Staab & Sons Inc

Review: We hired Staab & Sons to perform our Dye Test required by [redacted] Borough when selling your house. [redacted] now requires a recorded(DVD) waste line camera inspection that is then submitted by the hired plumber to the Borough for review and approval. The first requirement was the Dye test. No issue as all the downspout drains are dispersed in the yard and not into the sewer system. The second part of the inspection was the sewer camera inspection. Immediately she asked where our exterior clean-out was. We dont have one due to our house being 105 years old. She said this was very rare and an immediate failure. We then moved on to the camera test. Hanna, the Staab & Sons representative, was scoping the drain and indicated every 4 feet or so the old cast iron pipes had settled and pulled apart therefore collecting puddles of water. She then said we had tree roots that started 30 ft out from the house and these roots continued for another 15 ft mentioning several cracks and pointing out multiple areas where the pipes had settled and came apart. With all the discovered issues she wrote up an estimate for $6,306.72. This was for an entire new sewer line with the required exterior house trap. (We have the written estimate). I had to call back later to ask when the Borough would review and get back to us with the results, she said she never submitted the DVD to [redacted] as they would never pass it. We paid $196.00 to have this inspection.

I decided to have multiple companies come by to review. Each one said the same thing after they scoped our drain. We had no cracks, no settlement and our sewer line was in remarkable condition. Every water puddle every 4 ft. was perfectly normal because the joining of each section creates that. We had 2 areas that had 1 to 2 inch root tails that were not coming through a crack or break. Each plumber said that was nothing to worry about and is normal. To make a long story short we submitted a DVD to [redacted] Borough without doing anything to line. [redacted] called today to approve the sewer camera inspection. Not only did Staab & Sons try to steal $6,306.72 from my family they also stole the initial $196 because they never submitted the DVD that would have passed inspection with no problem. An exterior clean-out is not a requirement of [redacted] Borough. It is a requirement of Allegheny County health department so if you build a new house you will have to have one installed. There was absolutely no reason to withhold my inspection DVD and not submit it. Totally taking advantage of people that are trying to meet a closing deadline to sell their family home is unexusable. If I hadnt looked deeper into these identified issues I would have wasted thousands of dollars. The plumbers also said Staab claimed the waste line was 5 ft down when it was actually 7.5ft down so they could add additional cost once they started digging even though they had the sensor and could easily tell it was 7.5ft below. I feel taken advantage of and can only imagine how many people just say "Yes, do it" and waste money trying to sell their home. Total scam and terrible business principles. I am talking with several consumer advocate groups including the news stations to warn of this business.Desired Settlement: I want my $196.00 returned. This money paid for a dye test and sewer camera inspection that included a DVD submission to [redacted] Borough. Staab & Sons did not submit the DVD because they wanted me to pay them $6306.72 to replace a perfectly good sewer line and if they submitted the DVD it would have passed. I know this because I paid 2 seperate plumbers for the same service and submitted the last DVD and it was approved today.

Business

Response:

STAAB & SONS, INC, 1921 Saw Mill Run Boulevard Pittsburgh, PA 1$210 (412) 881-6100 Fax: (412) 881 -6118 Gas, Elec., Oil, Water & Steam Heating - Gas & Elec/Air Conditioning Humidifiers - Water Heaters - Electronic Air Cleaner ~ Plumbing-Electric website: www.staabheating.com entail: [email protected] PA HOME IMPROVEMENT CONTRACTOR #PA 16570 Family Owned and Operated Since 1929 Bryant Factory Authorized Dealer November 2, 2015 Dear Revdex.com, We have tried to contact the customer several times after reading this complaint. However, we have not heard back from him. We are committed to making sure our customers are satisfied with the services we provide and appreciate their feedback. This is the first we are hearing that the customer was unsatisfied. We will continue to try and reach out to him. Sincerely, Matthew S[redacted] Staab & Sons, Inc

