Old North Dayton Auto Sales Inc.

Initial Business Response /* (1000, 5, 2015/07/20) */
Contact Name and Title: [redacted]
Contact Phone: XXX-XXX-XXXX
Contact Email: [redacted]@yahoo.com
June 30th 2015 Mrs [redacted] had her vehicle towed by us b/c it would not start, when our driver [redacted] picked her up she wanted to know if we did...

repairs even though she had made arrangements to go else where. Since we do towing and auto repair she wanted to bring the blazer here, even after the driver called in and was told we were booked up for a few days and couldn't promise her to get it in. But we did work over and get it checked out for her as we try to help everyone who is broke down, and needing assistance. She said she had recently gotten gas and ever since then it wasn't running well, she also said she had changed the fuel filter and it was full of debris, she was thinking she needed a fuel pump replaced, we did a fuel pressure test and fuel pump was coming on and had fuel pressure so we started do other diagnostic tests. At that time we found that the coil wire was bad and showed it to Mrs. [redacted], and also informed her that her battery was testing bad and that she should take it back to [redacted] b/c it was still under warranty. She had it replaced, and [redacted]) told her she still had an electrical pull. She then brought it back to us to find the issue, we did several extensive test trying to find where to issue was coming. Upon the testing procedures we found several signs of previous tests and wire probing due to what we think was the same issue, as she recently had a battery and a alternator replaced in the blazer. We did find an after market security system that had a significant electrical draw. Mrs [redacted] claimed she didn't have that installed and it was causing some of the draw and was not functional due to some wires being previously removed or cut, I did let her know we removed it completely from the blazer to prevent any further problems pertaining to it being there and not working or properly hooked up, unfortunately the same afternoon she came to pickup her vehicle that morning was trash day and one of the shop guys put it in the dumpster as it was defective and it was already discussed with Mrs [redacted]. After removing after market security system that their was still another large electrical pull that was found to be the BCM(Body Control Module) I then call Mrs [redacted] to let her know and gave her a price quote, at that time she agreed to have us order it and was aware of the charges at that time. We had to order the part and a few days later when it arrived we installed it, upon installing it we noticed the "other" issues that I made an estimate so that Mrs [redacted] was aware of this issues that her blazer had but was not in conjunction with the issues we repaired. We did this as a free courtesy as she was new to the area and didn't want her to have unexpected problems arise. I explained to her given the vehicle was 2000 and has over 160K miles on it that the things that are needing done for the most part are general maintenance. With the "Air Bag" light I explained to her that with the BCM being changed and it dealing with computer it was probably something she would have to take to the dealership b/c our computer system would not allow us to reset it. We did try to check out the defrost issue for her but when the mechanic came in to check something on the computer she just got into her vehicle ad left??? I feel that given the time spent on the vehicle we were VERY generous with the bill, unfortunately with electrical issue it is a lot of testing and process of elimination. We have well over 22 hours working on the vehicle and tried to be fair and only charge her for 8 of those hours,due to keeping good customer relations. We lost money on this repair and was hoping that in doing so we would get a long term customer and help her out along the way as even though she was informed throughout the whole process wiring can be very time consuming and costly.
As far as running the car at high RPMs it was sitting inside our shop without a computer in it to start, when it did start we checked the electrical and basic complete car checkout there was no need for us to "rev up" the blazers engine to test any of the systems.
The "steering wheel movement knob" she referred to was the tilt lever, no one here ever took it off and can not remember it being there but replaced it for free again for good customer service.
The missing she referred to is the reason we ran the diagnostics we did to inform her of the possible issues and repairs that will be required in the future. The coil wire that was replaced earlier was a indication of possibly needing much more of a tune up and wires replaced, but we didn't do it as she was wanting to do it at a later time to save on spending money.
The leak on the blazer had indications of being there for a while, once we started the vehicle and it got to operating temperature the leak became more noticeable.
We feel that we have gone above and beyond in trying to help her not only fix her issues that her blazer had but in keeping the cost down, it took us by surprise that she made a complaint to the Revdex.com as we have been very fair and honest with her in the repairs we did. We have been in business since 1985 and have tried to do our best to provide great service to all our customers, and have the reputation of one of the most trusted auto repairs in the area. Not to mention to being voted auto mechanics of the year a few times from the citizens of our area.
Please let us know if we can answer anything else.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 7, 2015/07/23) */
(The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
There are some mis statements here.1. I only chose to take my car to Ron's after [redacted] told me this shop was about ** an hour cheaper.I felt coerced after the fact. Especially after hearing nightmare stories from previous customers. 2. I did never state my security system was no functional. My request to the repair shop was that they "test the system for draw". Had they told me they did not have the equipment to test and reset, I would have gone on my way. The next time I called for a status update I was told my security system had been removed bc" we THOUGHT" that was the problem. No one called prior to removing anything from my car and the shop is unable to produce the security system. There was nothing wrong with the security system. I did not approve its removal, and there fore would ask for its replacement and refund to re install another.
