Revdex.com: I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below Gutter Shutter did come today to inspect, and we appreciate that We are waiting to receive their written evaluation of the situation, which we will review with our advisors At this point it is too early to determine if the response resolves the matter Regards, [redacted]
Thank you for your recent email of July 24, about the installation of gutters and downspouts by our company at the home of Mrand MrsCJ [redacted] The [redacted] s’ most recent letter states “the drip edge was not left at our home on the day the gutters and downspouts were delivered, June 12, 2014,” and that the drip edge was not “on the truck when the installers were on the premises.” We do not understand the [redacted] s’ point about the location of the drip edge, since they refused to let our installers install itHowever, drip edge does not come pre-manufactured or “off the shelf”; it is custom made at the time of installation right on the job siteTherefore, it could not have been pre-delivered or been seen sitting on the installers’ truck Although the contract states that “Company will install drip edge on all new gutters,” Mr [redacted] refused to let our installers put drip edge on his homeHis reason given at the time was that we needed to paint it to match the color of the gutters after it is custom made, and after he saw the roll of white material that would be formed into the drip edge, he said he was having a new roof installed in two weeks and wanted the roofers to install it when doing the roof workMr [redacted] said he needed to have wood replaced on the decking and would request that it come in a factory color, so he did not want the material painted We believe that the [redacted] s’ home needs to have drip edge installed, yet they refused to let our company install itMr [redacted] refused to sign our standard certificate of completion and refused to pay the 50% contract balance due on the jobWe completed the installation of gutters and downspouts on their home on Friday, June 13, and on Monday, June 16, 2014, Mr [redacted] called us and wanted all of his down payment backThere was no specific complaint or request that we come to review the installationUnreasonably, Mr [redacted] wanted to keep the work and avoid paying for it We have reviewed the photos sent by Mr [redacted] and observe that whoever took the pictures appears to have broken the seal on the shingles by lifting them up for photosWe find the installation in accordance with practice in the industryHowever, on one matter, after viewing the photos, we would install a reducer on the one downspout where it meets the drainpipe at ground level The [redacted] s’ complaints appear centered around the time of day the installation occurred and the location of the drip edgeThe installers finished the job with sufficient daylight, but in any event the [redacted] s refused to let the company return to the premises to have the [redacted] s point out their concernsThey just wanted their money backAfter specifically requesting drip edge on June 11, at the time the contract was signed, Mr [redacted] refused to let the installers install itHis comments about it being missing from the materials delivery are irrelevant to the fact of his refusal, and show that his doesn’t understand the nature of the product, which is custom made, or his complaint is pretextual Our Company is willing to install the drip edge and install the reducer on the single downspout at the ground levelThis would complete the job as contracted, and our Company would expect to receive the balance due under the contractWe will waive any late charges or interestOur company went above and beyond to accommodate the [redacted] s in their desire to expedite the gutter/downspout installation on their homeBut since they refused to let us make any attempt to address their concerns, and immediately demanded a refund on the next business day following the installation, we question the motivation behind their filing of a complaintNonetheless, we would like to see this matter amicably resolved Very truly yours, John Cross General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies
[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response If you wish, you may update it before sending it.] Revdex.com: I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] , and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me Regards, [redacted]
This letter details the facts concerning our product installation at the home of Mrand Mrs CJ [redacted] The [redacted] s called us on June 10, 2014, responding to an advertisement in Reach magazineThey wanted a gutter/downspout installation as quickly as possible, and made an appointment for our company to visit their home on June 11, Enclosed is a contract signed by the [redacted] s on June 11, Because the [redacted] s were anxious to get the installation underway, they waived the 3-day right of rescission (see contract), and an appointment for installation was set for June 13, The [redacted] s’ letter mentions that the installers “didn’t show up until 5:p.m.” However, the installation occurred just days away from the longest day of the year, and there was sufficient light to work until after 9:p.mThe installation team has many years of experience and knew that the job could be fully completed within the time available Although the contract calls for the installation of drip edge on all new gutters, Mr [redacted] refused to have the drip edge installedThe [redacted] s’ letter details seemingly specific complaints, yet the disk of photos sent to us by Mr [redacted] does not show any of the items on his list, other than a closeup showing two screws on the ground (The [redacted] s’ letter to the Revdex.com says “[f]ound screws and metal piece in the yard, flowerbeds, and driveway”) The contract provides that “Customer agrees that the entire contract price shall be paid immediately upon completion of installationPayment may be given to installers at time of completionAccounts are delinquent when they are unpaid after days past the completion date...” However, as noted by our installers on the Buyers’ Certificate of Completion” (copy attached), “CustRefused to sign till talks to sales repThe guy was really drunk.” Mr [redacted] refused to pay the balance due on the installation after it was completed on July 11, Mr [redacted] called our office on June 16, 2014, wanting return of his down payment and claiming to be unhappy with the productMrJohn Cross spoke with him and told him that the company would take