Review: We recently purchased a home, the seller found Staab & son's Plumbing to do all of our plumbing and heating work. We were assured at close the home would be free of any leaks and that the heat would work. Staab plumbing was to do this work. We had a final inspection done on the home and our inspector found the lines were over pressurized and that had to be adjusted. the over pressurizing of the lines can weaken unions in the plumbing. Two days after the inspection where our inspector approved it, a leak appeared on the second floor surrounding a radiator and the kitchen and basement, the second floor leak was around the radiator, the plumbing company did extensive work over the radiators. The home was vacant, and still is, no one turned a spigot in the home since the final inspection to the time we went in and found the leak, The home had NO leaks before this company came in, it is VACANT, the floor where the leak was occuring is not damaged indicating it is a new leak, the floor had a puddle under the radiator. Mike staab indicated this new repair would start at 650.00 and go up from there, This is the guarantee from [redacted]:This is to verify that only the plumbing and heating work performed by Staab & Son Inc. Specifically at this location is guaranteed for a period of (1) year.Sincerely, [redacted]###-###-####we have no details about "what" work they did, this is a generalized guarantee designed to cover nothing. They did access all radiators because they bled the lines.Not only do we have a serious leak, we can not use our heat in a 4500+sq ft home. FYI: this company also ruined a vintage sink by leaving industrial strength draino in the sink overnight and the bottom was completely rotted out, he told me initially well it is old...(it was not ruined I have before and after shots) he only replaced when I demanded something to be done, he was not going to do anything? This is wierd the new repairs are starting at the amount he paid to repair the sink. I have pictureDesired Settlement: We need this repair done asap since it is doing damage to our internal walls. We can not use our heat in the home, all 4500+ sq ft. This is damage done by this company. e ere assured the repairs would be covered. Staab is saying, no it starts at 650.00 (funny how that is the cost of the sink he replaced)This company is responsible.

Consumer

Response:

I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint. For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

As Staab indicates in their response:

"We were told by the seller to only address any apparent defects and work up an estimate

so that the boiler system was functional and safe."

This is precisely my point, we can not turn our boiler system on. This obligation is not met. This is KEY.

We as the new owners should not have to absorb new charges the seller already negotiated with this company.

We bought the home, and a condition of the sale was to make sure the heating systems worked.

[redacted] the seller paid for repairs, We the buyers would then get the guarantee, since we now own the home.

This boiler only was functional for a total of maybe 30 minutes it took for our inspector to check the leaks that is a TOTAL. Keep in mind work did not pass 4+ separate trips from this same inspector immediately prior to closing on the home. That is an important point since here we are two days after inspection all these troubles still occur.

Ever since final inspection it has leaked, in fact immediately after that visit.

The very NEXT Time the system was turned on;

It is leaking from points of contact this company had on the system. Points of contact, NOT new issues.

We have seen negligence from this company for the work they did perform concerning a sink.

Staab indicates:

"it was understood that we would only guarantee the work that we actually performed due to the fact

that the system is in excess of 30 to 50 years." This is why the seller indicated it was to be functional, to protect the buyers. I am certain she did not interpret "to be functional" to reflect 30 minutes of functionality.

Staab as experts should have seen these existing possible issues could arise; and identified weak conditions while they worked on a delicate systems and allowed for that in the quote to the seller; and might I be as bold to suggest they should have quoted to address issues this company could see as a *high potential to fail* in the near future. They are the experts.

While I can agree "leaks can popup from time to time" these problems occured IMMEDIATELY after Staab plumbing did work on the system. The valve at the radiator *which they indicate they were working with to "bleed out the system" IS EXACTLY WHAT IS LEAKING. If my husband wiggles/touches that valve he can see it start to leak. It is not appearing to leak from some "issue" in the walls. Please keep that in mind.

These issues in the walls I do not see evidence of, but I am suspect to know how they know of an issue in the wall

without accessing behind that wall? Did they see evidence of this before while working in the home? That is suspect.

