its specificity and its relatively high cost*** *** Retailers of all types have similar policies in place, as do our own vendorsTo place the order with our vendor, a deposit was required and was paid via credit cardThe equipment arrived within the estimated time frame, and on Dec 31, 2015, *** picked up the equipment and paid the remaining amount
On January 5, 2016, *** emailed *** to complain that the price was too high, and would be returning the product*** reminded *** that the terms and conditions of the order were that the goods could not be returnedThese terms and conditions, shown on our quotation referenced above, also appear in the same location on *** invoice (***)
*** came to our office on January 5, 2016, with the intent of returning the equipmentHe insisted upon receiving a full refund and advised that whether we agreed or not, he was returning the equipment and leaving it in our warehouseWe would not allow this; I advised *** that I could not accept the equipment and could not take responsibility for it, and that to protect it and ensure its safety he should keep it in his possessionI was a part of this conversation, as was *** *** *** He received a written quotation from us, and we had no reason to assume we were the only place he inquired*** We spoke with *** with nothing but courtesy and respect*** *** *** if we spoke with customers in such a mannerSimilarly, the other quotes *** attributes to us aren't fair representations of the conversationI explained to *** that he had received a written quote, had been made aware in writing of the terms and conditions, and had completed the transaction, and we had done so in good faith and in accordance with our written offer.*** *** ***
While emotions can run high in business, we nonetheless wanted to keep perspectiveWe did not want a customer to be unhappy with usWe immediately contacted our vendor, who agreed to reduce our bill somewhatWe then reduced our margin somewhat, and between the two reductions were able to offer to *** a 20% discount as a show of good faithIt was offered and immediately rejected over the telephone
I understand that *** are unhappy with the price paidI gather they have been able to find similar or same equipment elsewhere at a much lower costI understand this can be frustratingHowever, we purchase various types of equipment from literally thousands of different vendorsEquipment such as this is sold at the manufacturer level, the wholesale level, the distributor level, and the retail levelWe are not able to buy this equipment directly, nor from distributorsWe can access it, however, and we often doWe buy this type of equipment at the best possible price available to usPerhaps *** was able to source similar equipment from a company that is able to buy this type of equipment in bulk, or directly from a manufacturerWe cannot sayWe have no idea for what price another company is able to purchase equipment, and what they might be able to charge for itWe buy directly from the manufacturer for many items, and others, we are forced to acquire from other resellers further up the supply chainAll we can do when someone requests a price is put our selling price forward and offer our services to those who chose to avail of them*** However, the key point remains: we set a price based on our internal costs and internal factors, including the equipment, the overhead our company carries, our selling and transaction costs, and our desired margin - a process used by any businessDifferent businesses will have different costs in each areaAll any company can do is put a price on offer and allow customers to choose
In this instance, *** asked for and received a written quotationThe equipment they ultimately selected, after several months, was provided at the agreed-upon price and in the agreed-upon timeframeOur terms and conditions were clearly communicatedAt all times we treated *** with professionalism and respect, in spite of the situation becoming emotionally chargedWe made a significant offer as a compromise that was rejectedI believe we have followed responsible practices in our sales process, and in attempting to rectify the situationI believe we have proactively followed steps recommended by the *** in this instance, and believe that while our price ultimately is not competitive in this particular product, that we have acted properly and ethicallyOur offer of a 20% discount remains available to resolve the matter should *** wish to avail of itOur goal is to maintain our reputation and our relationship with each and every customer.***
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 10, 2016/02/05) */
As I stated in my first complaint, I am just a person seeking advice from a professionalI am involved in a small business and I like to keep things Local as much as I canI went to Kean's pump shop and I honestly knew nothing about "Chlorination Systems"*** I was quoted on a system and I had no reason to believe that the prices would vary so much from business to business, so I felt best "sticking with the people who clearly knew what they were talking about"
Kean's pump shop quoted me on all items necessary for a chlorination system, ie; flow meter, metering pump and solution tankAll of this sounds fairly complicated for the average person, so why would I argueTotal Quote $***
Within hours after purchasing my system as luck would have it, I got in contact with a company in my line of work and I was advised of the Outrageous mistake that I had just madeI just bought a "system" that cost me ***, and I only needed a metering pumpKean's pump shop sold me a plastic barrel aka "Solution tank" for $***, I could have used a bucket, straight from a chlorine bottle, or an old barrel, anything that can hold a liquid!!! But they sold me a "solution tank" for $***! They couldn't tell me that I could save myself some money and offer me other suggestions; that don't sound like good customer service to me
When I wrote my original complaint to you I didn't realize it at the time, but the pump that I have is 115V and I have a 230V lineSo the metering pump wouldn't have worked for me anyway
They Quoted a price more than $*** above the purchase price of anywhere else this "system" can be found to a customer who was seeking advice and obviously very much unaware of purchasing such a "unit"
The quote was issued back in September and the purchase was made in December without being issued a new quote to ensure price of item had not changedThey obviously did not check to see if they could find a better price and provide top quality serviceAlso, most quotes are only good for days
They did not offer to return this item that had such a magnificent difference in price with the customer reimbursing the shippingThe item ordered had not been altered in any way to suit us and was an item listed for sale with this companyThis would have been quite acceptable because it would have still been a great savings in the end
Two chlorination systems to service their needs have been purchased since(same packaging and same description) for 1/3rd the cost
Kean's Pump Shop had quoted and supplied parts that was not even necessary even though customer had described the business that they were involved in depending on their knowledge and expertise
For example a $*** barrel that was not even necessaryNo one else in the industry used such a deviceA flow meter was also included even though customer do not have a continuous flow, another part that does not even work for me
The 20% discount that was offered in a show of good faith did not come close to satisfy the difference in price from another vendor to theirs
***
Right now I have a white barrel "solution tank" (unnecessary Item), a Flow meter (does not work for me, because I don't have a continuous flow water line), and a 115V Metering pump (don't work because my electrical line is 230V)
***
***
***
I contacted *** by the phone and explained to him my concerns and also explained to him that I was hoping he could give me an answer because I had to return home (hour drive), I didn't want to have to make a trip back with the itemsI waited a reasonable amount of time (hours) and I called back, No AnswerSo I waited again, called but still, No AnswerSo I decided to go to his office and see what he came up withI went into his office and *** told me that he didn't call yet he had other things to do first
No doubt, I'm not the only customer he has, but I just think that "excellent customer service" would be prioritising and at least understanding that I had a long drive and wanted to take care of this before I went back to my home hours away
***
I will not stop trying to return this especially now that it is just sitting on my floor and not one piece of it works for me
If this item can be returned and my money reimbursed, I will stop***
***
Final Business Response /* (4000, 18, 2016/03/03) */
We are in receipt of your further correspondence dated February 5, regarding complaint ***I apologize for the delay in responding; I was out of the country twice in that time period on business and have been largely out of the officeSome specific information regarding the equipment we provided required access to I specifications (see below) that were located in my officeI appreciate your patienceI have reviewed the complainant's correspondence, and I wish to address a few items raised
We have already addressed point raised in ***' rebuttal; our price was sourced from vendors available to us; we offered the price and terms and conditions in writing (***) and *** accepted that quoteWe in no way misled *** in their purchaseEverything was communicated in writing, and at no time did we misrepresent the product, the costs, nor the terms of sale
As for point of the rebuttal, we did indeed ensure the originally quoted price was still on offerWe, like many other businesses, have had our costs increase dramatically due to the rise of the US dollar*** are claiming that by honouring our original quote we have somehow confirmed that our price was inappropriate and that honouring the quote is reflective of poor service; this is inaccurateWe did contact the vendor of that equipment available to us, confirmed that the cost to us had not changed, and agreed to honour the quote from some months prior***
Speaking to point 3, this is indeed a special order item, and *** were informed of this - they were well aware that we were ordering this item for them specificallyAs we have earlier communicated, our terms and conditions on special order items were written on our quote and on our invoice
Regarding point 4, we are aware that *** state were able to purchase similar or same equipment elsewhere at a lower costThe sources available to us price their sales to us such that we must charge what we quoted to *** I would like to be the lowest price in town more often, that isn't realistic, especially for non-stock itemsThis is why we provide clear, written quotations to customers - so that they can make an informed decision and know what they are buying, and for what price
In ***' rebuttal they have labeled two different points as Point 5; speaking to the first point 5, it suggests we have sold unnecessary itemsI disagree (and wonder if this is from where some of the considerable price difference stems)Chlorination systems are, by definition, designed to provide a high certainty of successful disinfectionFor food processing industries and potable water uses, *** (***) *** Proper containers and tanks that are approved for the intended use is the only proper method of storage, transport, and use of disinfection chemicalsTo suggest "no one else in the industry uses this equipment" is inaccurateEvery municipality providing chlorination services for municipal water requires the use of NSF-certified solution tanks*** The tank we provided met the following conditions:
It is completely enclosed; this prevents the introduction of debris or other contaminants (which would render the disinfection process ineffective and the entire process useless, exposing people and products to risk of bacterial exposure);
Rated for use in potable water applications; this means the plastic is of a grade that will not break down over time, releasing unintended chemicals into the water
Will not have its rigidity or its integrity compromised by fluctuations in temperatures;
Made of one-piece, seamless construction to minimize the risk of leaks
Made of a *** resin that is compliant with the *** requirements and certified to *** for potable water applications;
Designed with a proper integrated location for the mounting of pumping equipment
Rated for use with chlorine and liquids with similar specific gravity (density) to ensure structural integrity
*** (***) ***
As for the use of a flow meter, again, any system designed to be responsible for disinfection requires certainty; flow rates determine how much water is being used, and therefore how much chlorine is to be added to the waterWithout a flow meter it is not possible to provide this certainty and to guarantee accuracy of the chlorine doseThe only way to ensure a proper dose of chlorine is to use a flow-proportional systemGuessing or estimating chlorine doses exposes the user to tremendous riskI believe it would be irresponsible for a company selling such equipment to recommend using unapproved, uncertified solution tanks and dosing equipment.***
Speaking to the rest of the complaint and rebuttal, I can only say once again that we have made a good-faith effort to resolve by offering a discountThat offer remains available should *** wish to avail of itWe are not questioning their honesty, but I stand by my statements regarding the conversations held in our offices, what was said, and more importantly, what was not saidIn this area, we will have to simply agree to disagree
To summarize, we have quoted a full system designed to chlorinate water safely and reliably, including the proper tank, meter, and similar, in accordance with industry standards, regulatory guidelines, safety standards, and best practicesWe provided a written price in advance, with our terms and conditions clearly indicated on the quote, and also on the final invoice*** it seems our price varies considerably with respect to other offerings, it similarly seems that *** comparison does not include key pieces of equipment we (and our industry) view as essential for safety and reliabilityEven were that not the case, however, I can only offer a price based on our costsWe did that; we honoured our written price and terms; and when learning of ***' dissatisfaction, offered the best we could in terms of a discount to show our sincerity*** I understand that *** are not happy, and I wish that wasn't soNonetheless, we have done all we can reasonably be expected to do to remedy
Sincerely
***
Final Consumer Response /* (4200, 20, 2016/03/09) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
This is in response to Kean's Pump Shop
I have explained my story, and I feel as though I have been treated unfair
We can continue to go back and forth like this for a very long time, but the fact of the matter is that, ***This company obviously is much more educated in business than *** (***) *** *** ***
***
***
***
*** *** ***
I was, and still am willing to pay for all expense incurred to get this "system", back to the original supplier
This is not a small amount of money, I don't have a lot of money and every cent that I do have in on a budgetI did not touch, use or alter in anyway the packages that were picked up that day in *** and I just wanted to return them and pay the shipping cost
I don't feel as though I'm asking for a lotKean's Pump shop will be taking no loss for this transactionI am willing to pay for the shipping charges incurred by them
They own a pump shop specializing in Chlorination systems, can't they keep this "system" in stock for the next poor soul that needs one of these items?