care of any concerns that he hadMr [redacted] said he did not want anyone from our company on his property Despite Mr [redacted] ’s comment, Mrs [redacted] spoke with our company’s service manager to set up a service call for June 23, When our company team arrived at the [redacted] s’ residence, Mrs [redacted] refused to permit our service team access to the property, saying that she wanted her husband homeOur company tried again that same evening, and was still not permitted by the [redacted] s to address their concerns The company’s service manager contacted the [redacted] s on July 2, about their unpaid balance, since they had refused to let the company back on their property to address any concerns We were informed by Mr [redacted] that he was composing a letter to our company presidentOur company’s service manager spoke to Mrs [redacted] on July 8, 2014, who again said that a letter was forthcoming Our company’s view is that we rushed to accommodate the [redacted] s in their request for an installation as quickly as possible, Mr [redacted] refused to let our installers perform the work as contemplated on the contract, the [redacted] s refused to let our company address any concerns that the [redacted] s said they had about the installation, and the [redacted] s refused to pay the balance owed The complaint made by the [redacted] s to the Revdex.com seeks a refund of the down payment for the installationThe [redacted] s refused to let our company’s service team on their property, but sent us a CD filled with photos that do not conform to the list of issues in the [redacted] ’s letter to the Revdex.comIt is our view that the [redacted] s have told us of no legitimate complaint and need to pay the balance due Very truly yours, John Cross General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies Enclosures: Installation Contract For [redacted] dated June 11, Buyers’ Certificate of Completion for [redacted]
We are responding to the recent offer made to install the drip edge and install the reducer to one downspout at the ground levelThese items will not correct all of the issues that have been brought to the companies attentionAs we have previously stated an installer came to our home and took pictures and looked at the installation performed by your company We did not demand an immediate refund of our money, but after being ignored, given the run around, slandered and lied to and about repeatedly, we feel that the best result for both your company and for ourselves would be the removal of your product from our home and the refund of our money Best Regards, CJ and [redacted] L [redacted]
[redacted] put a stop payment on her check and the money is in her account, not sure what the confusion is but we wish her and her family the best. Respectfully, John Cross
Our company has exchanged several letters with the ***sThe ***s' initial complaint filed with the Bureau on July 10, asked for a "prompt refund." The ***s' next letter wanted a "full refund." Now we received the ***s' August 11, letter which says that "[w]e did not demand an immediate refund of our money." even while they demand "removal of your product from our home and the refund of our money."
We know that the Bureau seeks to act as a facilitator in resolving disputes between customers and companiesBut that role presupposes that a customer is willing to budge an inchThe ***s are actually moving in reverse-- from asking for a full refund in their initial complaint to now wanting removal of the product and a full refund too
Our company has repeatedly offered to address the ***s' concerns with a walk-through, but they won't permit us on their propertyWe offered to install drip edges and a reducer and forgo late fees and interestSince all of the movement in this dispute is coming from our side, we now again offer a proposal: that both sides walk awayThe ***s will then have their installation at half priceOur company would need to receive a release from the ***s and their promise of non-disparagement of our company
We believe this is a generous offer, and we would truly appreciate a reasonable response from the ***s
Very truly yours,
John Cross
General Manager of
The GutterShutter Companies
Gutter Shutter did send a technician to inspect the gutters and make recommendations He came almost weeks ago Gutter Shutter told us they would provide us with a written report We are still waiting They say we will get it next week
*** ***
I spoke to Mr*** explained this is not our policy and apologized for the situationAlso thank him for bringing this to our attention. His written estimate was mailed out today
Respectfully,
*** ***
I have reviewed both with the production manager and the
installer that was sent to your home to do an inspectionAfter many
conversations and reviewing the pictures, the consensus opinion is that you
shingles are pushed up because of the way your fascia was installedIt is
above the roof line and that’s what is causing the issueAs far as your
original contact concerned about “ice dams”, I have included a link you might
find useful http://www.icedamremovalguys.com/learning-center/ice-dam-myth-busters/myth1-gutt...⇄ />
I do apologize in the delay in getting this to you but I
wanted to make sure all the different angles were weighed and opinions heard
At this point, the only logical fix would be getting with a
contractor to trim back the fascia board so that is even with or slightly below
the roof-line edge
Should you need anything else from me or the Gutter Shutter,
please do not hesitate to contact me
Respectfully,
John cross
RE: Response to letter received via email 07/22/2014 Installation By the Gutter Shutter Company at the following address
[redacted]
Dear Ms. [redacted]
CJ and I would like to put an end to this matter, in our original photos you can clearly see a photo showing a pile of 9 to 10 screws. The drip edge was not left at our home on the day the gutters and downspouts were delivered, June 12, 2014, nor was it on the truck when the installers were on the premises. We do have witnesses to the time the installers completed for the night at 10:05. Photos of end cap that leaks, clean out where water runs out, scratched clean out and downspout to the cistern were all included, in the original photos. More photos are attached, as now because of improper installation of gutters the roof sheeting is rotting.
Now for the drip edge, if CJ had refused to have the drip edge installed then your installers should have had a Change Order signed or have stopped the job. The cost of installation would have changed at this point.
