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Blue Raven Solar Rating
Address: 1403 Research Way, Orem, Utah, United States, 84097-6201
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We contracted with Blue Raven for a new solar system on our house. We were assured the system they would install would meet the needs of not only us, but a complete household in case we ever sell our house - it would be an asset rather than a liability that would cause someone to not purchase given the additional cost. The salesman would say anything to get us to buy the unit. I did some research and at the time found good reviews for this particular solar installer. We proceeded with the purchase and now, two years later we are seeing an increase to our electric bill. We now have the solar bill and an electric bill we were "PROMISED" to not incur. I contacted the Jake L with the company who informs me we are out of luck. The unit is performing at 100% of what they claimed. We are using less energy this year than we did last year, which I proved to him by providing our bill and last years usage. This is evident the unit they installed is not sufficient for our use as a 2 person, low energy use household. I'm concerned when we try to sell our home this will be a major costly deterrent to potential buyers.
Blue Raven Solar, LLC (“Blue Raven”) has at all times performed in good faith its obligations under its agreement with ***. Pursuant to the installation agreement dated July 24, 2017 (the “Agreement’), Ms. retained Blue Raven to perform permitting, procurement, and installation of a solar system on the roof of her house. Ms. knowingly consented to the Agreement and the transactions contemplated thereunder as evidenced by her signature, her recorded voice on file, and by her subsequent affirmative actions. Her claim that she was lied to regarding the solar system’s production is not supported by the documentation. On July 24, 2017, she participated in a recorded welcome call whereby she reaffirmed the terms of the Agreement and that her sales representative had not promised her anything that was not already included in the Agreement. The final design, sent 7/26/17, and redesign, sent 10/19,2017, both set out the estimated expected system production as well. The estimates regarding expected utility bill offsets are based off of expected production, estimated energy reduction, and projected energy consumption by the customer. In 2018, Ms.’s system was estimated to produce 5,556 kWh and produced 5,527 kWh or 99.5% of expected system production. Ms.’s bill of $24.94 in power charge is the first charge received since April of 2018 and is consistent with the expected production and offset provided from the installed system. We would anticipate that this bill quickly drops as the warmer months approach and energy production increases. This aligns with the expectations set out in the agreement and subsequent documentation.
If Ms. is interested in acquiring additional panels, space permitting, we would be happy to explore options with her. Additional panels would likely push her estimated annual offset over 100%. This would result in unused energy credits being lost to the utility company while still being paid for by Ms., through the purchase of additional panels. It would provide the benefit of not having ˜ $50 year in utility power charges, but would require the purchase of additional panels. Considering the work and obligation of Blue Raven have been appropriately met, the panels would not be offered for free.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
The bills that Ms. has already sent confirmed that the system was producing what we expected it would. The designed system projected that there would be some power pulled from the utility company during the year. This was confirmed by the bills sent it. While the production monitoring is still reporting that the system is working effectively, Ms. is now receiving bills higher than we anticipated at the time of receiving the first bill.
s the cause of this utility charge without receiving the utility bills. The previously sent in bills were aligned with the expected outcomes of her system. We want to work with the customer. But with the variety of potential situations that can result in higher charges, Blue Raven cannot help without the recent utility bills.
We cannot a
Joseph W
Customer Insights Specialist
Blue Raven Solar
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because: I already sent them our bills. The system is not working as they said.
Sincerely
We had our installation over a month ago and our system still doesn't work. We've called numerous times to try and get someone to come out and fix it but none of the employees are on the same page. One person tells me that it's an issue with data entry for the inverters, another tells me it just needs to be reset. I've had people come out and reset the system and when that doesn't work they tell me that someone will be out tomorrow to Fix it but nobody shows up. This has happened multiple times and meanwhile I'm paying for utilities and the solar panels. This is a horrible situation and nobody at Blue Raven seems to care.