Please hear what I'm saying, I am pleading with you to take this back and give me back my money
***
Thank you for sharing Mr. [redacted]'s communication with your organization regarding the installation of heating and air conditioning equipment in his home. While we understand that he is not satisfied with our service to date,...
we respectfully disagree with his contention that we have not honoured our warranties and have breached our guarantees. We take our excellent reputation very seriously and in the rare case we have a dissatisfied customer, we take whatever steps possible to remedy and repair our relationship. However, in this instance, we believe we have gone beyond what is reasonable to satisfy Mr. [redacted]. We have honoured our promises and have attempted to go beyond them. Nonetheless Mr [redacted] feels he is entitled to a refund. We respectfully disagree. When a business enters into an agreement in good faith, and when that business is eager and ready to fully honour its commitments, we do not believe repudiating the contract is fair.
We have attached for your review a copy of Mr. [redacted]'s contract with us. You will see on pages 3 and 4 the various warranties we have offered. To summarize them, our company guarantees that we will properly spec the equipment for the job, and any errors will be corrected by us at our cost; that we will provide repairs if needed to equipment or workmanship that is faulty; that should a compressor fail, the entire condenser shall be replaced (note that no compressor has failed in this instance). We have attended to Mr. [redacted]'s equipment to make adjustments and minor repairs, and to troubleshoot an intermittent defect in the condenser. Being unable to quickly determine the fault (after having consulted with the manufacturer, who was similarly unable to establish the cause), we have instead attempted to replace the system. Mr [redacted] has instead elected to have another system installed and is now seeking his money back. This would place us in a position of considerable loss, through no fault of our own. We have at all times honoured our promises, and are seeking still to do so via replacing the equipment, which Mr. [redacted] is refusing to allow. We respectfully submit that we have honoured our contract and have demonstrated that we remain committed to doing so, and ask simply that we not be expected to suffer financial loss. We have kept our promises. We believe that we have demonstrated good faith in our dealing with Mr. [redacted].
We would like to address each of Mr. [redacted]'s assertations individually:
1) Mr [redacted] mentioned that the unit installed did not work properly from the time it was initially installed. This is not the case. The unit was installed on May 15, 2014; we attended to the site for a 45 minute orientation and instruction as to how to use the unit May 16, 2014; at that time the unit was properly functioning and no troubles were evident. We explained that all heating equipment uses set points and set-point differentials to heat/cool a space; at all times the differential observed was normal, or made normal with minor adjustment. Our first trouble call from the homeowner was August 15 2014; during the intervening time period the unit was function to manufacturer's specifications in all respects.
2) Mr. [redacted] indicated that we had attended to the unit on six occasions to attempt repair. This is not the case, as evidenced by copies of the attached work orders. Each of the six visits is explained below; one visit was to make a minor repair (adding refrigerant); the other is the final visit that triggered our desire to replace the unit completely:
I. Work Order XXXXX July 5 2014: to perform duct cleaning, which is a service unrelated to the mini-split heat pump installed (which itself is ductless and is completely unrelated to the HRV ductwork in the home); as can be seen on the work order, this is a different service for which we were hired; Mr. [redacted] also asked our electrical division to visit at a later date to quote on some electrical work
ii. Work Order XXXXX Aug 15, 2014: This was indeed a trouble call that was properly remedied that day; owing to a longer distance between the indoor and outdoor components than is typical, the unit required additional refrigerant to operate at peak efficiency. This modification was made and the unit operated properly in all respects. The homeowner's comment regarding the installation of a "second-stage compressor" was not a part of a technical recommendation or diagnosis. A different or additional compressor cannot be installed into any such unit. There clearly is a misunderstanding on the part of the homeowner, as there is no such procedure possible under any circumstances. No compressor exists in the indoor unit. We do not know what the homeowner is referring to in this instance. Our signed work order is attached. Our technician recalls that this was the date frost was observed inside the indoor unit, which is symptomatic of low refrigerant, as is the grinding noise. The additional refrigerant was added and the unit performed normally upon testing.
iii. Work Order XXXXX Aug 26 2014: The unit was over cooling (referred to commonly as a "set point differential" issue - usually a minor operating or programing issue); while we had been asked to attend to the house for 830AM that day, which we did, the customer had to leave the home before 1000AM and asked us to leave before we could complete our diagnostic work; we wanted to test the temperature setting on the remote by switching it with another to see if it produced a different result (the recommended procedure for troubleshooting this matter); we switched the remote and the customer then asked us to leave to accommodate their schedule before we would test whether this had been effective.
iv. Work Order XXXXX Aug 27 2014: merely a continuation of the work we were unable to complete the day prior due to the customer's requiring us to leave before we had time to perform the work from the 26th; The remote control units were switched per manufacturers' recommendation and system operation was normal. There was no defect with the equipment. The "room size" matter referred to does not mean the equipment is not suited for the installation; it may require, however, that temperature settings be adjusted to compensate. Again, this is not uncommon, as every installation requires a degree of familiarity, which only comes once the unit is operating and exposed to the full gamut of operating conditions. Our technician insists that at no time did he recommend an additional inverter be installed - the inverter is the outdoor unit, while his work was on the indoor unit. He made no recommendations about installing additional indoor, outdoor, or other units or compressors at any time. No such recommendations appear in the documentation which was signed by the customer.
v. Work Order XXXXX, Sept 25 2014: the customer requested a service call; when we arrived the concern was explained that there was an error code reading on the unit of H1; this is not an error code. On several occasions throughout the day, any heat pump will enter "defrost mode" for a few minutes; it is a normal operating function of every heat pump. The H1 code merely informs the owner that the unit is in defrost mode. The unit was at all times operating normally while we were onsite. In order to troubleshoot an intermittent problem, the problem has to be occurring while we are onsite. Otherwise it is impossible to determine the fault.
vi. Work Order XXXXX, Sept 30 2014: here we have the first (and only) indication of equipment failure (vs adjustment or fine-tuning); our diagnosis was performed, and neither us nor the manufacturer could explain the problem. Rather than begin what could be a process lasting several days of trial and error based on manufacturer's recommendations, we instead advised the customer that it would be better to replace the outdoor component (the only piece of equipment faulting); we advised the customer that we needed our manufacturer's area representative, who is based in Dartmouth, to approve a replacement, and that this process usually takes a number of days. Note that between installation on May 15th to Sept 30, there were no mechanical faults or failures with the installed equipment. Given that one visit was to orient the customer on unit operation, one was to explain that the concern of an error code was not, in fact, an error code at all, one visit to complete an adjustment that the customer's schedule did not allow us to complete the day prior, and one call was for work completely unrelated to the equipment but to perform additional work on the customer's HRV duct work, we can see that to suggest we had six events of failure is inaccurate. There was only one, and we immediately began the process to replace, rather than repair, the unit.
3) Mr. [redacted] indicates that we did not keep our appointment times; on one occasion, when Mr, [redacted] had asked our electrical division to attend to an unrelated matter at his home, we contacted Mr. [redacted] in advance to advise we would be roughly 90 minutes late; he could not accommodate that and we rebooked for two days later. When we arrived, nobody was home and when we reached Mr. [redacted] on his telephone he told us something had come up and he had forgotten to tell us. We have no indication of an appointment scheduled for August 2; we have no record of phone calls not returned; nonetheless, had this occurred, while it would be unfortunate and certainly frustrating, that does not constitute an unwillingness nor an inability to provide service and does not represent a breach of warranty. We have no indication that messages were unreturned; we have reviewed our call logs through our VoIP telephone system and we cannot instances were a call was placed to us from the homeowner without a corresponding outbound call to the homeowner within one business day. We believe we have attempted to contact the homeowner in response to their calls in a timely manner. If more specific instances - dates and times, and perhaps with whom Mr [redacted] or Mrs [redacted] was speaking - we could certainly investigate to ensure this doesn't happen in the future. However, with no specific information, we can only go by our call logs.