Final Consumer Response /* (3000, 9, 2015/07/23) */
With regard to my leaving during the defrost issue. I related to [redacted] that my a/c and defrost must have had hoses crossed or wires or both as neither was working properly. It was very hot that day. [redacted] response rather than check under the dash was to change fuses. At that point, without saying ONE word he turned and went into the office and sat down at the computer. What would you think? I left.
When you talk about good customer service, my thought is inform, inform. Not speaking to the customer is rather confusing. Not following proper business and legal procedure for repairs is confusing. I appreciate that [redacted] "thought" they tried hard. I just do not believe for a second if this was their vehicle that any of them would accept more problems created and missing parts as ok.When I allowed them to bring my car to their shop, the request was that they test the system. Not that they remove things and ultimately cause other problems as a result of repairs
Final Business Response /* (4000, 11, 2015/07/31) */
I have read the statements in the response and I can only follow up with the answers we know to be true. Ms. [redacted] was informed the security system was not hooked up properly, due to wires being previously cut and or removed from key components such as the starter wire, door locks and neutral safety switch, but the wires going to the power module, siren, horn, lights, and dash light all had power and was causing a significant draw to the system. When we told her about the issue she was surprised and unaware of the blazer even being equipped with the aftermarket accessory nor was there even a key fob on her key chain to indicate it was ever in use. With that being said we feel no reason for a refund or replacement to be offered on an item that was non functioning and she wasn't unaware she had.
The shop rates in this town do vary and it does not reflect on the quality of the repair facility, mostly depends on the rate at which the shop wants to make it's money and the overhead associated to their business. As I stated before we have been voted by the people of the town multiple times as not only the mechanic shop of the year but also the towing company of the year. We even received this past week two different thank you letters concerning our repair work and courtesy, so this letter and complaint does cause us some concern, but also realize at times no matter how hard we do try some customers will never be happy, and I feel this may be the case here.
Our diagnostic equipment is the top of the line Snap On Verus, along with an array of other diagnostic tools so we have all necessary tools to do the proper diagnostic on the majority of automobiles on the road today.
As far as the defrost goes we never removed or switched any heater hoses as that wouldn't even be in the area we were working in. If their was wires unplugged to test later model vehicles have specific connectors that wouldn't let you cross wires even if we would have by mistake, which we did not. I would guess without looking at this issue it's a mixer door motor, which has nothing to do with what we did, but is a common problem for GM products especially one with the age on it this blazer has.
We feel at this point nothing we can do will satisfy the customer, and we deeply regret that but we provided the service we were requested to do and at a discounted price. We feel she was informed of all repairs along the way. The only issue she has that we have addressed and will work to improve on is our shop employee [redacted] didn't communicate properly when he went inside to pull up the cooling system diagram from Alldata to assist him in locating proper wires to test. We will work better from now to ensure customer and informed of what the mechanic is doing. We also will have them keep all removed parts from the vehicles until after customers have picked up vehicle even if the customer was notified and given the ok, as was in this case.
In closing all I can do is offer our sincerest apology that Ms. [redacted] was not satisfied with our work, and I hope she understands that we try our very best to make all customers happy with our work. We wish her the best and hope she understands.

Initial Business Response /* (1000, 9, 2016/05/10) */
Weeks prior to the repairs done at our shop [redacted] towed Mr. [redacted] car from [redacted] & [redacted] to the [redacted] Mr [redacted] then called and asked [redacted] if he could tow it from there to our Shop because they had not been able to fix his...

problem. Once at our shop we tested several things and the three items that kept showing codes related to them were the parts we changed. Cam Sensor(34.29) **ank Position Sensor(52.44) and the Throttle Position Sensor(64.84) the only other part replaced was the belt because it was in very worn and in poor condition. [redacted] then drove the car over 70miles in a two day time period to make sure no other issues occurred or any additional codes came up on computer. The car drove fine and started every time with no issues. When I called Mr[redacted] to let him know the car was done he stated that he had mention to [redacted] about leaving it on our lot for us to try and sell for him as this was just a 2nd car that wasn't driven much, told him we would be happy to try and help him sell it. When he came and paid for the bill he did seem a little surprised at the total but didn't say much. Left the car for us to try and sell then came back a few days and picked it up, car started and drove fine for him that day. A week or so later he did call and let us know the car died on him but made it into the driveway, at that time we told him we would try to send someone out but it might be a few days because [redacted] was out of town and we were short handed. Once [redacted] was back in tow and able to pick it up we called and was told it was already picked up and taken else where. We feel we were very fair with what we did as far as repairs and testing to makes sure what we fixed was issues that needed to be repaired, since this car is a '91 model and isn't driven often having multiple issues is not uncommon. Just for reference IF it had been the Fuel Pump the cost for that repair would have been:
Fuel Pump Assembly (364.19)Fuel Filter(16.61) Labor(225.00) Of course belt still would have needed changed (36.95) for a total of $605.25 for parts and labor.