In Mrs.’s area we’ve recently had some field staffing changes that have resulted in growing pains and delayed turnarounds in work orders. I see that our install lead, Kyle S, was able to speak with Mrs. on the 23rd and had a team out to troubleshoot the next day. During the next day our team was able to get 12 of 19 panels to start producing power correctly. Kyle has scheduled to follow up with the customer today (1/25) to schedule the completion of the work order.
We apologize for the delays and appreciate the ***’s working with us to have this work order resolved.
Joseph W
Our field operations lead has taken ownership of Lonnie's account and helped make sure everything was resolved appropriately. As of this morning the Mathisen's system has reported full production. Our team has marked the work order as complete. We apologize for the missed appointments. The situation has been escalated to our director of field operations to investigate why the appointments were missed and to take appropriate action.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Sincerely,
*** And
Their salesman proceeded to swear at me, calling me an "*** i
t" when I needed to reschedule. I then asked to not be contacted again after he was pushy about it, which resulted in his inappropriate language.
The behavior described by Mrs. is unacceptable and is not aligned with Blue Raven’s way of doing business. Our sales HR was made aware of the situation and the sales associate’s contract was terminated immediately. We apologize to Mrs. that she experienced such poor behavior associated with someone contracted with Blue Raven.
Joseph W
Customer Insights Specialist
855-205-2530
Blue Raven Solar
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Sincerely
Blue Raven approached me and asked me if I had solar. I told him I did not they said they would love to set up a meeting to show me about it.
The meeting was very vague and said that they would have to get me more information to have someone propose a plan.
Being that they could not tell me what the cost would be without this plan I said sure go ahead. The Plan they submitted did not thank work from my house which I told him was very difficult from the beginning. They had panels on the west south and east side of the property which was aesthetically not pleasing. They came back with another design and I told him I wasn’t interested. They are now saying that because I did not tell them know within three days they are trying to build me over $1200. This is ridiculous and I told him from the beginning I was not interested. Very poor business model and they take it vantage of customers.
On 5/9/18 Mr. signed an installation agreement that specified the terms of cancellation. On that same day, Blue Raven corporate spoke with Mr. via phone call to discuss the terms of the contract, including cancellation, to ensure that there were no misunderstandings. This cancellation fee is not meant as a form of revenue or punishment, we respect that Mr. doesn't wish to go solar at this time. The fee is purely meant to cover the cost of work already completed that you had agreed to have done.With the solar timeline, site survey work, design work, and city permitting and net meter work is started right away. Blue Raven solar was not notified of the cancellation. As such, the fee is in place to recover resources already put towards the solar project.Joseph
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because: If blue Raven looks at the records they did not have the articles ready by the three day right of rescission. And again, I rejected when their sales rep Presented their initial report.
Sincerely
Blue Raven desires to arrive at a mutually agreeable resolution with Mr.. After discussing his situation with our Director of Operations, she has requested that our cancellation specialist call Mr.. She has requested this considering it doesn't appear we are understanding one another through complaint responses.
On 1/23/2019 our cancellation specialist called and left a voicemail for Mr..
If Mr. accepts, we would like to speak over the phone and come to a resolution.