4) Mr [redacted] and Mrs [redacted] are correct in that once we began the process of replacing their unit, we briefly neglected our obligation to properly communicate with the customer. We informed them that we needed the manufacturer's approval to replace the outdoor unit under warranty, as this was beyond what both our warranty and the manufacturer's warranty call for. We have, on rare occasions, had to do this, and the approval process takes a few days. We advised the homeowner of this, contacted our manufacturer, and awaited word. We told the homeowner we would be in touch in about a week. As our manufacturer's representative was away, the process took ten (10) days to get approval. We did not contact the homeowner to advise them of the additional days required. We should have. When we received positive news from the manufacturer that the approval was granted and that a new unit had shipped, we contacted the customer. It was then that they told us they instead wanted a refund. We acknowledged that we took a few days longer than anticipated to remedy and that we were sorry for not communicating that an extra three (3) days would be required. We do not believe this constitutes breach of warranty, however.
5) The homeowner alleges breach of guarantee. We attached the guarantees which were a part of the contract signed by Mr. [redacted]. As can be seen, we have indeed honoured and gone beyond what the contract requires of us. We made sure the unit was properly installed and configured, made proper adjustments, and, although the unit did not suffer a compressor failure (the only part of the warranty that requires a replacement of the outdoor unit) we nonetheless attempted to replace the unit. We have met and exceeded our contractual obligations at all times in an attempt to deliver to Mr. [redacted] and Mrs. [redacted] value that goes beyond what we have promised. At no time in his conversations with Mrs. [redacted] did [redacted] agree that we had breached our warranty; at all times, he was empathetic to their concerns and assured them we would, as soon as possible, seek a replacement unit from the manufacturer.
6) We elected to replace, rather than repair, the unit in question because the problem was intermittent and would likely require a "trial and error" approach to repair. We did not want to delay the customer's return to full function and wanted to provide them with piece of mind, and felt we could only assure them and us that the unit was trouble-free by replacing. In other words, as soon as we had a unit failure, we immediately moved to replace the unit. However, this requires consent from the manufacturer, and takes time for the unit to transit between the [redacted] and our location. We moved as fast as possible and are confident we exceeded not only our warranties, but also acted in a manner that exceeds the practices of any other HVAC company in our market.
7) Mr [redacted] states that we left his home without heat for three weeks; the unit failed on Sept 30, and by Oct 10 a new unit was en route. Mr. [redacted] refused to let us remedy the matter, and this is why he had no heat for weeks thereafter. If we are not allowed to remedy, we cannot be held responsible for the weeks that followed. It is worth noting that temperatures outside during this period were warmer than average and the temperature differential indoors vs outdoors is likely to be the cause of excess condensation in the home ([redacted] ); the homeowner had poured concrete in the home during this period, and it is reasonable to expect that curing concrete will emit a great deal of humidity, which we feel is the likely contributor to the condensation in question.
8) Throughout the homeowner's complaint, they list dates where they had concerns with their equipment; it can been seen that for each contact from the customer indicating a concern, we have a work order within a day or two. The vast majority of visits were unrelated to equipment faults. We cannot agree that we were unresponsive as the homeowner alleges - when they called us, we were there. It cannot reasonably be said that we repeatedly did not return calls; had that been the case we would not have been in the home to attend to their concerns. We again acknowledge that it did take us longer than anticipated to get manufacturer approval to replace the unit (which was required as it was in excess of the provisions of any warranty provided); we acknowledge that we did not inform them of the delay nor the reasons for it. We did, however, within ten (10) days, have the approval and a unit en route; this is not a breach of our guarantee. It is one regrettable delay, and that delay was in in communication only, as we attempted to exceed the provisions of the warranties that formed a part of our contract.
[redacted] given the position the homeowner has taken - effectively, to repudiate our contract despite our continued compliance with our obligations and our attempt to exceed them - places us in an unreasonable position of loss in spite of our good faith efforts. Our position is that we have honoured our obligations and have no reason to repudiate the contract based on the information we have. Should the homeowner have an alternate proposal, please ask them to forward it to us for review so we might move closer to a resolution. We sincerely appreciate you efforts to assist.
[redacted]DOCUMENTS ATTACHED[redacted]
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 11, 2014/12/14) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Rebuttal to Mr. [redacted]
1. To date, Mr. [redacted] has not addressed a written complaint my wife sent to [redacted] on Aug 9, 2014.
2. First, [redacted] manager, [redacted] comment that it was not up to [redacted] to replace the system and they do not give away units freely, when it failed completely on Sept 30, 2014, is a clear indication that [redacted] was not ready to fully honour its guarantees.
Second, manager [redacted] was aware that we had no heat in the main floor of our house for 2 weeks and it was freezing. Yet, [redacted] provided us no update on how [redacted] intended to fix the system. This level of customer service was totally unacceptable. My wife contacted [redacted] on Oct 2 again and he promised to give us an answer by Oct 6, at the latest. We did not receive any update from [redacted] and my wife had to contact [redacted] again on Oct 10. It was only then that [redacted] inform us that they would replace the outdoor unit and it would take another week for the replacement unit to arrive. Mr. [redacted] had acknowledged in his written reply that [redacted] had not communicated to us. [redacted]
Third, we had also informed the technicians about appointments made that were not kept, no one returned our calls for weeks, and appointments made were cancelled at the last minute. The technicians clearly informed us that they relayed our complaints to their manager. Yet no one at [redacted] acknowledged or responded to our complaints.[redacted]
Forth, I requested Mr. [redacted] to remove the defective system from our house and he refused to do so. Refusing a refund is one thing but refusing to remove the defective system from our house is a much more serious matter.[redacted]
Fifth, [redacted] had not definitely and correctly identified the source of our growing problems. They had blamed the problem on our room size, the remote and our digital thermostats. They had never pointed to the outdoor unit as the source of our problems as evident in records of the [redacted] work orders. They were only replacing the outdoor unit because it had stopped working and only upon our continuous insistence to replace the system. Thus, we do not believe that replacing the outdoor unit alone would resolve all of our issues. In contrast, our new system from their competitor works perfectly from Day 1.[redacted]
3. Mr. [redacted] had admitted that [redacted] was "unable to quickly determine the fault (after having consulted with the manufacturer, who was similarly unable to establish the cause)". This means the system is defective and should warrant a refund.[redacted]
4. [redacted] had not definitely diagnose the problems. They blamed the problems on our room size, remote control and digital thermostats. At no point in time did they identify the outdoor unit as the source of all the problems as evident in records of their work orders. They were simply replacing the outdoor unit because it stopped functioning in 4 months. [redacted]
[redacted]
5.To reiterate, we experienced problem with the system from Day 1. The orientation and instruction was on the day of the installation, which was May 15, 2014. It makes no sense for [redacted] to return the next day to provide orientation and instruction[redacted] We simply would not have agreed to it. I like to request Mr. [redacted] to show concrete evidence that this is [redacted]'s normal practice to return the next day to provide orientation and instruction in all of their installations.
The truth is we called [redacted] representative, [redacted], to inform him that the temperature of the mini-split system did not match the remote control set temperate or the room digital thermostat temperature. [redacted], in turn, called the installation technician, [redacted] showed up to fix the system and informed us that we can expect some discrepancies (about 1.5 degree Celsius downstairs and 2 degree Celsius upstairs). However, the discrepancies persisted and increased over time.
We were on vacation out of the country from June 2-14, 2014 and from June 20-26, 2014. When we returned from vacation and used the system in July, we noticed the temperature setting issue persisted and increased over time. Other additional issues also begin to surface over time. My wife called [redacted] but continuously experienced appointment booking problems with [redacted], which led to my wife to send a written complaint to [redacted] on Aug 7, 2014. A copy of the written complaint had been made available to Mr. [redacted].
6. Please find below the six service calls I referred to, all related to equipment faults.
May 16, 2014 Troubleshoot system set temperature issue.
Aug 15, 2014 Troubleshoot grinding noise, ice build-up in the indoor unit upstairs and set temperature issue. Moved indoor temperature sensors.
Aug 26, 2014 Troubleshoot set temperature issue. Upstairs is too cold. [redacted] suspected remote control problem.
Aug 27, 2014 Troubleshoot set temperature issue. There was a 4 degree Celsius difference between the set temperature (e.g. 24 degree Celsius) and the system's temperature (e.g. 20 degree Celsius). Technician believed bedroom size was an issue.
Sep 25, 2014 Troubleshoot H1 error code and heating that had stopped working. They told us it is normal defrost cycle but the system would not work for many hours (over 5 hours).[redacted]
Sep 30, 2014 Troubleshoot E1 high pressure error code; loud, high frequency noise, intermittent functioning of the system and set temperature issues.
7. At no time did my wife ask technician [redacted] to leave.
8. This system enters defrost mode for hours (over 5 hours)[redacted]
9. It is very important to note that [redacted] did not advise us that it would replace the outdoor component on Sep 30, 2014 as Mr. [redacted] had claimed. This was certainly not documented in the [redacted] work order that they would replace the unit.
The truth is on Sep 29, 2014, my wife informed manager [redacted] that our system was broke. On Sep 30, 2014, technician [redacted] informed my wife that he could not get the system to operate. On Oct 2, 2014, my wife called [redacted] since we did not hear from them. On Oct 10, 2014, my wife called [redacted] and he informed that a new unit will be ordered.