Please see the damage done to the sink below, this is in the same room as the now questionable damage to internal pipes. They poured a very corrosive chemical down that sink, that is not rust from age... what did that do to pipes?

If they are indicating something in the wall is causing this valve to leak, that is absurd.

But if they are saying yes there is this second issue in the wall, I would suspect that should have been

found as possible touble and should have been addressed prior to now. Our inspector did find some

indication of "pressure" being dropped in the system on this second floor in final inspection.

Is it the same plumbing this damaged sink as attatched to? I am not a plumber. I am stating FACTS.

Bottom line:

These all were not issues before the work was done. This is just 2 days after the inspection,

and in fact: the VERY NEXT TIME the spigots were turned on, it all now occurs.

I would like to point out our inspector had to stop inspection on four separate times due to safety, and or the systems not being functional, such as the water not able to be turned on. All work done by this company was to bring these systems FUNCTIONAL. In fact, this pressure valve issue was found by our inspector and he told the company about it. This exact valve is spraying water in our basement when we fire the boiler up. One out of 5 inspections this system squeaks by the final one. This boiler in fact has never been seen to be functional longer than 30 minutes. I am not asking for a whole new heating system, just simply a functional one.

This inspector was out ther 4+ times to inspect this same system and could never finish inspections due to problems even firing up both the hot water heater, and the boiler along with a multitude of other issues -many times.

All of those delays were due to the plumbing company not being prepared to stand behind a functional system.

Out of what, 5 separate trips yes one single time it passed, but then two days later, the VERY NEXT TIME

the system as turned on all these new issues occur? Even over pre-existing conditions to be repaired?

This is hardly proof of a functional system condition. We had issues with this company all along the way.

Also Just as Staab indicates as his work:"over pressurized system, which had a pre-existing problem, caused by an old component (pressure reducing valve) that needed adjusting- *these were old existing problems that needed to be corrected and we did correct them as part of our job" This exact pressure valve is spraying water all over our basement. They tell us right in the above quote- this issue is their scope of the guarantee.

The sink was ruined by this company, he tried to get multiple companies to refinish the sink. Each one told him the damage was too severe to even attempt to refinish it. The final company who ultimately refinished the sink initially told me, directly to my face, it was beyond repair. I have pictures of the damage, it is FAR from a staining issue.

The bottom was completely collapsing and the porcelin was what looked to be chipped away. That is NOT rust from age. We were in the home when this damage occured, we seen the chemical literally dissolving porcelin away in the bottom of the sink. The contractor was scrapping the dissolved residue out from the sink. This is a vintage sink, part of the vintage home, we did not want brand new. To us it was valuable due to the age and style. This is a historical home. If the entire bottom was not "rotted" a simple refinish would have cost 60 bucks. They poured that chemical down our lines in the home, you see the condition that chemical left our sink in. Negligance. This company is trying to attack my descriptions of the trouble, yet we see here a picture that according to him this is simply a "stained" sink? I honestly do not know what extentent this has caused to our internal piping. This would be an additional expense for us to find out.

As for any further trips for this company to come out, I have been told I would be charged for the visit.

What good is a guarantee if further charges apply?

I am hesitant to trust this company further at this point, I have been very disappointed ith their work to date.

I should be entitled to have their damage evaluated, and repaired I should be able to trust a plumbing company's work.

At this point I can not.

Regards,

Business

Response:

Dear

First the complaint issued if you check our record does not match the way we do business. I've enclosed [redacted]'s original complaint to us and also our response to that complaint. I've circled items on the complaint to the Revdex.com that are not accurate and require rebuttal.

First off we were hired by the seller [redacted] not [redacted]. We were given a list of repairs to accomplish for the seller, all of which were quoted, accomplished and approved by a home inspector up until the time we were completely finished with our work on this particular job site. As a part of checking the boiler system, the only radiator that was leaking during our involvement on the job was the 3rd floor radiator which was corrected and inspected by the home inspector. Please note this boiler system is at least 30 to 50 years old. We were told by the seller to only address any apparent defects and work up an estimate so that the boiler system was functional and safe. We fulfilled this part of our agreement and it was understood that we would only guarantee the work that we actually performed due to the fact that the system is in excess of 30 to 50 years otd.