Joseph W
they violate the terms of the contract. solar panels are still not running. everything should have been up and running 180days from day my credit was run. the salesman came to my door he would not take no for an answer. told him need to take to my boyfriend. he kept coming very very pushy. I informed I was unemployed fired in Dec 2017. told him several time it not a good time. I was heavily medicated for depression and anxiety I informed him of that. next thing I know he pulls out a tablet sign here so fast I was lost. that was in march. they came out to install never informed me that side of house need to be cleared. that was august 14 I was told that they only had to access the attic and an adult must be home. Soon after I had a biopsy that came back positive and had to have it removed immediately. they were scheduled to come sept 7 I had surgery on the 6th. I called to reschedule as soon as I realized. left several messages text message and emails letting them know I would not be home at 7 am Friday the 7. That no adult would be home. My daughters were home getting ready to leave for school the other was sick. at 7 am workers showed up at my house. my daughter were calling me freaking out. I called and left a message stating I was not home had received 3 layers of 17 stiches 2 sets under the skin and one on top. at 7:56 I received a voice mail stating that they had to put my panels up or we would start over which I was fine with. because it would have been 180 and they would have to rerun my credit. my oldest daughter called to tell me that people were on the roof, she was scared she was 13 at the time. I was on my way home from the hospital called the number back. he stated we have to do this today. I tried to inform him that I was not feeling well and was not home. he incited that it had to be done. I tried to say no, he would not take no for an answer. they should not have stated any work with me not there. when I got home they were on the roof. I heard them joking don't tear your stiches. I had to take my daughter to the doctor at 12:30. which I was late for because they wouldn't let me leave until they got access to the house. a week or so later I sat home all day wait for blue raven inspector show up never did. Eventfully the inspector made it out another day. then I heard. from blue raven they were in no rush apparently now. Finally Berkeley electric called leaving a message stating that they are waiting on blue raven to contact them to get the panels running. that was mid October by this time I have had it with them. 7 months had past and by this point is was over it. I never received a hard copy of the contract. I have solar panels on my roof that are not working and its is almost winter. this is ridiculous.
Blue Raven Solar, LLC (“Blue Raven”) has at all times performed in good faith its obligations under its agreement with ***. Pursuant to that written agreement dated March 17, 2018 (the “Agreement’), Ms. retained Blue Raven to perform a reroof and the engineering, permitting, procurement, and installation of a solar system on the roof of her house. Ms. knowingly consented to the Agreement and the transactions contemplated thereunder as evidenced by her signature, her recorded voice on file, and by her subsequent affirmative actions. Her claim that she was unduly pressured to sign the Agreement, or that she never wanted the solar system, is not supported by the facts. Under the Agreement, Ms. was given a three-day period to cancel without any further obligation, which she did not do. On March 17, 2018, she participated in a recorded welcome call whereby she reaffirmed the terms of the Agreement and that her sales representative had not promised her anything that was not already included in the Agreement. Thereafter, Ms. freely reaffirmed the Agreement and cooperated with Blue Raven by participating in a site inspection, giving written approval of the final design of her solar system on March 27, 2018, signing an application for utility interconnection on March 27, 2018 and later on April 26, 2018, furnishing proof of insurance, participating in the installation and municipal inspection, and recertifying her credit with a third-party lender. It was only with Ms.’s complaint filed with the Revdex.com that Blue Raven was made aware of her claim that she was unduly pressured to sign the Agreement or proceed with installation.
The installation of Ms.’s system was timely installed on September 7, 2018 according to the terms of the Agreement and the mutual understanding of the parties. Generally speaking, the engineering, permitting, procurement, and installation of solar systems takes two to three months from beginning to end. In addition to the solar installation, Blue Raven was also the contractor for Ms.’s reroof, which extended the time of the final completion of her solar system. Under the Agreement, Blue Raven was to perform the installation “in accordance with a mutually agreed upon schedule.” Throughout this process, Blue Raven worked closely with Ms. to accommodate the site inspection, reroof, reroof city inspection, solar installation, and subsequent solar city inspection around Ms.’s own schedule. On March 20, 2018, Blue Raven showed-up at a previously confirmed appointment to perform a site inspection only to find out that Ms. was not there. Blue Raven subsequently performed the site inspection on a date convenient to her. After conferring with Ms., the installation of her solar system was scheduled for August 14, 2018. After arriving at her home, Blue Raven was unable to commence installation because the area around Ms.’s main service panel had not been cleared. Having subsequently cleared the area, the soonest Ms. was available for rescheduling the installation was September 7, 2018.