Now as for finishing a job after 10 p.m. You can't inspect work, in the dark. Not being able to inspect the work performed, is the reason the balance was not paid. The installers were requested to have their boss and the owner of Gutter Shutter contact us on Monday, 06/15/2014. No call. A message was was left on the emergency line on, 06/15/2014 and no call again.
No Show. Appointment had been scheduled with Dave, for 5:00 p.m., on 06/23/2014. Nobody was refused access to the property, because nobody showed up. [redacted] was not at home from approximately 8 a.m. to 4:30 p.m., she was at her friends place all day.
Finally, on 06/30/2014, someone finally showed up. An installer came and walked around and took pictures.
Now I would will address the fact that you have slandered my name. You have no idea, other than the information you have received through sub-contractors, on my character, and behavior. Therefore a judgment of that magnitude, was made unjustly.
Due to the improper installation of the gutters, downspouts and no drip edge being installed, we are having damage done to roof sheeting and until the gutters and downspouts are removed, will not be able to see any other unseen damages.
Best Regards
CJ & [redacted] L. [redacted]
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted]. For your reference,...
details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
Gutter Shutter did come today to inspect, and we appreciate that. We are waiting to receive their written evaluation of the situation, which we will review with our advisors. At this point it is too early to determine if the response resolves the matter.
Regards,
[redacted]
[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the...
business's response. If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Regards,
[redacted]
[redacted] put a stop payment on her check and the money is in her account, not sure what the confusion is but we wish her and her family the best.
Respectfully,
John Cross
Thank you for your recent email of July 24, 2014 about the installation of gutters and downspouts by our company at the home of Mr. and Mrs. CJ [redacted].
The [redacted]s’ most recent letter states “the drip edge was not left at our home on the day the gutters and downspouts were delivered, June 12, 2014,” and that the drip edge was not “on the truck when the installers were on the premises.” We do not understand the [redacted]s’ point about the location of the drip edge, since they refused to let our installers install it. However, drip edge does not come pre-manufactured or “off the shelf”; it is custom made at the time of installation right on the job site. Therefore, it could not have been pre-delivered or been seen sitting on the installers’ truck.
Although the contract states that “Company will install drip edge on all new gutters,” Mr. [redacted] refused to let our installers put drip edge on his home. His reason given at the time was that we needed to paint it to match the color of the gutters after it is custom made, and after he saw the roll of white material that would be formed into the drip edge, he said he was having a new roof installed in two weeks and wanted the roofers to install it when doing the roof work. Mr. [redacted] said he needed to have wood replaced on the decking and would request that it come in a factory color, so he did not want the material painted.
We believe that the [redacted]s’ home needs to have drip edge installed, yet they refused to let our company install it. Mr. [redacted] refused to sign our standard certificate of completion and refused to pay the 50% contract balance due on the job. We completed the installation of gutters and downspouts on their home on Friday, June 13, 2014 and on Monday, June 16, 2014, Mr. [redacted] called us and wanted all of his down payment back. There was no specific complaint or request that we come to review the installation. Unreasonably, Mr. [redacted] wanted to keep the work and avoid paying for it.
We have reviewed the photos sent by Mr. [redacted] and observe that whoever took the pictures appears to have broken the seal on the shingles by lifting them up for photos. We find the installation in accordance with practice in the industry. However, on one matter, after viewing the photos, we would install a reducer on the one downspout where it meets the drainpipe at ground level.
The [redacted]s’ complaints appear centered around the time of day the installation occurred and the location of the drip edge. The installers finished the job with sufficient daylight, but in any event the [redacted]s refused to let the company return to the premises to have the [redacted]s point out their concerns. They just wanted their money back. After specifically requesting drip edge on June 11, 2014 at the time the contract was signed, Mr. [redacted] refused to let the installers install it. His comments about it being missing from the materials delivery are irrelevant to the fact of his refusal, and show that his doesn’t understand the nature of the product, which is custom made, or his complaint is pretextual.
Our Company is willing to install the drip edge and install the reducer on the single downspout at the ground level. This would complete the job as contracted, and our Company would expect to receive the balance due under the contract. We will waive any late charges or interest. Our company went above and beyond to accommodate the [redacted]s in their desire to expedite the gutter/downspout installation on their home. But since they refused to let us make any attempt to address their concerns, and immediately demanded a refund on the next business day following the installation, we question the motivation behind their filing of a complaint. Nonetheless, we would like to see this matter amicably resolved.
Very truly yours,
John Cross
General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies
We are responding to the recent offer made to install the drip edge and install the reducer to one downspout at the ground level. These 2 items will not correct all of the issues that have been brought to the companies attention. As we have previously stated an installer came to our home and took pictures and looked at the installation performed by your company.
We did not demand an immediate refund of our money, but after being ignored, given the run around, slandered and lied to and about repeatedly, we feel that the best result for both your company and for ourselves would be the removal of your product from our home and the refund of our money.
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted].