It is a common business practice for any company to only guarantee the work they performed, unless the customer wanted to buy a service agreement (for an extra amount of money) to cover old existing equipment, piping, radiators, plumbing, all of which has been in existence and operating for more than 30 to 50 years. We did not offer such a guarantee; if we had we would have requested more money to cover such an old system. From experience these old systems can last for several more years or they can be a chronic problem due to the fact of its age and wear and tear. Leaks can pop up from time to time. This is the reason we did not guarantee this old system and would not due to the fact of all the concealed piping that you cannot see and because of its age, coupled with the fact that we did not install it. All the things we did guarantee were the specific work we performed. Please note, during our time on this job site the 1st floor radiator and 2nd floor radiator never leaked nor did we work on them / and the home inspector inspected therr^and they were not leaking at the time when we were finished with the job.

The point [redacted] made about us bleeding the air out of all the radiators is true but this procedure was done during our work on the job and again was inspected and passed by the home inspector. I also might add, as a courtesy to [redacted] when she first notified us of the leaks on the lst and 2nd floor, I sent a technician there free of charge to examine the problem only to find that the leaks were 2 brand new leaks that had nothing to do with the air vents. I might also add just because we opened the 30 to 50 year old vents to bleed the air out of the system (which is normal procedure) doesn't mean we own the whole radiator. I might also add the vents were not leaking. In short the new owners are trying to get us to fix a problem that was non-existent during our time on the job, and neither of these radiators were a part of our estimates. I also might add that if they had leaked while we were on the job, we would have worked up an additional estimate and repaired them at an additional cost.

The over pressurized system the owner refers to was due to an old pre-existing problem caused by an old component (pressure reducing valve) that needed to be adjusted and an expansion tank that needed to be drained. These were old existing problems that needed to be corrected and we did correct them as a part of our job which we did. The home inspection took place days after this work and no leaks were existent, the boiler system was functioning and safe. To say that is what caused the leaks is pure speculation as they didn't leak even after we corrected the problem. Also the pressure was under 30 lbs PSI which does not qualify as an over pressurized system as the relief value on the boiler blows off @30 lbs to protect the boiler and the piping system. To say the system was over pressurized is technically

inaccurate and an exaggeration but the 28 lbs in question was a pre-existing condition and was corrected as part of our work and not caused by our company, but corrected by our company.

As far as the stained sink is concerned, our plumber in an attempt to clear a drain, poured drain cleaner down a drain. It bubbled up and stained an already stained sink. He did not fill the sink up with drain cleaner. [redacted], the seller who we were working for at the time said the sink was already stained and to wait and see if the buyers ([redacted]) have a problem with it. From the get-go we offered to replace or refinish the sink with [redacted], she did not have to "demand" for us to do so. The sink was not rotted through as stated in her complaint, the finish was stained. She elected to have the "rotted sink" refinished, not replaced, which we did. The sink was refinished and Staab & Sons, Inc. paid the bill.

In short, these leaks are the responsibility of either the seller or the buyer. Due to the fact the leaks were non-existent at the time of our inspection, and were not items we estimated or worked on, and are not a part of our guarantee, and due to the fact the home inspector inspected these items at the end of our involvement with this job and passed the system with no leaks, it is not our responsibility and nowhere in our guarantee did we imply that we would guarantee this old existing system but was very specific to note that we would only guarantee the work that we specifically performed, (Please see attachments.)

The work that needs to be done and is in question is not warranty work, it is new work, and because it is new work someone will have to pay to have it done. The price we quoted, approximately $650.00 and up will involve a technician a minimum of 1/2 day plus parts. It is not an easy job. [redacted]'s insinuation that we are trying to get back our $650.00 sink repair is sadly mistaken and she is not aware of the costs to do such a job.