The final city inspection of Ms.’s solar system did not happen as scheduled due to an oversight by Blue Raven. Blue Raven gave her $150 to compensate her for her lost time. The city inspection was rescheduled and has now passed. The final step in this process is utility inspection and utility permission to operate. Blue Raven has been trying to schedule this final inspection with Ms. since November 4, 2018 with no success. Nevertheless, Blue Raven will continue to reach out to Ms. for the purpose of scheduling final utility inspection and obtaining permission to operate her solar system.
Blue Raven has fully performed its obligations under the Agreement in good faith. Ms. freely entered into the Agreement and thereafter routinely reaffirmed her commitments thereunder. Blue Raven has at all times accommodated the scheduling needs of Ms.. Blue Raven has arrived on time at all scheduled appointments and even compensated her for the no-show city inspection. Respectfully, if Mrs. would only accept our calls and fully cooperate with the final utility inspection, her system would be fully operational, and she would be enjoying the benefits of residential solar energy production.
Joseph
Blue Raven Solar
Customer Insights Specialist
We have a 'No Solicitation' sign at our door and have not had anyone ring our doorbell for years. Last night there was a knock on our door, which I assumed was a neighbor. It was a sales girl for Blue Raven Solar. She proceeded to tell me she wasn't selling anything but wanted to set up an appointment for someone to show and tell us about their solar system. I asked for a card and she said they didn't get any. The sales person who she'd set up an appointment for would have one. She wanted my information which I wouldn't give. She kept going on how much our electricity bills will be going up because of all the Californians moving in. I told her we would research it on our own but would not give our information.
It may not be illegal to knock on someone's door with a 'No Solicitation' sign but it is annoying and every other salesperson has respected it for years.
- Thank you for your feedback. We've passed your experience along to our team.
A friend of mine referred me and my family to Blue Raven Solar. At the time of installation, we were told that both parties involved in the referral would get 500.00 dollars upon installation of my solar panels. It has now been over 6 months, and still we have yet to see the check. I have reached out to Blue Raven's customer service many times, and they keep saying that they see where we were referred by a current Blue Raven customer, but then they say they need to look into the matter further, and then never respond back to me. This particular routine of me contacting them, them looking into the matter, and then ultimately blowing me off has gone on for over two months now.
One of our representatives has called Mr. to discuss the mentioned referral check. Our accounting department has been notified to send Mr. and Mr. *** each a $500 referral check.
Please let me know if there's anything else I can help with so we can make sure everything is resolved.
Thank you,
Joseph
Customer Insights Specialist
Blue Raven Solar
855-205-2530
and ***'s checks were both cut on 10/11/2018 and sent on 10/12/2018. We would anticipate that they have received their respective checks at this point in time. If for any reason they haven't, please let me know and I'll make sure that our accounting team confirms mailing information and sends a new pair.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
855-205-2530
Revdex.com:
I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
Sincerely,
***
Additionally, I would like to add that the people at Blue Raven handled the situation in a professional manner, and I appreciated the direct response from the company.
This company Blue Raven Solar setup 3 different appointments with me to come out for a consultation but never showed up. Can back and they customer service kept giving me the run around.
Dear ***,
I have reviewed Mr.’s experience and have informed our sales HR about the failed expectations and customer service. We understand that it would be frustrating to schedule time to meet with one of our representatives and to have that meeting not attended. Our sales HR will be working with our representatives to ensure that this situation doesn’t repeat itself.
Joseph
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because: Just saying you are going to fix the issue doesn’t correct or fix the issue. I would’ve been happier at least to try to get back in touch with me to reschedule
Sincerely
Dear ***,
It seems I may have misunderstood Mr.’s request. We were under the impression from previous conversations that Mr. was pursuing solar with another solar company. We apologize for the misunderstanding. If Mr. would like, I can have a sales coordinator reach out and schedule a visit.
Please let me know if there’s anything else we can help with.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
I'm only at the very beginning of this process -- just met with a rep at my home today -- but already have some concerns about what I was asked to sign.
I was told that I would need to sign something before the roof and electrical box inspection could be done - insurance purposes, I was told. Fair enough. The rep had some documents sent to my email which I opened on my laptop.
