P B S, Inc Reviews (1)
Review: WINDOW MAN installed Marvin Infinity Replacement Windows for me on November 12, 2012. These Marvin Infinity windows are draftier in winter than the 39 yo windows with storm windows that were replaced. WINDOW MAN sales staff did not inform me that Replacement windows do not give the same warmth in winter that old windows with storm windows give you. It cost me $20,000, much time, and personal anguish to learn this. I phoned Window Man about the draftiness several days after installation as the weather got cold and windy quickly. After multiple contacts with Window Man and Marvin since installation, I was informed by letter from Window Man on July 23, 2013 that nothing can be done.
WINDOW MAN denied any errors in installation and MARVIN had the windows independently tested in June for air infiltration and the windows met the industry standard. Both companies assured me of a customer satisfaction outcome during this entire process but that has not happened.
It is so discouraging to have paid $20,000 to shiver when sitting in front of a drafty window in my home in the winter. WINDOW MAN’S only solution to this problem is that I have them install Storm Windows over the Marvin Infinity replacement windows at a cost of $385 per window.
I feel the sales pitch and advertising were deceptive in that no one informed me that replacement windows do not give the same warmth in winter that old windows with storm windows give you.Desired Settlement: I want non-drafty windows in the winter cold. It is so discouraging to me to think of having to achieve this by adding storm windows which would defeat the purpose of the new tilt and wash replacements. I want the sales people to clearly explain to consumers the significant advantages that storms windows have provided for both warmth and as a sound shield.
This letter is written in response to complaint #[redacted]
filed by **. [redacted] on August 21, 2013. There are several claims we
would like to refute. In her complaint **. [redacted] claims her new fiberglass
windows are “draftier” in the winter than her old wood windows with storms.
[redacted]’s windows have been checked by our head Service Tech, me, and the
Marvin Infinity factory rep. on several occasions. We made a site visit on a
cold, less than 30 degree day, to check the temperature differentials of the
windows vs. her walls. **. [redacted] even purchased her own temperature gun
([redacted] price around $45) to check the differentials herself. Our numbers and
hers show very little difference in the temperature of the interior surface of
her exterior wall and the interior surface of her Infinity-Marvin Windows. Her
comment in response to these numbers: “just because there is little temperature
difference that doesn’t mean “air” is not coming in.” With that we (The Window
Man and Infinity-Marvin) hired Architectural Testing Company to do a field air
infiltration test on her Infinity-Marvin windows. Architectural Testing Co. is
one of the most highly respected 3rd party testing firms in the
Nation. The test cost us $2,700. All four windows that were field tested were
over 5 ½ times better than the industry standard for air infiltration.
They tested at .08 or .06 CFM vs. the .45 CFM industry standard. A copy of the
written report is available to all parties.
claims that our salesperson did not inform her about the benefits of installing
storm windows on old wood windows. The first time I met with **. [redacted] I
asked her if [redacted], her sales rep., had discussed upgrading her storm windows vs.
replacing the primary windows. She replied that she had researched windows for
two years and knew what she wanted and would not listen to other options. She
knew she didn’t want vinyl windows, wood windows, triple pane glass or new
storm windows. We have offered **. [redacted] $1,000 worth of new high performance
storm windows “FREE” and a discounted cost for any additional storm windows
over this amount she would like. **. [redacted] has declined this offer a number
claims that our advertising was misleading. Almost all of our advertisements
include a “pitch” for NOT replacing your old wood windows. We promote adding
Mon-Ray high performance storm windows to old wood windows. [redacted], her
salesperson, has sold thousand of storm windows in the 10 years he has been
with us. Mon-Ray storm windows are our number 2 selling window product. Also,
as stated earlier during the consultation **. [redacted] was not interested in
hearing about any products other than Infinity-Marvin. We have attached a copy
of one of our advertisements with clearly promotes Mon-Ray Storm windows.
**. [redacted]’s windows feel “drafty” in the winter is because she has diverters
on the heat ducts under her windows. General construction practices call for
heat ducts or radiators under windows to wash the cooler air off them. It is well
known that 7/8” thick insulated glass windows, even with Low-E/Argon gas, are
NOT going to feel as warm as 5 ½” think insulated exterior walls. Even 2” thick
triple pane “Passive House” windows are only rated up to an “R” 8. Most
exterior walls are an “R” 13 or better.