I would not recommend Gutter Shutter to my worst enemy. Let's focus on what we know. First of all, we know Gutter Shutter is incompetent. This is proven by these facts: (1) GS failed to install a drip edge when the gutters were originally installed in December 2012. (2) When GS finally installed a drip edge in March 2014, the installation was so defective the problems were visible from the street. Secondly, we know GS is not reputable. (1) As shown by the fine print of the contract, which was not called to our attention, GS knew that icing problems were likely to occur, yet said nothing. (2) When the drip edge job was redone in July 2014, according to GS it was obvious that the drip edge, gutters, fascia, and shingles were not meeting properly, yet GS said nothing. (I suppose this one is really a combination of incompetence and lack of reputability.)
The roof was installed in 2008. We had absolutely no problems with icing or anything else until the Gutter Shutters were installed. We had no problems with the temperature of our roof, or the amount of insulation in the attic, or anything else. If there was the potential for icing problems, due to how the gutters and roof were meeting, or any other reason, GS had an obligation to tell us. Had they alerted us to any of these possible problems, we would never have purchased the Gutter Shutters.
So our contractor who installed the roof tells us that the current problem stems from the improper installation of the drip edge. Gutter Shutter tells us that the problem is with the way the fascia was installed by the contractor. We have a long record of high satisfaction with the work of our contractor. We have a long record of dissatisfaction with Gutter Shutter. Who should we believe?
Regardless of the cause, we need to get the problem behind us. We have absolutely no faith in the ability of Gutter Shutter to deal with it. So we have no choice but pay additional funds to hire someone else to resolve the problem.
So we accept the business's response, not because we are satisfied, but because we have no faith in the ability of Gutter Shutter to deal with the problem. It's just time to move on.
This letter details the facts concerning our product installation at the home of Mr. and Mrs.
CJ [redacted].
The [redacted]s called us on June 10, 2014, responding to an advertisement in Reach
magazine. They wanted a gutter/downspout installation as quickly as possible, and made an
appointment for our...
company to visit their home on June 11, 2014. Enclosed is a contract signed
by the [redacted]s on June 11, 2014. Because the [redacted]s were anxious to get the installation
underway, they waived the 3-day right of rescission (see contract), and an appointment for
installation was set for June 13, 2013.
The [redacted]s’ letter mentions that the installers “didn’t show up until 5:00 p.m.” However,
the installation occurred just days away from the longest day of the year, and there was sufficient
light to work until after 9:00 p.m. The installation team has many years of experience and knew that
the job could be fully completed within the time available Although the contract calls for the
installation of drip edge on all new gutters, Mr. [redacted] refused to have the drip edge installed. The
[redacted]s’ letter details seemingly specific complaints, yet the disk of photos sent to us by Mr.
[redacted] does not show any of the items on his list, other than a closeup showing two screws on the
ground (The [redacted]s’ letter to the Revdex.com says “[f]ound screws and metal piece in the yard,
flowerbeds, and driveway”)
The contract provides that “Customer agrees that the entire contract price shall be paid
immediately upon completion of installation. Payment may be given to installers at time of
completion. Accounts are delinquent when they are unpaid after 5 days past the completion date...”
However, as noted by our installers on the Buyers’ Certificate of Completion” (copy attached),
“Cust. Refused to sign till talks to sales rep. The guy was really drunk.” Mr. [redacted] refused to pay
the balance due on the installation after it was completed on July 11, 2014.
Mr. [redacted] called our office on June 16, 2014, wanting return of his down payment and
claiming to be unhappy with the product. Mr. John Cross spoke with him and told him that the
company would take care of any concerns that he had. Mr. [redacted] said he did not want anyone
from our company on his property.
Despite Mr. [redacted]’s comment, Mrs. [redacted] spoke with our company’s service manager
to set up a service call for June 23, 2014. When our company team arrived at the [redacted]s’
residence, Mrs. [redacted] refused to permit our service team access to the property, saying that she
wanted her husband home. Our company tried again that same evening, and was still not permitted
by the [redacted]s to address their concerns.
The company’s service manager contacted the [redacted]s on July 2, 2014 about their unpaid
balance, since they had refused to let the company back on their property to address any concerns.
We were informed by Mr. [redacted] that he was composing a letter to our company president. Our
company’s service manager spoke to Mrs. [redacted] on July 8, 2014, who again said that a letter was
forthcoming.
Our company’s view is that we rushed to accommodate the [redacted]s in their request for an
installation as quickly as possible, Mr. [redacted] refused to let our installers perform the work as
contemplated on the contract, the [redacted]s refused to let our company address any concerns that
the [redacted]s said they had about the installation, and the [redacted]s refused to pay the balance owed.
The complaint made by the [redacted]s to the Revdex.com seeks a refund of the down
payment for the installation. The [redacted]s refused to let our company’s service team on their
property, but sent us a CD filled with photos that do not conform to the list of issues in the
[redacted]’s letter to the Revdex.com. It is our view that the [redacted]s have told us of no legitimate
complaint and need to pay the balance due.