10. Mr. [redacted] has acknowledged fault in their lack of communication with us.
11. [redacted] Satisfaction Guarantee states that "With our SATISFACTION Guarantee, if you are not completely satisfied with your new system anytime during the first 12 months, we will make any changes necessary or REPLACE it with a system of equal value, at no cost to you." Mr. [redacted]'s written statement is contrary to what the [redacted] Satisfaction Guarantee stated.
12. Mr. [redacted] had conveniently ignored to inform that [redacted] had been taking a trial and error approach to repairing our system for 4 months without success.
13. The replacement unit arrived in town on Oct 15, 2014. The earliest appointment if we accept the replacement unit was Oct 16, 2014. The unit had failed prior to Sep 30, 2014, the date of the service call. The elapsed time between the failure date (Sep 27, 2014) and Oct 16, 2014 is 20 days.
14. As for unresponsiveness, we are referring to [redacted] lack of timely acknowledgement, response and communication regarding our complaints.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 23, 2015/02/20) */
Thank you [redacted] for emailing Mr. [redacted] concerns regarding his last complaint. As we have
indicated before we feel we have honoured our promises stated in our contract and have attempted
to exceed them.I have included Mr [redacted] concerns and responded to each one that is labeled response.
1. To clarify, I stated that [redacted] has not addressed a written complaint by my wife sent on August 9, 2014. I believe the business protocol is to acknowledge receiving the complaint within a few days and a formal response within one or two weeks. This did not occur. Mr. [redacted] now asked for specific dates on January 9, 2015, 5 months after the complaint. I specifically indicated that I called [redacted] cell phone on or around May 16, 2014 to indicate that the system was not heating or cooling our home to the set temperature. [redacted] has never confirmed that. Instead, Mr. [redacted] said they attended to the site for a 45 minute orientation. This is untrue. I requested Mr. [redacted] to show evidence that this is [redacted] normal practice to return the next day to provide orientation and instruction. I have not received the requested information. We are in the process of complying a list of dates that we called [redacted]
Response: Once [redacted] received the written complaint from Mr. [redacted] wife on August 7th he immediately contacted our dispatcher and had these complaints reviewed. We have no indication from our records of any of these problems existed as stated before. I also addressed these issues several times during phone call conversations with Mr. [redacted].
I see nothing wrong with asking for specific dates on January 9, 2015 for we have to investigate these complaints by Mr. [redacted]. When [redacted] received the call we had a technician go to Mr. [redacted] and there was nothing wrong with the unit, we instructed the customer how to change settings (orientation).
2. The work orders stated that "If you nd the work satisfactory, by signing this receipt, you accept the work as completed and agree to the terms and conditions as stated on both sides of this form and you agree to pay for the same upon presentation of invoice."
First, what is "nd"?
Second, we signed the form to indicate that the work was completed by the technician and not to indicate that "the equipment was operating normally" as Mr. [redacted] had claimed.
Response: "nd" was a typing error.
Once the work order is signed this indicates the customer agrees to what is stated on the work order.
3. Mr. [redacted] stated that we asked their technician, [redacted], to leave on August 26 before they could complete their diagnostic work. I reaffirm that we did not ask technician, [redacted], to leave. Yes, my wife had an appointment at 10 am that day and we informed [redacted] of this at the time we made the appointment. [redacted] could continue to work even after my wife left for her appointment because [redacted] technicians are bonded. However, [redacted] is a furnace technician. He did not know how to diagnose the temperature setting issue and had to call another technician [redacted] was told to try switching the remotes. This was done and my wife was asked to wait and see what happened and call them. At no point did my wife asked [redacted] to leave.
Response: As stated on the signed work order (XXXXX) the customer had to leave at 10:00 and we would have to return for a second visit. As a normal business practice we would much rather finish the job in the first trip instead of making a second visit for obvious reasons. We were not told to stay and complete the work. If the customer did not want us to leave why would they sign a work order stating we will need to return to complete the work?. The reason [redacted] called another technician was for a second opinion.
4. Mr. [redacted] stated "....we have made good faith and sincere efforts to exceed our warranty by replacing the equipment rather than attempting repairs of either intermittent defects and/or a defect that neither the manufacturer nor our company has seen before." In his statement, Mr. [redacted] admitted that the system was defective. We had already stated many times that the system was not functioning properly from Day 1. Thus, we qualify for a refund according to the Consumer Handbook.
Response: As stated in section 1 from our last report Mr [redacted] said the unit was not functioning properly from Day 1. This is not the case. Please refer to our reply in section 1.
In contrast, we have now owned a [redacted] heat pump system as replacement of the [redacted] system for almost 3 months now. We have not called the technicians to come in even once to service the system. The system is running day and night perfectly. This comparison clearly distinguishes a system that is defective and a system that functions as design.
Response: Its great to hear Mr. [redacted] new heat pump system is working fine. If we had the opportunity to fix Mr. [redacted] heat pump that would be working fine as well.
5. Mr. [redacted] stated "Our only mistake was in not updating the customer when we learned our manufacturer's representative would be away, thereby adding a few days to the process."
[redacted] has made many mistakes (e.g. no one returned our calls for weeks, appointment made were not kept, appointments made were cancelled at the last minute, taking a trial and error approach to repair our system for 4 months, not responding to complaints, breaching warranties etc.) The most serious and unacceptable mistake was leaving us without heat in the main floor of the house for almost 3 weeks.
Response: Please refer to section 3 & 4 from our last report. Mr. [redacted] is clearly repeating his concerns.
6. Mr. [redacted] stated "The customer was fine with this insofar as we were aware, and only once we advised that a new unit was shipped were we told this was no longer satisfactory."
This is untrue. On October 10, 2014, my wife called manager [redacted] because we did not hear from him. At that time, we had no heat in the main floor of our house for two weeks already because the heat pump failed completely and [redacted] technicians could not repair it. [redacted] had promised to inform us what [redacted] would do with our system on October 6, 2014 but he did not.
[redacted] called later on October 10, 2014 to inform that they would replace the outdoor unit (not the entire system). At that point, we indicated to [redacted] that we would not want to have the outdoor unit installed and requested a refund. This is because replacing the outdoor unit alone does not guarantee that all of our issues would be resolved. Mr. [redacted] called on the same day to ask us to give [redacted] another chance. I indicated to Mr. [redacted] that we had completely lost our confidence in [redacted] and the performance of the [redacted] system. I requested a refund. Mr. [redacted] refused. I requested Mr. [redacted] to remove the defective system from our house. Mr. [redacted] refused also.
The replacement outdoor unit arrived in town on October 15, 2014 based on an email from Mr. [redacted] to me on October 15, 2014 at 3:35 pm. The earliest appointment if we accept the replacement unit was October 16, 2014. Our system had failed on September 27, 2014, prior to the date of the service call (September 30, 2014). The elapsed time between the failure date (September 27, 2014) and October 16, 2014 is 20 days without heat. This is unacceptable to us.
Once again please refer to the previous report to section 4. Also I had promised Mr. [redacted] as soon as the outdoor unit came in I could install it which could have been October 15, 2014.
7. Yes, I have been very professional in my communication with Mr. [redacted]. However, denying a refund is one thing. Refusing to remove the defective system from our house upon request is a much more serious matter.[redacted]
Response: I feel we have been very fair and have honoured our obligations and have no reason to
repudiate the contract based on the information we have. I have also been very professional[redacted]We have shown responsiveness and willingness to not only meet, but also exceed our
obligations. Thank you once again for sharing Mr. [redacted] report however his responses are
unsatisfactory and incorrect.[redacted]
Final Consumer Response /* (4200, 25, 2015/03/01) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Thank you [redacted] for your email. Mr. [redacted]'s response is unsatisfactory. Please find below our rebuttal.
1. If the complaints had been reviewed by [redacted] on Aug 7, 2014 as claimed, why was there no correspondence of acknowledgement, no correspondence of findings, and no correspondence to request clarification of events if they have questions? Why Mr. [redacted] and his manager, [redacted], did not mention to us about their review when we raised the problems we encountered with them on several occasions? This does not make sense.
If there were no evidence of problems related to our complaint, why did Mr. [redacted] apologize to me and said that we should not have any of the customer service issues again?
2. If the system were not defective, why was it necessary to have technicians come in 6 times in 4 months, why was there a growing list of issues, why did the system failed completely in 4 months when these systems are designed to operate for at least 16 years? There must be a logical reason - defective system, the system is not designed for the operating environment, the system capacity was incorrectly specified, improper installation, incorrect maintenance etc.?
We have the replacement [redacted] heat pump system for 4 months now, the system is operating continuously without any problem, the technicians have not returned a single time to fix anything. How does Mr. [redacted] explain this?
3. Mr. [redacted] is avoiding the key issue that the system is defective, unreliable and [redacted] and [redacted] had not been able to fix it. Mr. [redacted] has refused to admit that the system is defective. He has refused two reasonable offers by me and by [redacted] for partial refund.
Initial Business Response /* (1000, 8, 2016/01/29) */
***
I write in regard to a complaint received by the Revdex.com (***) and forwarded to our office on January 13, and received in our office January
19.*** I sincerely appreciate the opportunity to provide an explanation of the transaction in questionI value each customer and our strong reputation, and I value our strong *** *** it is unfortunate that our customer is dissatisfied, we nonetheless find great benefit in all feedback as we work to improve our business
Regarding *** complaint, I'd like to describe the transaction from our perspective and address the concerns they raise in their letter
Their contact was ***, who handles technical sales in our office*** contacted him inquiring about a water treatment system, and on September 4, 2015, *** emailed *** our quotation number *** (***)*** on this written quotation, the prices for clearly visible for two different systems to treat water from two different source locationsAlso clearly visible under Terms and Conditions is our Goods Return Policy; I draw your attention to the section that says, "Special Order Items: No returns allowed."