Initial Consumer Rebuttal /* (3000, 15, 2016/05/26) */
Thank you for sending [redacted] Towing Companys' response to our original complaint. Since he offered no settlement, we are not satisfied with his response. We must also disagree with some of [redacted] statements in his response:
(1.) [redacted] stated: "Weeks prior to the repairs done in at our shop, [redacted] towed Mr. [redacted] car from [redacted] and M[redacted] to the [redacted]." A few days before the repairs at [redacted] our car had stalled at the corner of [redacted]. We called [redacted] to tow it, but just as he got there, we succeeded in getting it started. [redacted] did not tow it anywhere at that time, but followed us home (in case it stalled again) and charged us $30 to bring his truck out. It was during a conversation then that he stated our problem might be the fuel pump. We left the car in our driveway. A few days later, [redacted] tried to start our car in our driveway to run some errands, but it wouldn't start, It was then we called [redacted] and asked him to tow it to [redacted] for repair. After a few days **owder called to say he wasn't sure what was wrong but they got it started so we could come get it. [redacted] had a friend go along and drove the car home. Back in our driveway a few days (2-3) later the car wouldn't start again. Since [redacted] has suggested it might be the fuel pump, we called [redacted] again and let him Tow it to his shop. We expected a call informing us it was (or wasn't) the fuel pump, and apprising us of the situation, an estimate of the cost of repairing it, etc. (We feel that a reputable mechanic should notify a customer about these things). After a few days, [redacted] called to tell [redacted] that the car was fixed and he could come pick it up.
Yes, [redacted] was shocked to be handed a bill for $511. [redacted] had run several expensive tests and replaced four expensive parts. Yes, [redacted] paid the full amount because he thought at least the problem was fixed. After he drove the car home (2-3 days later) he took the car to the post office. (4-5 blocks) and got it almost home when it stalled at the bottom of our driveway. He tried repeatedly to get it started because it was blocking the driveway.
This is when we called [redacted] and asked him to come fix the car right and get it out out of drive way. We were not told they would they would come "in a few days" and no mention was made that [redacted] was "out of town" Instead we were asked if it was The same problem (of course it was)! and that someone would come look at the car "as soon as someone was available." If they said "in a few days", we would have called someone else immediately because our driveway was blocked. We waited the rest of that day but no one came. We called again the next morning and received the same answer. We grew tired of waiting, and on the 3rd day, we called another garage and had the car towed there.
At [redacted] garage, the problem was found and repaired with one part. [redacted] drove the car from there and it has given us no trouble since.
The car is an older model but we have kept it up well. Isn't it very unlikely that we would need to replace four parts and a belt all at once?
We found it interesting that [redacted] told you that the cost of replacing the fuel pump (if he had done so) would have been $605.25. We called the automotive store and asked them the cost of the fuel pump for our model car. We were quoted a price of $89.00. [redacted], by his own admission, would have charged us an additional $516.25 just to replace it.
We have talked to several people about our situation since, and we were told that [redacted] was known to charge the highest prices for repairs in the area.
We wish we had known sooner. We are not going to pursue what we feel was injustice any farther because we are elderly ([redacted] is 91 and a WWII veteran and I am 81 ) and on a fixed income and we do not have the time or energy for he stress involved.
We know there are greater injustices in this world, but we had hoped this small one against us in our small corner could be righted.
Final Business Response /* (4000, 17, 2016/06/02) */
We are sorry that it seems we are not able to come to a resolutions for the [redacted]'s. We would also like to clarify a few things...We ONLY change/replace parts that have been tested and found bad or none working. We tested all the parts changed multiple times and they tested bad or non working. I can see how someone would feel that they likely hood of all those parts needing to be replaced all at the same time is odd but with sensors and electrical parts like that it is very common. The part that Talley Tire change is a part like the ones we changed but at the time we had it there was no indication that part was not working properly. As stated before [redacted] test drove the car several miles and started it several times with no issues once parts were changed. I did not take the call when it stalled on him after pick up but don't believe that we were informed it was actually blocking the drive way? We knew it was a second car and like mention before we were busy and short handed for a few days and planned to get to it as soon as we could not realizing it needed to be a top priority. We have been in business since 1985 and realize we are not able to make all customers happy and yes we see that we could have communicated better and plan to be sure that is something that is corrected but feel we did everything we could repair wise while car was here. The last item I wanted to clarify was regarding the Fuel Pump pricing, I wanted to recheck that since they were told $89.00 and have the "quotes" from [redacted](see attachment). When changing a Fuel Pump for warranty reasons you must change the filter and strainer I previously priced a Fuel Pump Assembly but realized it was for the wrong car. As you can see from the attached pricing going with the cheapest the total before tax would have been 426.51. Again we are sorry this was not able to be resolved with the customer and wish them the best and thank him for his service with us and in the Military.