Robert George Design Group, That's Landscaping

Review: We contracted with [redacted] to replace our roof. One section of the roof was never waterproofed and is now leaking. He will not take responsibility for finishing the job and correcting the damaged caused by the unfinished work.Desired Settlement: Finish the job and remediate the damages caused by the leak.

Business

Response:

I am very proud of the fact that, in my 30-year career, I have never once received a complaint. Until now...

In Ms. [redacted] complaint, she states that one section of the roof was never waterproofed and is now leaking. In fact, the roof was completely waterproofed and the roof, itself, is not leaking. Her sky lights are the cause of the leak.

The [redacted] contracted me to replace their roof back in [redacted]. At that time, I explained to them that their 3 sky lights were installed too closely together and would create a water damming effect that could cause leaking. Because the sky lights appeared to be about ** years old, I recommended to the [redacted] that they replace them during the roofing project and, in the process of doing so, reconfigure the placement of the sky lights so that the water would not dam. I also cautioned them about the water diverter they had installed in the place of a gutter. During a heavy down pour, a diverter will spray excess water on to the exterior walls of the house. This water will then find its way into whatever void there is and potentially cause a leak. I recommended that they replace the diverter with a gutter. They chose not to take my recommendations regarding the sky lights and the water diverter because of the additional expense that would be involved.

After a very, very heavy rain storm on or about 7/**/2013, Ms. [redacted] emailed me about a leak in her roof and inquired as to whether her roof was still under warrantee. I responded to her email that same day and explained that the warrantee expired after one year. We continued to email back and forth over the next few days. After the July 4th holiday, I went to her residence on two separate occasions for an external and interior inspection. These inspections confirmed that the cause of the leak was the aging, improperly installed sky lights and the water diverter. I communicated to Ms. [redacted] that the sky lights would need to be replaced or, at the very least, taken apart and rebuilt with new gaskets. I offered to perform this work for her right away, but would have to charge her a fee for the service because the 1-year warrantee had expired. Ms. [redacted] declined with prejudice and threatened to tarnish my reputation. Here we are.

There is nothing more important to me than my reputation, doing beautiful work, and making my clients happy. During the [redacted] roofing project, I built a small dry laid stone wall for them and reconstructed their bilco door foundation at no added cost. I also gave them a discount of over $3,000 off the cost of their project, and allowed them 90 days (interest free) to pay their final invoice. Had Ms. [redacted] asked me to meet her somewhere in the middle regarding the service costs, I would have happily considered her request.

Sincerely,

Please note the following:

-I have saved all email correspondence between myself and the [redacted] project from [redacted] including recent communications.

-In the Revdex.com complaint dated 10/**/13 it states problem occurred on 5/**/1*. In point of fact the other then email communication between 7/**/13 and 8/**/13 I have not heard anything from the [redacted] since 8/**. During August [redacted] J. [redacted] emailed me regarding access to their property to seal a deck we had constructed as part of their roof project in *011. Perhaps the date of 5/**/** on the complaint is a typo?

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID# [redacted], and have determined that my complaint has NOT been resolved because:

I believe Mr. [redacted] has not properly read or reviewed my written correspondence to him or the complaint and is a bit confused on the matter and has not offered any resolution. I will clarify here.

I reached out to [redacted] via email on July **, 2013 and told him we were having leaks in TWO places. One place was near the skylights that Mr. [redacted] references in his response and the second is in our upstairs guest bedroom. The upstairs guest bedroom leak is the issue I raised in my initial complaint. I initially sent Mr. [redacted] a photo of the water stains on the sheetrock inside the house. He then went to physically inspect the house. His response back to me was that the opening in the roof must have been caused by squirrels or other vermin and his warranty (albeit expired) didn't cover that. I then responded with a photo of the outside of the house showing that there was no way the opening was caused by animals. Rather, it was an opening in the roof, where two different slopes meet that was never covered/water proofed in the first place. When I stand on the ground and look up (under the overhang) I can see plywood or the materials of the roof board. The interior water stains are directly on the other side of this opening. The opening is so big that in fact there was a birds nest there in the spring. Mr. [redacted] then offered to do the work at his standard rate and did not take responsibility for the mistake or even acknowledge the gaping hole. I do recognize that I should have seen this earlier, however he is the professional and I am not. I understand his warranty cannot be indefinite and that materials will wear over time. However, this is very clearly a mistake on his part that has now caused damage. Our roof wasn't leaking when we hired him, we bought 35 year shingles and paid a small fortune for the work . . . I think it is entirely unreasonable that the job wasn't 100% finished and that it is leaking this soon and that he will not take any responsibility for it. I explained my position to him as asked for a more equitable resolution. He said flatly no. My last email to him was on August [redacted] and specifically said, "The contract clearly states this section would be done (i Can agree the sky lights may be a different issue). it is very clearly not water sealed and is leaking. There is no question you should make it right. I'm going to fight you on it. I think it's only fair of me to let you know upfront so you have a chance to do the right thing. Call me if you want to reconsider. I'm at xxxx. A good reputation takes a lifetime to build but can be damaged in one decision. I hope we can come to a mutual understanding on this that we both think is fair. I do not believe your position is fair." I didn't receive any response which is why I filed my complaint with the Revdex.com. There is very little I can do to compel him to do the work, especially considering he has already been fully paid, other than seek assistance from places like the Revdex.com.