Several months passed, and on December 18, 2015, *** contacted us to place a partial order (for the smaller pipe size)*** explained that this equipment was not regular stock for us, and as special order equipment would have to be ordered inWe do not stock this type of equipment given its specificity and its relatively high cost*** *** Retailers of all types have similar policies in place, as do our own vendorsTo place the order with our vendor, a deposit was required and was paid via credit cardThe equipment arrived within the estimated time frame, and on Dec 31, 2015, *** picked up the equipment and paid the remaining amount
On January 5, 2016, *** emailed *** to complain that the price was too high, and would be returning the product*** reminded *** that the terms and conditions of the order were that the goods could not be returnedThese terms and conditions, shown on our quotation referenced above, also appear in the same location on *** invoice (***)
*** came to our office on January 5, 2016, with the intent of returning the equipmentHe insisted upon receiving a full refund and advised that whether we agreed or not, he was returning the equipment and leaving it in our warehouseWe would not allow this; I advised *** that I could not accept the equipment and could not take responsibility for it, and that to protect it and ensure its safety he should keep it in his possessionI was a part of this conversation, as was *** *** *** He received a written quotation from us, and we had no reason to assume we were the only place he inquired*** We spoke with *** with nothing but courtesy and respect*** *** *** if we spoke with customers in such a mannerSimilarly, the other quotes *** attributes to us aren't fair representations of the conversationI explained to *** that he had received a written quote, had been made aware in writing of the terms and conditions, and had completed the transaction, and we had done so in good faith and in accordance with our written offer.*** *** ***
While emotions can run high in business, we nonetheless wanted to keep perspectiveWe did not want a customer to be unhappy with usWe immediately contacted our vendor, who agreed to reduce our bill somewhatWe then reduced our margin somewhat, and between the two reductions were able to offer to *** a 20% discount as a show of good faithIt was offered and immediately rejected over the telephone
I understand that *** are unhappy with the price paidI gather they have been able to find similar or same equipment elsewhere at a much lower costI understand this can be frustratingHowever, we purchase various types of equipment from literally thousands of different vendorsEquipment such as this is sold at the manufacturer level, the wholesale level, the distributor level, and the retail levelWe are not able to buy this equipment directly, nor from distributorsWe can access it, however, and we often doWe buy this type of equipment at the best possible price available to usPerhaps *** was able to source similar equipment from a company that is able to buy this type of equipment in bulk, or directly from a manufacturerWe cannot sayWe have no idea for what price another company is able to purchase equipment, and what they might be able to charge for itWe buy directly from the manufacturer for many items, and others, we are forced to acquire from other resellers further up the supply chainAll we can do when someone requests a price is put our selling price forward and offer our services to those who chose to avail of them*** However, the key point remains: we set a price based on our internal costs and internal factors, including the equipment, the overhead our company carries, our selling and transaction costs, and our desired margin - a process used by any businessDifferent businesses will have different costs in each areaAll any company can do is put a price on offer and allow customers to choose
In this instance, *** asked for and received a written quotationThe equipment they ultimately selected, after several months, was provided at the agreed-upon price and in the agreed-upon timeframeOur terms and conditions were clearly communicatedAt all times we treated *** with professionalism and respect, in spite of the situation becoming emotionally chargedWe made a significant offer as a compromise that was rejectedI believe we have followed responsible practices in our sales process, and in attempting to rectify the situationI believe we have proactively followed steps recommended by the *** in this instance, and believe that while our price ultimately is not competitive in this particular product, that we have acted properly and ethicallyOur offer of a 20% discount remains available to resolve the matter should *** wish to avail of itOur goal is to maintain our reputation and our relationship with each and every customer.***
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 10, 2016/02/05) */
As I stated in my first complaint, I am just a person seeking advice from a professionalI am involved in a small business and I like to keep things Local as much as I canI went to Kean's pump shop and I honestly knew nothing about "Chlorination Systems"*** I was quoted on a system and I had no reason to believe that the prices would vary so much from business to business, so I felt best "sticking with the people who clearly knew what they were talking about"
Kean's pump shop quoted me on all items necessary for a chlorination system, ie; flow meter, metering pump and solution tankAll of this sounds fairly complicated for the average person, so why would I argueTotal Quote $***
Within hours after purchasing my system as luck would have it, I got in contact with a company in my line of work and I was advised of the Outrageous mistake that I had just madeI just bought a "system" that cost me ***, and I only needed a metering pumpKean's pump shop sold me a plastic barrel aka "Solution tank" for $***, I could have used a bucket, straight from a chlorine bottle, or an old barrel, anything that can hold a liquid!!! But they sold me a "solution tank" for $***! They couldn't tell me that I could save myself some money and offer me other suggestions; that don't sound like good customer service to me
When I wrote my original complaint to you I didn't realize it at the time, but the pump that I have is 115V and I have a 230V lineSo the metering pump wouldn't have worked for me anyway
They Quoted a price more than $*** above the purchase price of anywhere else this "system" can be found to a customer who was seeking advice and obviously very much unaware of purchasing such a "unit"
The quote was issued back in September and the purchase was made in December without being issued a new quote to ensure price of item had not changedThey obviously did not check to see if they could find a better price and provide top quality serviceAlso, most quotes are only good for days
They did not offer to return this item that had such a magnificent difference in price with the customer reimbursing the shippingThe item ordered had not been altered in any way to suit us and was an item listed for sale with this companyThis would have been quite acceptable because it would have still been a great savings in the end
Two chlorination systems to service their needs have been purchased since(same packaging and same description) for 1/3rd the cost
Kean's Pump Shop had quoted and supplied parts that was not even necessary even though customer had described the business that they were involved in depending on their knowledge and expertise
For example a $*** barrel that was not even necessaryNo one else in the industry used such a deviceA flow meter was also included even though customer do not have a continuous flow, another part that does not even work for me
The 20% discount that was offered in a show of good faith did not come close to satisfy the difference in price from another vendor to theirs
***
Right now I have a white barrel "solution tank" (unnecessary Item), a Flow meter (does not work for me, because I don't have a continuous flow water line), and a 115V Metering pump (don't work because my electrical line is 230V)
***
***
***
I contacted *** by the phone and explained to him my concerns and also explained to him that I was hoping he could give me an answer because I had to return home (hour drive), I didn't want to have to make a trip back with the itemsI waited a reasonable amount of time (hours) and I called back, No AnswerSo I waited again, called but still, No AnswerSo I decided to go to his office and see what he came up withI went into his office and *** told me that he didn't call yet he had other things to do first
No doubt, I'm not the only customer he has, but I just think that "excellent customer service" would be prioritising and at least understanding that I had a long drive and wanted to take care of this before I went back to my home hours away
***
I will not stop trying to return this especially now that it is just sitting on my floor and not one piece of it works for me
If this item can be returned and my money reimbursed, I will stop***
***
Final Business Response /* (4000, 18, 2016/03/03) */
We are in receipt of your further correspondence dated February 5, regarding complaint ***I apologize for the delay in responding; I was out of the country twice in that time period on business and have been largely out of the officeSome specific information regarding the equipment we provided required access to I specifications (see below) that were located in my officeI appreciate your patienceI have reviewed the complainant's correspondence, and I wish to address a few items raised
We have already addressed point raised in ***' rebuttal; our price was sourced from vendors available to us; we offered the price and terms and conditions in writing (***) and *** accepted that quoteWe in no way misled *** in their purchaseEverything was communicated in writing, and at no time did we misrepresent the product, the costs, nor the terms of sale
As for point of the rebuttal, we did indeed ensure the originally quoted price was still on offerWe, like many other businesses, have had our costs increase dramatically due to the rise of the US dollar*** are claiming that by honouring our original quote we have somehow confirmed that our price was inappropriate and that honouring the quote is reflective of poor service; this is inaccurateWe did contact the vendor of that equipment available to us, confirmed that the cost to us had not changed, and agreed to honour the quote from some months prior***
Speaking to point 3, this is indeed a special order item, and *** were informed of this - they were well aware that we were ordering this item for them specificallyAs we have earlier communicated, our terms and conditions on special order items were written on our quote and on our invoice
Regarding point 4, we are aware that *** state were able to purchase similar or same equipment elsewhere at a lower costThe sources available to us price their sales to us such that we must charge what we quoted to *** I would like to be the lowest price in town more often, that isn't realistic, especially for non-stock itemsThis is why we provide clear, written quotations to customers - so that they can make an informed decision and know what they are buying, and for what price
In ***' rebuttal they have labeled two different points as Point 5; speaking to the first point 5, it suggests we have sold unnecessary itemsI disagree (and wonder if this is from where some of the considerable price difference stems)Chlorination systems are, by definition, designed to provide a high certainty of successful disinfectionFor food processing industries and potable water uses, *** (***) *** Proper containers and tanks that are approved for the intended use is the only proper method of storage, transport, and use of disinfection chemicalsTo suggest "no one else in the industry uses this equipment" is inaccurateEvery municipality providing chlorination services for municipal water requires the use of NSF-certified solution tanks*** The tank we provided met the following conditions:
It is completely enclosed; this prevents the introduction of debris or other contaminants (which would render the disinfection process ineffective and the entire process useless, exposing people and products to risk of bacterial exposure);
Rated for use in potable water applications; this means the plastic is of a grade that will not break down over time, releasing unintended chemicals into the water
Will not have its rigidity or its integrity compromised by fluctuations in temperatures;
Made of one-piece, seamless construction to minimize the risk of leaks
Made of a *** resin that is compliant with the *** requirements and certified to *** for potable water applications;
Designed with a proper integrated location for the mounting of pumping equipment
Rated for use with chlorine and liquids with similar specific gravity (density) to ensure structural integrity
*** (***) ***
As for the use of a flow meter, again, any system designed to be responsible for disinfection requires certainty; flow rates determine how much water is being used, and therefore how much chlorine is to be added to the waterWithout a flow meter it is not possible to provide this certainty and to guarantee accuracy of the chlorine doseThe only way to ensure a proper dose of chlorine is to use a flow-proportional systemGuessing or estimating chlorine doses exposes the user to tremendous riskI believe it would be irresponsible for a company selling such equipment to recommend using unapproved, uncertified solution tanks and dosing equipment.***
Speaking to the rest of the complaint and rebuttal, I can only say once again that we have made a good-faith effort to resolve by offering a discountThat offer remains available should *** wish to avail of itWe are not questioning their honesty, but I stand by my statements regarding the conversations held in our offices, what was said, and more importantly, what was not saidIn this area, we will have to simply agree to disagree
To summarize, we have quoted a full system designed to chlorinate water safely and reliably, including the proper tank, meter, and similar, in accordance with industry standards, regulatory guidelines, safety standards, and best practicesWe provided a written price in advance, with our terms and conditions clearly indicated on the quote, and also on the final invoice*** it seems our price varies considerably with respect to other offerings, it similarly seems that *** comparison does not include key pieces of equipment we (and our industry) view as essential for safety and reliabilityEven were that not the case, however, I can only offer a price based on our costsWe did that; we honoured our written price and terms; and when learning of ***' dissatisfaction, offered the best we could in terms of a discount to show our sincerity*** I understand that *** are not happy, and I wish that wasn't soNonetheless, we have done all we can reasonably be expected to do to remedy
Sincerely
***
Final Consumer Response /* (4200, 20, 2016/03/09) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
This is in response to Kean's Pump Shop
I have explained my story, and I feel as though I have been treated unfair
We can continue to go back and forth like this for a very long time, but the fact of the matter is that, ***This company obviously is much more educated in business than *** (***) *** *** ***
***
***
***
*** *** ***
I was, and still am willing to pay for all expense incurred to get this "system", back to the original supplier
This is not a small amount of money, I don't have a lot of money and every cent that I do have in on a budgetI did not touch, use or alter in anyway the packages that were picked up that day in *** and I just wanted to return them and pay the shipping cost
I don't feel as though I'm asking for a lotKean's Pump shop will be taking no loss for this transactionI am willing to pay for the shipping charges incurred by them
They own a pump shop specializing in Chlorination systems, can't they keep this "system" in stock for the next poor soul that needs one of these items?