In spite of
her misleading/inaccurate statements in her complaint we will extend our offer
of “FREE” storm windows to cover ALL her new first floor front windows, these
are the primary complaint windows.
[To assist us in bringing this matter to a close, you must give us a reason why you are rejecting the response. If no reason is received your complaint will be closed Administratively Resolved]
I am rejecting this response because:
I disagree with much of the information he has stated.
Window Man is correct in reporting that in my complaint I stated “my
new fiberglass windows are draftier in the winter than my old windows with
I will now respond to his comments I disagreed with paragraph by paragraph. He has written 5 paragraphs.
PARAGRAPH 1 – Window Man did
check the differentials of the windows vs the walls. It was a cold day but not a windy day. I was told by a technician at the Marvin
National Services Level that “draft” is different than “window
temperature”. So measuring the window
and wall temperatures does not provide information regarding “draft.” However, before I knew that this widow and
wall temperature differential was not relevant, I did purchase a temperature
gun. However, I purchased it at Home Depot
for $29.97 not at [redacted] for $45 as
Window Man reported.
Window Man did insert additional weather stripping on all windows on
2/24/13 but this did not stop the draftiness. Window Man reports, as I stated in my
complaint ,that Architectural Testing Co did an air infiltration test on
6/24/13 of 4 windows I selected. The outcome showed the 4 windows tested were
over 5 ½ times better than the industry standard for ‘window only’ air
filtration. This test did not prove
that the replacement windows were as
draft free as MY OLD WINDOWS WITH STORMS
PARAGRAPH 2 – I was not seeking to replace my old windows because of draftiness. I was never
seeking to replace my storm windows.
I was quite satisfied with my existing storm windows and the warmth and
lack of draftiness that they provided for 39 years. I was seeking to replace my 39 yo wood windows
because after years of painting the exterior trim did not look good.
I was not told by the sales person that replacement windows would not
be as warm and draft free as my 39 yo storms and wood windows combined. This is my complaint. It was only after the replacement windows
were installed, and after I experienced the draftiness, that I was told that
storm windows provide an additional several inches of protection from air
penetration and, hence, this was the
reason for the warmth and lack of draftiness I had experienced for 39 years.
PARAGRAPH 3 – I was not
experiencing draftiness or air penetration from my 39 yo storm windows. I had no need to replace my storms. I was seeking to replace my windows for the purpose of lower maintenance cost ie no painting.
PARAGRAPH 4 – This is the
first time Window Man has attributed the draftiness I feel in the
4 Living Room windows to the
cheap, plastic, magnetic, easily removable ”diverters” on the heat ducts under
the windows. If this was, in fact, the
cause of the draftiness on the 4 LR windows, he could have easily removed the
diverters to remedy the problem on those 4 windows. However, there are no other floor heat duct
diverters under the other 16 drafty windows in the house, therefore the
diverters do not appear to be the cause of the draftiness.
PARAGRAPH 5 – My primary
complaint includes more than the 6 first floor windows. It includes the 4 second floor front windows
and at least 7 other windows. On 3/5/13
Window Man offered me 2 options----Window Man will refund me $1,000 for my
inconvenience or swap for $1,000 worth of Mon Ray storm windows. He is now offering to provide storms for the
6 first floor windows.
It is so discouraging to me to think of having to add storm windows to
my $20,000 replacement windows which would defeat the purpose of the new tilt
and wash replacements. No one explained to me that replacement
windows will not be as warm and draft free or as sound proof as my combined old
storm windows and old windows. I want
sales people to be upfront with consumers about this important fact so that
others will not be shocked, blindsided and disappointed as I am. I was seeking maintenance free and I got
unexpected and unwanted winter draftiness for $20,000.
I would be willing to accept a cash refund to allow me to continue to
consider the option of adding storm windows to the 10 windows on the front of
the house and the 7 windows on the rear of the house. I also want the hope that other consumers
will be accurately informed upfront before purchase -----that replacement windows will not be as warm and draft free as the combination of old storms and old windows-----not after purchase.