Very truly yours,
John Cross
General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies
Enclosures:
Installation Contract For [redacted] dated June 11, 2014
Buyers’ Certificate of Completion for [redacted]
Revdex.com: I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below Gutter Shutter did come today to inspect, and we appreciate that We are waiting to receive their written evaluation of the situation, which we will review with our advisors At this point it is too early to determine if the response resolves the matter Regards, [redacted]
Thank you for your recent email of July 24, about the installation of gutters and downspouts by our company at the home of Mrand MrsCJ [redacted] The [redacted] s’ most recent letter states “the drip edge was not left at our home on the day the gutters and downspouts were delivered, June 12, 2014,” and that the drip edge was not “on the truck when the installers were on the premises.” We do not understand the [redacted] s’ point about the location of the drip edge, since they refused to let our installers install itHowever, drip edge does not come pre-manufactured or “off the shelf”; it is custom made at the time of installation right on the job siteTherefore, it could not have been pre-delivered or been seen sitting on the installers’ truck Although the contract states that “Company will install drip edge on all new gutters,” Mr [redacted] refused to let our installers put drip edge on his homeHis reason given at the time was that we needed to paint it to match the color of the gutters after it is custom made, and after he saw the roll of white material that would be formed into the drip edge, he said he was having a new roof installed in two weeks and wanted the roofers to install it when doing the roof workMr [redacted] said he needed to have wood replaced on the decking and would request that it come in a factory color, so he did not want the material painted We believe that the [redacted] s’ home needs to have drip edge installed, yet they refused to let our company install itMr [redacted] refused to sign our standard certificate of completion and refused to pay the 50% contract balance due on the jobWe completed the installation of gutters and downspouts on their home on Friday, June 13, and on Monday, June 16, 2014, Mr [redacted] called us and wanted all of his down payment backThere was no specific complaint or request that we come to review the installationUnreasonably, Mr [redacted] wanted to keep the work and avoid paying for it We have reviewed the photos sent by Mr [redacted] and observe that whoever took the pictures appears to have broken the seal on the shingles by lifting them up for photosWe find the installation in accordance with practice in the industryHowever, on one matter, after viewing the photos, we would install a reducer on the one downspout where it meets the drainpipe at ground level The [redacted] s’ complaints appear centered around the time of day the installation occurred and the location of the drip edgeThe installers finished the job with sufficient daylight, but in any event the [redacted] s refused to let the company return to the premises to have the [redacted] s point out their concernsThey just wanted their money backAfter specifically requesting drip edge on June 11, at the time the contract was signed, Mr [redacted] refused to let the installers install itHis comments about it being missing from the materials delivery are irrelevant to the fact of his refusal, and show that his doesn’t understand the nature of the product, which is custom made, or his complaint is pretextual Our Company is willing to install the drip edge and install the reducer on the single downspout at the ground levelThis would complete the job as contracted, and our Company would expect to receive the balance due under the contractWe will waive any late charges or interestOur company went above and beyond to accommodate the [redacted] s in their desire to expedite the gutter/downspout installation on their homeBut since they refused to let us make any attempt to address their concerns, and immediately demanded a refund on the next business day following the installation, we question the motivation behind their filing of a complaintNonetheless, we would like to see this matter amicably resolved Very truly yours, John Cross General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies
[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response If you wish, you may update it before sending it.] Revdex.com: I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted] , and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me Regards, [redacted]
This letter details the facts concerning our product installation at the home of Mrand Mrs CJ [redacted] The [redacted] s called us on June 10, 2014, responding to an advertisement in Reach magazineThey wanted a gutter/downspout installation as quickly as possible, and made an appointment for our company to visit their home on June 11, Enclosed is a contract signed by the [redacted] s on June 11, Because the [redacted] s were anxious to get the installation underway, they waived the 3-day right of rescission (see contract), and an appointment for installation was set for June 13, The [redacted] s’ letter mentions that the installers “didn’t show up until 5:p.m.” However, the installation occurred just days away from the longest day of the year, and there was sufficient light to work until after 9:p.mThe installation team has many years of experience and knew that the job could be fully completed within the time available Although the contract calls for the installation of drip edge on all new gutters, Mr [redacted] refused to have the drip edge installedThe [redacted] s’ letter details seemingly specific complaints, yet the disk of photos sent to us by Mr [redacted] does not show any of the items on his list, other than a closeup showing two screws on the ground (The [redacted] s’ letter to the Revdex.com says “[f]ound screws and metal piece in the yard, flowerbeds, and driveway”) The contract provides that “Customer agrees that the entire contract price shall be paid immediately upon completion of installationPayment may be given to installers at time of completionAccounts are delinquent when they are unpaid after days past the completion date...” However, as noted by our installers on the Buyers’ Certificate of Completion” (copy attached), “CustRefused to sign till talks to sales repThe guy was really drunk.” Mr [redacted] refused to pay the balance due on the installation after it was completed on July 11, Mr [redacted] called our office on June 16, 2014, wanting return of his down payment and claiming to be unhappy with the productMrJohn Cross spoke with him and told him that the company would take care of any concerns