Please hear what I'm saying, I am pleading with you to take this back and give me back my money
***
Initial Business Response /* (1000, 9, 2014/12/10) */
Re:File # XXXXX
Thank you for sharing Mr. [redacted]'s communication with your organization regarding the installation of heating and air conditioning equipment in his home. While we understand that he is not satisfied with our service to date,...
we respectfully disagree with his contention that we have not honoured our warranties and have breached our guarantees. We take our excellent reputation very seriously and in the rare case we have a dissatisfied customer, we take whatever steps possible to remedy and repair our relationship. However, in this instance, we believe we have gone beyond what is reasonable to satisfy Mr. [redacted]. We have honoured our promises and have attempted to go beyond them. Nonetheless Mr [redacted] feels he is entitled to a refund. We respectfully disagree. When a business enters into an agreement in good faith, and when that business is eager and ready to fully honour its commitments, we do not believe repudiating the contract is fair.
We have attached for your review a copy of Mr. [redacted]'s contract with us. You will see on pages 3 and 4 the various warranties we have offered. To summarize them, our company guarantees that we will properly spec the equipment for the job, and any errors will be corrected by us at our cost; that we will provide repairs if needed to equipment or workmanship that is faulty; that should a compressor fail, the entire condenser shall be replaced (note that no compressor has failed in this instance). We have attended to Mr. [redacted]'s equipment to make adjustments and minor repairs, and to troubleshoot an intermittent defect in the condenser. Being unable to quickly determine the fault (after having consulted with the manufacturer, who was similarly unable to establish the cause), we have instead attempted to replace the system. Mr [redacted] has instead elected to have another system installed and is now seeking his money back. This would place us in a position of considerable loss, through no fault of our own. We have at all times honoured our promises, and are seeking still to do so via replacing the equipment, which Mr. [redacted] is refusing to allow. We respectfully submit that we have honoured our contract and have demonstrated that we remain committed to doing so, and ask simply that we not be expected to suffer financial loss. We have kept our promises. We believe that we have demonstrated good faith in our dealing with Mr. [redacted].
We would like to address each of Mr. [redacted]'s assertations individually:
1) Mr [redacted] mentioned that the unit installed did not work properly from the time it was initially installed. This is not the case. The unit was installed on May 15, 2014; we attended to the site for a 45 minute orientation and instruction as to how to use the unit May 16, 2014; at that time the unit was properly functioning and no troubles were evident. We explained that all heating equipment uses set points and set-point differentials to heat/cool a space; at all times the differential observed was normal, or made normal with minor adjustment. Our first trouble call from the homeowner was August 15 2014; during the intervening time period the unit was function to manufacturer's specifications in all respects.
2) Mr. [redacted] indicated that we had attended to the unit on six occasions to attempt repair. This is not the case, as evidenced by copies of the attached work orders. Each of the six visits is explained below; one visit was to make a minor repair (adding refrigerant); the other is the final visit that triggered our desire to replace the unit completely:
I. Work Order XXXXX July 5 2014: to perform duct cleaning, which is a service unrelated to the mini-split heat pump installed (which itself is ductless and is completely unrelated to the HRV ductwork in the home); as can be seen on the work order, this is a different service for which we were hired; Mr. [redacted] also asked our electrical division to visit at a later date to quote on some electrical work
ii. Work Order XXXXX Aug 15, 2014: This was indeed a trouble call that was properly remedied that day; owing to a longer distance between the indoor and outdoor components than is typical, the unit required additional refrigerant to operate at peak efficiency. This modification was made and the unit operated properly in all respects. The homeowner's comment regarding the installation of a "second-stage compressor" was not a part of a technical recommendation or diagnosis. A different or additional compressor cannot be installed into any such unit. There clearly is a misunderstanding on the part of the homeowner, as there is no such procedure possible under any circumstances. No compressor exists in the indoor unit. We do not know what the homeowner is referring to in this instance. Our signed work order is attached. Our technician recalls that this was the date frost was observed inside the indoor unit, which is symptomatic of low refrigerant, as is the grinding noise. The additional refrigerant was added and the unit performed normally upon testing.
iii. Work Order XXXXX Aug 26 2014: The unit was over cooling (referred to commonly as a "set point differential" issue - usually a minor operating or programing issue); while we had been asked to attend to the house for 830AM that day, which we did, the customer had to leave the home before 1000AM and asked us to leave before we could complete our diagnostic work; we wanted to test the temperature setting on the remote by switching it with another to see if it produced a different result (the recommended procedure for troubleshooting this matter); we switched the remote and the customer then asked us to leave to accommodate their schedule before we would test whether this had been effective.
iv. Work Order XXXXX Aug 27 2014: merely a continuation of the work we were unable to complete the day prior due to the customer's requiring us to leave before we had time to perform the work from the 26th; The remote control units were switched per manufacturers' recommendation and system operation was normal. There was no defect with the equipment. The "room size" matter referred to does not mean the equipment is not suited for the installation; it may require, however, that temperature settings be adjusted to compensate. Again, this is not uncommon, as every installation requires a degree of familiarity, which only comes once the unit is operating and exposed to the full gamut of operating conditions. Our technician insists that at no time did he recommend an additional inverter be installed - the inverter is the outdoor unit, while his work was on the indoor unit. He made no recommendations about installing additional indoor, outdoor, or other units or compressors at any time. No such recommendations appear in the documentation which was signed by the customer.
v. Work Order XXXXX, Sept 25 2014: the customer requested a service call; when we arrived the concern was explained that there was an error code reading on the unit of H1; this is not an error code. On several occasions throughout the day, any heat pump will enter "defrost mode" for a few minutes; it is a normal operating function of every heat pump. The H1 code merely informs the owner that the unit is in defrost mode. The unit was at all times operating normally while we were onsite. In order to troubleshoot an intermittent problem, the problem has to be occurring while we are onsite. Otherwise it is impossible to determine the fault.
vi. Work Order XXXXX, Sept 30 2014: here we have the first (and only) indication of equipment failure (vs adjustment or fine-tuning); our diagnosis was performed, and neither us nor the manufacturer could explain the problem. Rather than begin what could be a process lasting several days of trial and error based on manufacturer's recommendations, we instead advised the customer that it would be better to replace the outdoor component (the only piece of equipment faulting); we advised the customer that we needed our manufacturer's area representative, who is based in Dartmouth, to approve a replacement, and that this process usually takes a number of days. Note that between installation on May 15th to Sept 30, there were no mechanical faults or failures with the installed equipment. Given that one visit was to orient the customer on unit operation, one was to explain that the concern of an error code was not, in fact, an error code at all, one visit to complete an adjustment that the customer's schedule did not allow us to complete the day prior, and one call was for work completely unrelated to the equipment but to perform additional work on the customer's HRV duct work, we can see that to suggest we had six events of failure is inaccurate. There was only one, and we immediately began the process to replace, rather than repair, the unit.