The skylight leak: I did not raise this particular issue in my initial complaint, but since there is some confusion I will expand here. I sent Mr. [redacted] a video of what looked like spigot turned on pouring out of my roof. On this skylight matter, he suggested the skylights were the cause of the leak but couldn't be sure without opening up the roof. His offered resolution was not one that I would even consider in my right mind as he wants to charge me to open up the roof to find out if it is in fact the skylights, but can't provide any estimate of what it will cost to correct. Thus, I am not comfortable having him open up my roof and then potentially being stuck having to pay whatever he asks for because i'll be left with no other option. I do believe this to be less of a black and white issue.

Additionally, I would like to address some of the other, somewhat unrelated, items raised in the response. First of all, it was Mr. [redacted]'s reputation which led us to hire him in the first place despite his significantly higher costs. In fact, during an initial walk-through he made the point that he cared very much about his reputation and would always be sure to make sure his work was done properly, that we always knew where we could find him, that he cares about repeat business, etc. Unfortunately, it seems he cares about his reputation but not in making sure the work was done properly in this case which led me to the Revdex.com to look for an equitable resolution.

I think the cost concessions are somewhat irrelevant here as they in no way pertain to the costs we are now incurring (not to mention headache and time). I'll explain the reason for the $3k price concession and the offer to add a concrete foundation to our bilco door for free. Mr. [redacted] gave us an initial estimate range of $5*k - $65k depending on how much of the roof board needed to be replaced once he pulled up the shingles. This budget included 1) adding on a new kitchen entry roof and porch; *) adding on a new front entrance roof and porch; and 3) some tree removal. During the process we received pricing for these individual projects which Mr. [redacted] estimated to be approximately $30,700 together. This implies that the cost for the roof alone was estimated at $*1,300 - $34,000 (which compared to the average of $*5k on the three other bids we received). The roofing project alone came in at $85,00*. We added a few minor items: painting 3 doors and a half dozen or so other items, installing a mailbox post, repairing a window sill, possibly a couple of other minor items (i would estimate on the very high end to be worth a couple thousand dollars at most). This means the job cost almost FOUR TIMES what we were told when we awarded the business. It is because of this that Mr. [redacted] offered the 3.5% concession and the extra work. Rightly or wrongly, it is also because of this that I think I expect a quality job and quality customer service and follow-up.

Sincerely,

Business

Response:

[redacted]

Ms.[redacted] is incorrect in stating that “an opening in the roof, where two

different slopes meet was never covered/waterproofed in the first place”.

There was no opening in the roof. The roof did not leak and is in perfect

condition. The photo that she sent me was of a small soffit (approx 16

inches long) that somehow was not completed during the project. My

original response to Ms. [redacted] was that I could schedule completion of the soffit

early the following week. I had offered this within *4 hours of her (first)

July [redacted] email.

However, she would be billed for the time and materials. My reasoning was as

follows…

The *011 roofing project was a “time and materials project”. There was a 1 year warranty.

Ms. [redacted] was billed for the time it took to complete the project,

along with all of the materials needed to complete the project. Because

this soffit was not completed by us, her final invoice obviously did not

include the costs for that time and materials. Had the soffit been

completed back in *011, the final invoice would have been inflated by the cost

of the time and materials. So it stands to reason that whether the work

was completed in *011 or now, there are costs involved, both to myself and to

Ms. [redacted].

It is important to point out that, under normal circumstances, the unfinished

soffit would not have caused a leak in Ms. [redacted]’s upstairs guest

bedroom. Had a gutter been installed near this soffit (as I recommended)

in place of the water diverter, the uncommon, extremely heavy rain that fell

during the storm would not have sprayed and splattered on the exterior of the

house and found its way into the wall. However, it did. And, for

that, I offered to take responsibility and absorb the costs of repairing the

wall in her upstairs guest bedroom. But, I would still need to charge her

for the time and materials spent on completing the soffit.

Additionally, is concerning that Ms. [redacted] has such a different perspective regarding the

scope and costs of the project. The cost of the roofing project alone did

not come in at $85,00*, as Ms. [redacted] reports. This amount was the cost

of the roofing project plus many, many additional items that were added on to

expand the scope of the project as described below.

On 9/**/*11, [redacted] (Ms. [redacted]’s husband) signed a contract to perform the

following work within a budget of $5*,000-$65,000.

As part of the roofing project, which included at least 11 different sections

of roof with different pitches and different flashing requirements:

1. Strip off old roof, one specific roof area

at a time.