The first email said that I had applied and been approved for a loan. Huh?
The second email was "Please sign your solar loan docs." What?
The third email was "Installation Agreements." Seriously, what???
My rep told me the doc I needed to sign electronically was in "Installation Agreements." I opened the doc and the first page was Solar Referral Promotion, and I was expected to sign that I agree to be a reference, provide three references, not disclose the price or promotions I received, keep a sign in my yard -- and in exchange they'd "give" me a certain amount as a "non-cash down payment."
All right, it's a bit weird that I'm supposed to keep my solar costs a secret from people. When I bought a new car last year, I didn't have to sign a non-disclosure agreement. I didn't sign, but decided to keep reading.
Going through the other three pages of the document, I could see that I'm NOT signing for permission to inspect my roof and to check the electrical box. This is an actual CONTRACT to do business with this company, including a CANCELLATION FEE that would be in the THOUSANDS of dollars!
Holy cow! Glad my papa taught me to read before I sign!
The sales rep was fantastic in answering all my questions about this contract, and I appreciated his upfront and no-pressure response to my shock and questions. I do wish that he hadn't tried to pass this off as needed for "insurance purposes" for "roof and electric panel inspection." Telling me it was a contract to purchase products and services straight up would have gone miles in building trust with BRS. Sadly, I'm left questioning the company's integrity.
I don't know if all solar companies operate this way, but this was eye-opening to say the least.
I am going to have to think long and hard before I choose to install solar panels on my home. If I do go with BRS, at least I'll know what I'm signing beforehand.
– To qualify for a solar loan, our financing partners send a credit application frequently referred to as the “loan document”. The financing company approves you based on that application for a block amount rather than the specific price. When you are ready to sign for the actual loan, documents are sent that specify the exact amount and terms. The installation agreement lays out the proposed work and specifies that you as the customer have three days after the site survey to decide on moving forward. Your purchase would not have been contracted until that point. Regarding the referral promotion, we ask that your available promotions not be shared simply because promotions frequently change and may not be available to other customers. We understand that the solar process can be daunting. If you would like to discuss your situation any further, please feel free to reach me, Joseph, at 855-205-2530.
They offered a “production guarantee” that the system they will install will be sufficient enough for our household. Three months later and after doing quite a bit of research, they only installed a 4.72kwp solar array where others would have installed a higher capacity system for the same price. What they installed is obviously not sufficient so now we end up paying for the solar loan on top of our power bill which defeats the whole purpose of going solar!
After confirming with our power company that the system does not even send back excess energy back to the grid to accrue net meter credit, we tried to reach them via phone and they had the nerve to tell us that we have been using excess energy. We already installed the smart thermostat and led light bulbs that they provided during the install to cut down our energy use up to 20% (as they said). We even reduced our AC cooling temperature significantly but the system is just not enough.
After contacting them to let them know about the issue they sent us a quote for additional panels for an ADDED COST. They promised us that they will install additional panels if the initial install is not adequate as part of the “production guarantee”. Other solar installers would have done a proper assessment and installed the correct solar array in the first place and would have honored their initial quote.
We tried escalating the issue to their senior management but never heard anything back, no callback, email, or even a courtesy reply to let us know that they received our correspondence.
Dear ***,
Our contracts guarantee annual production on systems that are designed to produce against a customer’s individual energy consumption measured at the beginning of the sales process. *** and *** have been producing energy since May 18, 2018 and have produced within 99% of the kWh expected at this point in their system’s life. Any additional energy consumption will fall outside the guaranteed production and would indicate a change in energy consumption, which is what our evaluation of recent utility bills shows.
We designed a 4.72 kW system (with an annual production estimate of 7813 kWh) based on the energy usage provided to us by the customer at the beginning of the sales process. Solar production is calculated annually because the majority of credits are sent back to the grid not during summer, but spring and fall where usage is lower but production is still high. Therefore, a larger system size would have only been beneficial for the first few months of the system life. Still, the Bolus’s have the advantage of our Blue Power Plus promotion of 18 months of free solar power allowing them to go solar and start the credit cycle before paying the solar loan.