3) Mr. [redacted] indicates that we did not keep our appointment times; on one occasion, when Mr, [redacted] had asked our electrical division to attend to an unrelated matter at his home, we contacted Mr. [redacted] in advance to advise we would be roughly 90 minutes late; he could not accommodate that and we rebooked for two days later. When we arrived, nobody was home and when we reached Mr. [redacted] on his telephone he told us something had come up and he had forgotten to tell us. We have no indication of an appointment scheduled for August 2; we have no record of phone calls not returned; nonetheless, had this occurred, while it would be unfortunate and certainly frustrating, that does not constitute an unwillingness nor an inability to provide service and does not represent a breach of warranty. We have no indication that messages were unreturned; we have reviewed our call logs through our VoIP telephone system and we cannot instances were a call was placed to us from the homeowner without a corresponding outbound call to the homeowner within one business day. We believe we have attempted to contact the homeowner in response to their calls in a timely manner. If more specific instances - dates and times, and perhaps with whom Mr [redacted] or Mrs [redacted] was speaking - we could certainly investigate to ensure this doesn't happen in the future. However, with no specific information, we can only go by our call logs.
4) Mr [redacted] and Mrs [redacted] are correct in that once we began the process of replacing their unit, we briefly neglected our obligation to properly communicate with the customer. We informed them that we needed the manufacturer's approval to replace the outdoor unit under warranty, as this was beyond what both our warranty and the manufacturer's warranty call for. We have, on rare occasions, had to do this, and the approval process takes a few days. We advised the homeowner of this, contacted our manufacturer, and awaited word. We told the homeowner we would be in touch in about a week. As our manufacturer's representative was away, the process took ten (10) days to get approval. We did not contact the homeowner to advise them of the additional days required. We should have. When we received positive news from the manufacturer that the approval was granted and that a new unit had shipped, we contacted the customer. It was then that they told us they instead wanted a refund. We acknowledged that we took a few days longer than anticipated to remedy and that we were sorry for not communicating that an extra three (3) days would be required. We do not believe this constitutes breach of warranty, however.
5) The homeowner alleges breach of guarantee. We attached the guarantees which were a part of the contract signed by Mr. [redacted]. As can be seen, we have indeed honoured and gone beyond what the contract requires of us. We made sure the unit was properly installed and configured, made proper adjustments, and, although the unit did not suffer a compressor failure (the only part of the warranty that requires a replacement of the outdoor unit) we nonetheless attempted to replace the unit. We have met and exceeded our contractual obligations at all times in an attempt to deliver to Mr. [redacted] and Mrs. [redacted] value that goes beyond what we have promised. At no time in his conversations with Mrs. [redacted] did [redacted] agree that we had breached our warranty; at all times, he was empathetic to their concerns and assured them we would, as soon as possible, seek a replacement unit from the manufacturer.
6) We elected to replace, rather than repair, the unit in question because the problem was intermittent and would likely require a "trial and error" approach to repair. We did not want to delay the customer's return to full function and wanted to provide them with piece of mind, and felt we could only assure them and us that the unit was trouble-free by replacing. In other words, as soon as we had a unit failure, we immediately moved to replace the unit. However, this requires consent from the manufacturer, and takes time for the unit to transit between the [redacted] and our location. We moved as fast as possible and are confident we exceeded not only our warranties, but also acted in a manner that exceeds the practices of any other HVAC company in our market.
7) Mr [redacted] states that we left his home without heat for three weeks; the unit failed on Sept 30, and by Oct 10 a new unit was en route. Mr. [redacted] refused to let us remedy the matter, and this is why he had no heat for weeks thereafter. If we are not allowed to remedy, we cannot be held responsible for the weeks that followed. It is worth noting that temperatures outside during this period were warmer than average and the temperature differential indoors vs outdoors is likely to be the cause of excess condensation in the home ([redacted] ); the homeowner had poured concrete in the home during this period, and it is reasonable to expect that curing concrete will emit a great deal of humidity, which we feel is the likely contributor to the condensation in question.
8) Throughout the homeowner's complaint, they list dates where they had concerns with their equipment; it can been seen that for each contact from the customer indicating a concern, we have a work order within a day or two. The vast majority of visits were unrelated to equipment faults. We cannot agree that we were unresponsive as the homeowner alleges - when they called us, we were there. It cannot reasonably be said that we repeatedly did not return calls; had that been the case we would not have been in the home to attend to their concerns. We again acknowledge that it did take us longer than anticipated to get manufacturer approval to replace the unit (which was required as it was in excess of the provisions of any warranty provided); we acknowledge that we did not inform them of the delay nor the reasons for it. We did, however, within ten (10) days, have the approval and a unit en route; this is not a breach of our guarantee. It is one regrettable delay, and that delay was in in communication only, as we attempted to exceed the provisions of the warranties that formed a part of our contract.
[redacted] given the position the homeowner has taken - effectively, to repudiate our contract despite our continued compliance with our obligations and our attempt to exceed them - places us in an unreasonable position of loss in spite of our good faith efforts. Our position is that we have honoured our obligations and have no reason to repudiate the contract based on the information we have. Should the homeowner have an alternate proposal, please ask them to forward it to us for review so we might move closer to a resolution. We sincerely appreciate you efforts to assist.
Sincerely,
[redacted]
Vice President, Operations
[redacted]
(XXX) XXX-XXXX
[redacted]DOCUMENTS ATTACHED[redacted]
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 11, 2014/12/14) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Rebuttal to Mr. [redacted]
1. To date, Mr. [redacted] has not addressed a written complaint my wife sent to [redacted] on Aug 9, 2014.
2. First, [redacted] manager, [redacted] comment that it was not up to [redacted] to replace the system and they do not give away units freely, when it failed completely on Sept 30, 2014, is a clear indication that [redacted] was not ready to fully honour its guarantees.
Second, manager [redacted] was aware that we had no heat in the main floor of our house for 2 weeks and it was freezing. Yet, [redacted] provided us no update on how [redacted] intended to fix the system. This level of customer service was totally unacceptable. My wife contacted [redacted] on Oct 2 again and he promised to give us an answer by Oct 6, at the latest. We did not receive any update from [redacted] and my wife had to contact [redacted] again on Oct 10. It was only then that [redacted] inform us that they would replace the outdoor unit and it would take another week for the replacement unit to arrive. Mr. [redacted] had acknowledged in his written reply that [redacted] had not communicated to us. [redacted]
Third, we had also informed the technicians about appointments made that were not kept, no one returned our calls for weeks, and appointments made were cancelled at the last minute. The technicians clearly informed us that they relayed our complaints to their manager. Yet no one at [redacted] acknowledged or responded to our complaints.[redacted]
Forth, I requested Mr. [redacted] to remove the defective system from our house and he refused to do so. Refusing a refund is one thing but refusing to remove the defective system from our house is a much more serious matter.[redacted]
Fifth, [redacted] had not definitely and correctly identified the source of our growing problems. They had blamed the problem on our room size, the remote and our digital thermostats. They had never pointed to the outdoor unit as the source of our problems as evident in records of the [redacted] work orders. They were only replacing the outdoor unit because it had stopped working and only upon our continuous insistence to replace the system. Thus, we do not believe that replacing the outdoor unit alone would resolve all of our issues. In contrast, our new system from their competitor works perfectly from Day 1.[redacted]
3. Mr. [redacted] had admitted that [redacted] was "unable to quickly determine the fault (after having consulted with the manufacturer, who was similarly unable to establish the cause)". This means the system is defective and should warrant a refund.[redacted]
4. [redacted] had not definitely diagnose the problems. They blamed the problems on our room size, remote control and digital thermostats. At no point in time did they identify the outdoor unit as the source of all the problems as evident in records of their work orders. They were simply replacing the outdoor unit because it stopped functioning in 4 months. [redacted]
[redacted]
5.To reiterate, we experienced problem with the system from Day 1. The orientation and instruction was on the day of the installation, which was May 15, 2014. It makes no sense for [redacted] to return the next day to provide orientation and instruction[redacted] We simply would not have agreed to it. I like to request Mr. [redacted] to show concrete evidence that this is [redacted]'s normal practice to return the next day to provide orientation and instruction in all of their installations.
The truth is we called [redacted] representative, [redacted], to inform him that the temperature of the mini-split system did not match the remote control set temperate or the room digital thermostat temperature. [redacted], in turn, called the installation technician, [redacted] showed up to fix the system and informed us that we can expect some discrepancies (about 1.5 degree Celsius downstairs and 2 degree Celsius upstairs). However, the discrepancies persisted and increased over time.
We were on vacation out of the country from June 2-14, 2014 and from June 20-26, 2014. When we returned from vacation and used the system in July, we noticed the temperature setting issue persisted and increased over time. Other additional issues also begin to surface over time. My wife called [redacted] but continuously experienced appointment booking problems with [redacted], which led to my wife to send a written complaint to [redacted] on Aug 7, 2014. A copy of the written complaint had been made available to Mr. [redacted].
6. Please find below the six service calls I referred to, all related to equipment faults.
May 16, 2014 Troubleshoot system set temperature issue.
Aug 15, 2014 Troubleshoot grinding noise, ice build-up in the indoor unit upstairs and set temperature issue. Moved indoor temperature sensors.
Aug 26, 2014 Troubleshoot set temperature issue. Upstairs is too cold. [redacted] suspected remote control problem.
Aug 27, 2014 Troubleshoot set temperature issue. There was a 4 degree Celsius difference between the set temperature (e.g. 24 degree Celsius) and the system's temperature (e.g. 20 degree Celsius). Technician believed bedroom size was an issue.
Sep 25, 2014 Troubleshoot H1 error code and heating that had stopped working. They told us it is normal defrost cycle but the system would not work for many hours (over 5 hours).[redacted]
Sep 30, 2014 Troubleshoot E1 high pressure error code; loud, high frequency noise, intermittent functioning of the system and set temperature issues.