that he hadMr [redacted] said he did not want anyone from our company on his property Despite Mr [redacted] ’s comment, Mrs [redacted] spoke with our company’s service manager to set up a service call for June 23, When our company team arrived at the [redacted] s’ residence, Mrs [redacted] refused to permit our service team access to the property, saying that she wanted her husband homeOur company tried again that same evening, and was still not permitted by the [redacted] s to address their concerns The company’s service manager contacted the [redacted] s on July 2, about their unpaid balance, since they had refused to let the company back on their property to address any concerns We were informed by Mr [redacted] that he was composing a letter to our company presidentOur company’s service manager spoke to Mrs [redacted] on July 8, 2014, who again said that a letter was forthcoming Our company’s view is that we rushed to accommodate the [redacted] s in their request for an installation as quickly as possible, Mr [redacted] refused to let our installers perform the work as contemplated on the contract, the [redacted] s refused to let our company address any concerns that the [redacted] s said they had about the installation, and the [redacted] s refused to pay the balance owed The complaint made by the [redacted] s to the Revdex.com seeks a refund of the down payment for the installationThe [redacted] s refused to let our company’s service team on their property, but sent us a CD filled with photos that do not conform to the list of issues in the [redacted] ’s letter to the Revdex.comIt is our view that the [redacted] s have told us of no legitimate complaint and need to pay the balance due Very truly yours, John Cross General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies Enclosures: Installation Contract For [redacted] dated June 11, Buyers’ Certificate of Completion for [redacted]
We are responding to the recent offer made to install the drip edge and install the reducer to one downspout at the ground levelThese items will not correct all of the issues that have been brought to the companies attentionAs we have previously stated an installer came to our home and took pictures and looked at the installation performed by your company We did not demand an immediate refund of our money, but after being ignored, given the run around, slandered and lied to and about repeatedly, we feel that the best result for both your company and for ourselves would be the removal of your product from our home and the refund of our money Best Regards, CJ and [redacted] L [redacted]
[redacted] put a stop payment on her check and the money is in her account, not sure what the confusion is but we wish her and her family the best. Respectfully, John Cross
Our company has exchanged several letters with the ***sThe ***s' initial complaint filed with the Bureau on July 10, asked for a "prompt refund." The ***s' next letter wanted a "full refund." Now we received the ***s' August 11, letter which says that "[w]e did not demand an immediate refund of our money." even while they demand "removal of your product from our home and the refund of our money."
We know that the Bureau seeks to act as a facilitator in resolving disputes between customers and companiesBut that role presupposes that a customer is willing to budge an inchThe ***s are actually moving in reverse-- from asking for a full refund in their initial complaint to now wanting removal of the product and a full refund too
Our company has repeatedly offered to address the ***s' concerns with a walk-through, but they won't permit us on their propertyWe offered to install drip edges and a reducer and forgo late fees and interestSince all of the movement in this dispute is coming from our side, we now again offer a proposal: that both sides walk awayThe ***s will then have their installation at half priceOur company would need to receive a release from the ***s and their promise of non-disparagement of our company
We believe this is a generous offer, and we would truly appreciate a reasonable response from the ***s
Very truly yours,
John Cross
General Manager of
The GutterShutter Companies
Gutter Shutter did send a technician to inspect the gutters and make recommendations He came almost weeks ago Gutter Shutter told us they would provide us with a written report We are still waiting They say we will get it next week
*** ***
We will be at Mr***'s home on 9/11/14, at that time we will inspect the system and if it needs to be rehung we will do so
John Cross
GM
We have a scheduled service call set for Friday October 10, to resolve *** *** issues
Respectfully,
John Cross
I spoke to Mr*** explained this is not our policy and apologized for the situationAlso thank him for bringing this to our attention. His written estimate was mailed out today
Respectfully,
*** ***
I have reviewed both with the production manager and the
installer that was sent to your home to do an inspectionAfter many
conversations and reviewing the pictures, the consensus opinion is that you
shingles are pushed up because of the way your fascia was installedIt is
above the roof line and that’s what is causing the issueAs far as your
original contact concerned about “ice dams”, I have included a link you might
find useful
http://www.icedamremovalguys.com/learning-center/ice-dam-myth-busters/myth1-gutt...⇄ /> I do apologize in the delay in getting this to you but I
wanted to make sure all the different angles were weighed and opinions heard
At this point, the only logical fix would be getting with a
contractor to trim back the fascia board so that is even with or slightly below
the roof-line edge
Should you need anything else from me or the Gutter Shutter,
please do not hesitate to contact me
Respectfully,
John cross
RE: Response to letter received via email 07/22/2014 Installation By the Gutter Shutter Company at the following address
[redacted]
Dear Ms. [redacted]
CJ and I would like to put an end to this matter, in our original photos you can clearly see a photo showing a pile of 9 to 10 screws. The drip edge was not left at our home on the day the gutters and downspouts were delivered, June 12, 2014, nor was it on the truck when the installers were on the premises. We do have witnesses to the time the installers completed for the night at 10:05. Photos of end cap that leaks, clean out where water runs out, scratched clean out and downspout to the cistern were all included, in the original photos. More photos are attached, as now because of improper installation of gutters the roof sheeting is rotting.
Now for the drip edge, if CJ had refused to have the drip edge installed then your installers should have had a Change Order signed or have stopped the job. The cost of installation would have changed at this point.