*. Replace rotten sheathing/plywood where

necessary.

3. Replace all fascia with PVC product, Azek.

4. Install ice and water shield over entire

roof and low points of exterior walls meeting other roof lines.

5. Redo flashing. Use copper for

flashing valleys in areas seen from the main road (one section of roof).

Use standard tin in all other areas.

6. Install new ridge and soffit vents on all

ridges and soffits.

7. Repair, restore and flash chimney.

8. Add gutters with downspouts where

indicated.

9. Install new drip edge.

10. Install new roofing shingles.

11. Install new rakes if rakes are compromised

in any way.

1*. In some areas, the siding is rotten.

Replace rotten siding with hardy board.

13. Restore exterior window frame on window by

parking area.

14. Consider cedar shake shingles on roof over

basement stairs and above bay window in back.

15. Remove chimney over kitchen.

16. Replace rotten wood, etc., on basement

stairs, and elsewhere if observed, with hardy board.

Other home improvements included in the contract:

1. Kitchen entrance redesign and possible

reconstruction.

a. Add new roof over kitchen entrance.

b. Rebuild existing landing and steps.

*. Front entrance of outbuilding on property:

a. Add new roof over front entrance.

b. Create covered porch (approximately 8’x8’)

as discussed and described.

c. Create design study drawing to communicate

these details.

d. Frame with pressure treated wood.

e. Post and railings – natural cedar for cedar

sided building and post/railings in line with style of house for those two

porches.

f. Decking surface – locally milled oak from

their neighbor.

3. Expand landscape lighting. Repair

landscape lighting where necessary.

4. Remove a few tree limbs and a few trees.

During the course of the roofing project, the scope was expanded to also include the

following:

1.

Increased

the size of the covered porch for front entrance of the outbuilding to

approximately 10’x18’ (nearly triple the original square footage):

a. *00% increase to labor and material to

correspond with *00% increase in square footage.

b. Created new design study drawing for

expanded scope.

c. Hand dug 8 holes for the cement

footings (*’x4’ deep) rather than using a machine in order to avoid damaging

the lawn that had previously been restored.

d. Obtained necessary permits and performed

related inspections.

*. Copper flashing:

a. Added copper flashing for side entrance

shed roof, reconstructed basement entrance valleys window and ridge, skylights,

chimney and rear bay window.

3. Connected all down spouts with underground

drain pipes pulling water away from their foundation and restored lawns where

trenches were dug.

4. Power washed back side of

house. Replaced rotten siding on house behind generator.

5. Removed satellite dishes. Filled

holes on house. Primed and painted.

6. Removed old phone and cable wires on

house. Filled holes. Primed and painted.

7. Primed and painted all exterior doors and

red window frames.

8. Reinforced kitchen entrance deck.

9. Installed chimney cap.

10. Cleaned, repaired, caulked, and patched the

existing roof (approximate dimensions *4X50) on the outbuilding in an effort to

fix existing leaks.

11. Replaced the following exterior walls

(siding, sheathing, priming, painting, etc.):

a. Walls on both sides of the roof with sky

lights.

b. Walls on either side of tunnel roof.

c. Walls in basement access stairway and above

eyebrow roof (adjacent to old chimney).

d. Walls connected to gable-end (road-side)

above dining room, etc.

1*.

Power washed, cleaned and repainted existing rubber roofing with aluminum

paint.

The final cost of the roofing project, the other home improvements included in the

original contract, plus the expanded scope of the project (everything outlined

above) was about $85,000 as Ms. [redacted] reported. I discounted $3,000 off

of this price to bring the final cost to approximately $8*,000. Note that

the costs of the expanded covered porch for the outbuilding were tracked

separately and in the end, totaled approximately $*0,000. (These costs

were separated out on the weekly statements that were provided as well as the

final invoice that was presented to the [redacted].) So, the cost of the

roofing project, landscape lighting, tree work, additional copper flashing, and

the remaining items that significantly expanded the scope of the project

totaled approximately $6*,000. Note that this is well within the budget

of the original signed contract ($5*,000-$65,000), and it includes all of the

additional items that expanded the scope of the project.

Detailed spreadsheets that showed the actual costs of labor and materials were prepared

and emailed to the [redacted] on a weekly basis. Notes and pictures were

also provided an average of three times a week. They were extremely well

informed about the costs related to the expanded scope of work. The

almost *00 pictures emailed during the project clearly communicated the extent

of rotten wood which had to be addressed and replaced.

Accordingly, every document and photo I am referencing to create my response to this

complaint was provided to the [redacted]'s during their project * years ago. Due to these facts,

it is unclear how or where Mrs. [redacted] has come up with her conclusion that

the additional work they chose to add

was only a 'few minor items' and 'only worth a couple thousand

dollars'. The materials alone for

additional work items was several thousand dollars,

all of which was communicated and approved by the [redacted] during the process

of their project.

I hope this information has been helpful.

Sincerely,