7. At no time did my wife ask technician [redacted] to leave.
8. This system enters defrost mode for hours (over 5 hours)[redacted]
9. It is very important to note that [redacted] did not advise us that it would replace the outdoor component on Sep 30, 2014 as Mr. [redacted] had claimed. This was certainly not documented in the [redacted] work order that they would replace the unit.
The truth is on Sep 29, 2014, my wife informed manager [redacted] that our system was broke. On Sep 30, 2014, technician [redacted] informed my wife that he could not get the system to operate. On Oct 2, 2014, my wife called [redacted] since we did not hear from them. On Oct 10, 2014, my wife called [redacted] and he informed that a new unit will be ordered.
10. Mr. [redacted] has acknowledged fault in their lack of communication with us.
11. [redacted] Satisfaction Guarantee states that "With our SATISFACTION Guarantee, if you are not completely satisfied with your new system anytime during the first 12 months, we will make any changes necessary or REPLACE it with a system of equal value, at no cost to you." Mr. [redacted]'s written statement is contrary to what the [redacted] Satisfaction Guarantee stated.
12. Mr. [redacted] had conveniently ignored to inform that [redacted] had been taking a trial and error approach to repairing our system for 4 months without success.
13. The replacement unit arrived in town on Oct 15, 2014. The earliest appointment if we accept the replacement unit was Oct 16, 2014. The unit had failed prior to Sep 30, 2014, the date of the service call. The elapsed time between the failure date (Sep 27, 2014) and Oct 16, 2014 is 20 days.
14. As for unresponsiveness, we are referring to [redacted] lack of timely acknowledgement, response and communication regarding our complaints.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 23, 2015/02/20) */
Thank you [redacted] for emailing Mr. [redacted] concerns regarding his last complaint. As we have
indicated before we feel we have honoured our promises stated in our contract and have attempted
to exceed them.I have included Mr [redacted] concerns and responded to each one that is labeled response.
1. To clarify, I stated that [redacted] has not addressed a written complaint by my wife sent on August 9, 2014. I believe the business protocol is to acknowledge receiving the complaint within a few days and a formal response within one or two weeks. This did not occur. Mr. [redacted] now asked for specific dates on January 9, 2015, 5 months after the complaint. I specifically indicated that I called [redacted] cell phone on or around May 16, 2014 to indicate that the system was not heating or cooling our home to the set temperature. [redacted] has never confirmed that. Instead, Mr. [redacted] said they attended to the site for a 45 minute orientation. This is untrue. I requested Mr. [redacted] to show evidence that this is [redacted] normal practice to return the next day to provide orientation and instruction. I have not received the requested information. We are in the process of complying a list of dates that we called [redacted]
Response: Once [redacted] received the written complaint from Mr. [redacted] wife on August 7th he immediately contacted our dispatcher and had these complaints reviewed. We have no indication from our records of any of these problems existed as stated before. I also addressed these issues several times during phone call conversations with Mr. [redacted].
I see nothing wrong with asking for specific dates on January 9, 2015 for we have to investigate these complaints by Mr. [redacted]. When [redacted] received the call we had a technician go to Mr. [redacted] and there was nothing wrong with the unit, we instructed the customer how to change settings (orientation).
2. The work orders stated that "If you nd the work satisfactory, by signing this receipt, you accept the work as completed and agree to the terms and conditions as stated on both sides of this form and you agree to pay for the same upon presentation of invoice."
First, what is "nd"?
Second, we signed the form to indicate that the work was completed by the technician and not to indicate that "the equipment was operating normally" as Mr. [redacted] had claimed.
Response: "nd" was a typing error.
Once the work order is signed this indicates the customer agrees to what is stated on the work order.
3. Mr. [redacted] stated that we asked their technician, [redacted], to leave on August 26 before they could complete their diagnostic work. I reaffirm that we did not ask technician, [redacted], to leave. Yes, my wife had an appointment at 10 am that day and we informed [redacted] of this at the time we made the appointment. [redacted] could continue to work even after my wife left for her appointment because [redacted] technicians are bonded. However, [redacted] is a furnace technician. He did not know how to diagnose the temperature setting issue and had to call another technician [redacted] was told to try switching the remotes. This was done and my wife was asked to wait and see what happened and call them. At no point did my wife asked [redacted] to leave.
Response: As stated on the signed work order (XXXXX) the customer had to leave at 10:00 and we would have to return for a second visit. As a normal business practice we would much rather finish the job in the first trip instead of making a second visit for obvious reasons. We were not told to stay and complete the work. If the customer did not want us to leave why would they sign a work order stating we will need to return to complete the work?. The reason [redacted] called another technician was for a second opinion.
4. Mr. [redacted] stated "....we have made good faith and sincere efforts to exceed our warranty by replacing the equipment rather than attempting repairs of either intermittent defects and/or a defect that neither the manufacturer nor our company has seen before." In his statement, Mr. [redacted] admitted that the system was defective. We had already stated many times that the system was not functioning properly from Day 1. Thus, we qualify for a refund according to the Consumer Handbook.
Response: As stated in section 1 from our last report Mr [redacted] said the unit was not functioning properly from Day 1. This is not the case. Please refer to our reply in section 1.
In contrast, we have now owned a [redacted] heat pump system as replacement of the [redacted] system for almost 3 months now. We have not called the technicians to come in even once to service the system. The system is running day and night perfectly. This comparison clearly distinguishes a system that is defective and a system that functions as design.
Response: Its great to hear Mr. [redacted] new heat pump system is working fine. If we had the opportunity to fix Mr. [redacted] heat pump that would be working fine as well.
5. Mr. [redacted] stated "Our only mistake was in not updating the customer when we learned our manufacturer's representative would be away, thereby adding a few days to the process."
[redacted] has made many mistakes (e.g. no one returned our calls for weeks, appointment made were not kept, appointments made were cancelled at the last minute, taking a trial and error approach to repair our system for 4 months, not responding to complaints, breaching warranties etc.) The most serious and unacceptable mistake was leaving us without heat in the main floor of the house for almost 3 weeks.
Response: Please refer to section 3 & 4 from our last report. Mr. [redacted] is clearly repeating his concerns.
6. Mr. [redacted] stated "The customer was fine with this insofar as we were aware, and only once we advised that a new unit was shipped were we told this was no longer satisfactory."
This is untrue. On October 10, 2014, my wife called manager [redacted] because we did not hear from him. At that time, we had no heat in the main floor of our house for two weeks already because the heat pump failed completely and [redacted] technicians could not repair it. [redacted] had promised to inform us what [redacted] would do with our system on October 6, 2014 but he did not.
[redacted] called later on October 10, 2014 to inform that they would replace the outdoor unit (not the entire system). At that point, we indicated to [redacted] that we would not want to have the outdoor unit installed and requested a refund. This is because replacing the outdoor unit alone does not guarantee that all of our issues would be resolved. Mr. [redacted] called on the same day to ask us to give [redacted] another chance. I indicated to Mr. [redacted] that we had completely lost our confidence in [redacted] and the performance of the [redacted] system. I requested a refund. Mr. [redacted] refused. I requested Mr. [redacted] to remove the defective system from our house. Mr. [redacted] refused also.
The replacement outdoor unit arrived in town on October 15, 2014 based on an email from Mr. [redacted] to me on October 15, 2014 at 3:35 pm. The earliest appointment if we accept the replacement unit was October 16, 2014. Our system had failed on September 27, 2014, prior to the date of the service call (September 30, 2014). The elapsed time between the failure date (September 27, 2014) and October 16, 2014 is 20 days without heat. This is unacceptable to us.
Once again please refer to the previous report to section 4. Also I had promised Mr. [redacted] as soon as the outdoor unit came in I could install it which could have been October 15, 2014.
7. Yes, I have been very professional in my communication with Mr. [redacted]. However, denying a refund is one thing. Refusing to remove the defective system from our house upon request is a much more serious matter.[redacted]
Response: I feel we have been very fair and have honoured our obligations and have no reason to
repudiate the contract based on the information we have. I have also been very professional[redacted]We have shown responsiveness and willingness to not only meet, but also exceed our
obligations. Thank you once again for sharing Mr. [redacted] report however his responses are
unsatisfactory and incorrect.[redacted]
Final Consumer Response /* (4200, 25, 2015/03/01) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Thank you [redacted] for your email. Mr. [redacted]'s response is unsatisfactory. Please find below our rebuttal.
1. If the complaints had been reviewed by [redacted] on Aug 7, 2014 as claimed, why was there no correspondence of acknowledgement, no correspondence of findings, and no correspondence to request clarification of events if they have questions? Why Mr. [redacted] and his manager, [redacted], did not mention to us about their review when we raised the problems we encountered with them on several occasions? This does not make sense.
If there were no evidence of problems related to our complaint, why did Mr. [redacted] apologize to me and said that we should not have any of the customer service issues again?
2. If the system were not defective, why was it necessary to have technicians come in 6 times in 4 months, why was there a growing list of issues, why did the system failed completely in 4 months when these systems are designed to operate for at least 16 years? There must be a logical reason - defective system, the system is not designed for the operating environment, the system capacity was incorrectly specified, improper installation, incorrect maintenance etc.?
We have the replacement [redacted] heat pump system for 4 months now, the system is operating continuously without any problem, the technicians have not returned a single time to fix anything. How does Mr. [redacted] explain this?
3. Mr. [redacted] is avoiding the key issue that the system is defective, unreliable and [redacted] and [redacted] had not been able to fix it. Mr. [redacted] has refused to admit that the system is defective. He has refused two reasonable offers by me and by [redacted] for partial refund.