Now as for finishing a job after 10 p.m. You can't inspect work, in the dark. Not being able to inspect the work performed, is the reason the balance was not paid. The installers were requested to have their boss and the owner of Gutter Shutter contact us on Monday, 06/15/2014. No call. A message was was left on the emergency line on, 06/15/2014 and no call again.
No Show. Appointment had been scheduled with Dave, for 5:00 p.m., on 06/23/2014. Nobody was refused access to the property, because nobody showed up. [redacted] was not at home from approximately 8 a.m. to 4:30 p.m., she was at her friends place all day.
Finally, on 06/30/2014, someone finally showed up. An installer came and walked around and took pictures.
Now I would will address the fact that you have slandered my name. You have no idea, other than the information you have received through sub-contractors, on my character, and behavior. Therefore a judgment of that magnitude, was made unjustly.
Due to the improper installation of the gutters, downspouts and no drip edge being installed, we are having damage done to roof sheeting and until the gutters and downspouts are removed, will not be able to see any other unseen damages.
Best Regards
CJ & [redacted] L. [redacted]
Enclosed: Photos
Enclosed : Witness Letter
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted]. For your reference,...
details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
Gutter Shutter did come today to inspect, and we appreciate that. We are waiting to receive their written evaluation of the situation, which we will review with our advisors. At this point it is too early to determine if the response resolves the matter.
Regards,
[redacted]
[A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the...
business's response. If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted], and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Regards,
[redacted]
[redacted] put a stop payment on her check and the money is in her account, not sure what the confusion is but we wish her and her family the best.
Respectfully,
John Cross
Thank you for your recent email of July 24, 2014 about the installation of gutters and downspouts by our company at the home of Mr. and Mrs. CJ [redacted].
The [redacted]s’ most recent letter states “the drip edge was not left at our home on the day the gutters and downspouts were delivered, June 12, 2014,” and that the drip edge was not “on the truck when the installers were on the premises.” We do not understand the [redacted]s’ point about the location of the drip edge, since they refused to let our installers install it. However, drip edge does not come pre-manufactured or “off the shelf”; it is custom made at the time of installation right on the job site. Therefore, it could not have been pre-delivered or been seen sitting on the installers’ truck.
Although the contract states that “Company will install drip edge on all new gutters,” Mr. [redacted] refused to let our installers put drip edge on his home. His reason given at the time was that we needed to paint it to match the color of the gutters after it is custom made, and after he saw the roll of white material that would be formed into the drip edge, he said he was having a new roof installed in two weeks and wanted the roofers to install it when doing the roof work. Mr. [redacted] said he needed to have wood replaced on the decking and would request that it come in a factory color, so he did not want the material painted.
We believe that the [redacted]s’ home needs to have drip edge installed, yet they refused to let our company install it. Mr. [redacted] refused to sign our standard certificate of completion and refused to pay the 50% contract balance due on the job. We completed the installation of gutters and downspouts on their home on Friday, June 13, 2014 and on Monday, June 16, 2014, Mr. [redacted] called us and wanted all of his down payment back. There was no specific complaint or request that we come to review the installation. Unreasonably, Mr. [redacted] wanted to keep the work and avoid paying for it.
We have reviewed the photos sent by Mr. [redacted] and observe that whoever took the pictures appears to have broken the seal on the shingles by lifting them up for photos. We find the installation in accordance with practice in the industry. However, on one matter, after viewing the photos, we would install a reducer on the one downspout where it meets the drainpipe at ground level.
The [redacted]s’ complaints appear centered around the time of day the installation occurred and the location of the drip edge. The installers finished the job with sufficient daylight, but in any event the [redacted]s refused to let the company return to the premises to have the [redacted]s point out their concerns. They just wanted their money back. After specifically requesting drip edge on June 11, 2014 at the time the contract was signed, Mr. [redacted] refused to let the installers install it. His comments about it being missing from the materials delivery are irrelevant to the fact of his refusal, and show that his doesn’t understand the nature of the product, which is custom made, or his complaint is pretextual.
Our Company is willing to install the drip edge and install the reducer on the single downspout at the ground level. This would complete the job as contracted, and our Company would expect to receive the balance due under the contract. We will waive any late charges or interest. Our company went above and beyond to accommodate the [redacted]s in their desire to expedite the gutter/downspout installation on their home. But since they refused to let us make any attempt to address their concerns, and immediately demanded a refund on the next business day following the installation, we question the motivation behind their filing of a complaint. Nonetheless, we would like to see this matter amicably resolved.
Very truly yours,
John Cross
General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies
We are responding to the recent offer made to install the drip edge and install the reducer to one downspout at the ground level. These 2 items will not correct all of the issues that have been brought to the companies attention. As we have previously stated an installer came to our home and took pictures and looked at the installation performed by your company.
We did not demand an immediate refund of our money, but after being ignored, given the run around, slandered and lied to and about repeatedly, we feel that the best result for both your company and for ourselves would be the removal of your product from our home and the refund of our money.
Best Regards,
CJ and [redacted] L. [redacted]
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID [redacted].
I would not recommend Gutter Shutter to my worst enemy. Let's focus on what we know. First of all, we know Gutter Shutter is incompetent. This is proven by these facts: (1) GS failed to install a drip edge when the gutters were originally installed in December 2012. (2) When GS finally installed a drip edge in March 2014, the installation was so defective the problems were visible from the street. Secondly, we know GS is not reputable. (1) As shown by the fine print of the contract, which was not called to our attention, GS knew that icing problems were likely to occur, yet said nothing. (2) When the drip edge job was redone in July 2014, according to GS it was obvious that the drip edge, gutters, fascia, and shingles were not meeting properly, yet GS said nothing. (I suppose this one is really a combination of incompetence and lack of reputability.)
The roof was installed in 2008. We had absolutely no problems with icing or anything else until the Gutter Shutters were installed. We had no problems with the temperature of our roof, or the amount of insulation in the attic, or anything else. If there was the potential for icing problems, due to how the gutters and roof were meeting, or any other reason, GS had an obligation to tell us. Had they alerted us to any of these possible problems, we would never have purchased the Gutter Shutters.
So our contractor who installed the roof tells us that the current problem stems from the improper installation of the drip edge. Gutter Shutter tells us that the problem is with the way the fascia was installed by the contractor. We have a long record of high satisfaction with the work of our contractor. We have a long record of dissatisfaction with Gutter Shutter. Who should we believe?
Regardless of the cause, we need to get the problem behind us. We have absolutely no faith in the ability of Gutter Shutter to deal with it. So we have no choice but pay additional funds to hire someone else to resolve the problem.
So we accept the business's response, not because we are satisfied, but because we have no faith in the ability of Gutter Shutter to deal with the problem. It's just time to move on.
With regrets,
[redacted]
This letter details the facts concerning our product installation at the home of Mr. and Mrs.
CJ [redacted].
The [redacted]s called us on June 10, 2014, responding to an advertisement in Reach
magazine. They wanted a gutter/downspout installation as quickly as possible, and made an
appointment for our...
company to visit their home on June 11, 2014. Enclosed is a contract signed
by the [redacted]s on June 11, 2014. Because the [redacted]s were anxious to get the installation
underway, they waived the 3-day right of rescission (see contract), and an appointment for
installation was set for June 13, 2013.
The [redacted]s’ letter mentions that the installers “didn’t show up until 5:00 p.m.” However,
the installation occurred just days away from the longest day of the year, and there was sufficient
light to work until after 9:00 p.m. The installation team has many years of experience and knew that
the job could be fully completed within the time available Although the contract calls for the
installation of drip edge on all new gutters, Mr. [redacted] refused to have the drip edge installed. The
[redacted]s’ letter details seemingly specific complaints, yet the disk of photos sent to us by Mr.
[redacted] does not show any of the items on his list, other than a closeup showing two screws on the
ground (The [redacted]s’ letter to the Revdex.com says “[f]ound screws and metal piece in the yard,
flowerbeds, and driveway”)
The contract provides that “Customer agrees that the entire contract price shall be paid
immediately upon completion of installation. Payment may be given to installers at time of
completion. Accounts are delinquent when they are unpaid after 5 days past the completion date...”
However, as noted by our installers on the Buyers’ Certificate of Completion” (copy attached),
“Cust. Refused to sign till talks to sales rep. The guy was really drunk.” Mr. [redacted] refused to pay
the balance due on the installation after it was completed on July 11, 2014.
Mr. [redacted] called our office on June 16, 2014, wanting return of his down payment and
claiming to be unhappy with the product. Mr. John Cross spoke with him and told him that the
company would take care of any concerns that he had. Mr. [redacted] said he did not want anyone
from our company on his property.
Despite Mr. [redacted]’s comment, Mrs. [redacted] spoke with our company’s service manager
to set up a service call for June 23, 2014. When our company team arrived at the [redacted]s’
residence, Mrs. [redacted] refused to permit our service team access to the property, saying that she
wanted her husband home. Our company tried again that same evening, and was still not permitted
by the [redacted]s to address their concerns.
The company’s service manager contacted the [redacted]s on July 2, 2014 about their unpaid
balance, since they had refused to let the company back on their property to address any concerns.
We were informed by Mr. [redacted] that he was composing a letter to our company president. Our
company’s service manager spoke to Mrs. [redacted] on July 8, 2014, who again said that a letter was
forthcoming.
Our company’s view is that we rushed to accommodate the [redacted]s in their request for an
installation as quickly as possible, Mr. [redacted] refused to let our installers perform the work as
contemplated on the contract, the [redacted]s refused to let our company address any concerns that
the [redacted]s said they had about the installation, and the [redacted]s refused to pay the balance owed.
The complaint made by the [redacted]s to the Revdex.com seeks a refund of the down
payment for the installation. The [redacted]s refused to let our company’s service team on their
property, but sent us a CD filled with photos that do not conform to the list of issues in the
[redacted]’s letter to the Revdex.com. It is our view that the [redacted]s have told us of no legitimate
complaint and need to pay the balance due.
Very truly yours,
John Cross
General Manager of The GutterShutter Companies
Enclosures:
Installation Contract For [redacted] dated June 11, 2014
Buyers’ Certificate of Completion for [redacted]