Solar panels are a long-term investment and we make the annual production guarantee clear in our sales materials and contracts. We will continue to honor that guarantee as well as the others that the Bolus’s signed on to, but nothing more.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
855-205-2530
Customer service issues
Sales issues
Credibility & Trustworthiness issues
Misrepresentation issues
Dear ***,
After reviewing ***'s complaint we would like to ask for additional information and context to what hasn't met her expectations. We see that previously there was frustration regarding her utility bill and Duke energy providing energy credits. Her utility company is now crediting her and her system is producing well. We don't want to assume however that this is her complaint.
Please let me know if there's anything that we can provide for you.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
855-205-2530
We entered this process without a lot of information about solar power and solar energy systems. They came to our door with flyers about their company and Solar energy. When the marketing personnel Todd Nichols spoke with us, he emphasized the federal and state tax credit estimated to be $6,000-$7,000 we will be getting when we install this system, no out of pocket cost, as well as their promotion that for the first 10 household in the area that install the system, they will pay out $90 towards the loan amount for 18 months. They did mention that when we get our tax credit, we have to apply that to the loan amount. We then find out after completing the transaction that after 18 months, we need to reach a target amount of $14,259.12 so our monthly payments will not increase. They did not mention that the target amount is 30% of the loan. When we had our final sit-down before officially starting the process, we told him that we wanted a system that has a buffer. We specified that after they calculate our electricity consumption from last year, we want them to give us some cushion for Summer season, or a growing family since this is an investment for our future. We offered multiple statements from Idaho Power, in hopes that they can analyze the varying usage throughout the year. But they only collected one. They explained that any excess energy that is not used will go to Idaho power as a credit. That credit will be used for periods of higher energy consumption. They gave us a 4.72 kW DC system with 16 panels that generates approximately 8,004 kWh a month based on the final design they provided on March 3, 2018. On average, Idaho residential electricity consumption is 1,010 kWh/month. They guaranteed energy production, but they did not deliver the energy system that we asked for. The total price of the system is 20,808.62. The building permit that they filed states that the project value is $10,380. The average cost of a 5 Kw system as of January of 2018 is $15,700. Throughout this process we trusted them completely. We started using our system in May and since then we have not generated any credit with Idaho Power and we paid $35-$40 to Idaho power for using electricity from them. We spoke with multiple customer service agents that have said that the system they placed actually generated more than the estimated power for the past few months, but they couldn't answer why we didn't get any credit. Our consumption has been regulated with the thermostat system they provided with the installation. We have consciously tried to save energy, more so this year than last year, but we ended up paying extra towards Idaho Power on top of using up our solar energy. This started the discussion that led us to believe that they did not give us the system we wanted. An average household is recommended to have a 5 kW system. For a proposed project of $10,380 that ended up costing double, we expected them to listen to our needs and concern and deliver the system that we wanted in the first place; however, that is not the case. I have spoken to multiple people on the phone and they are telling us that we will need 3-4 more panels which we will have to pay either through financing or cash. This is approximately $4,000. This is something that should have been addressed in the beginning when we committed to a 20 year loan. We feel that Blue Raven omitted certain important points in the process and since we did not have the knowledge and information that we have now, we blindly did business with them and now after sending out letters to their CEO Ryan L and president Ben P, as well as their legal counsel Joshua N, I have not heard back from any of them. I have read many complaints towards Blue Raven Solar on the Revdex.com website of people being misdirected by their tax credit promise, or the client ending up paying double because of the loan on top of their electrical bill. I am filing this complaint because our voices need to be heard and not just be swept under the rug as this company continues to grow and do business with people in the country. We deserve the system we asked for in the first place. They made a lot of profit from us, and now we end up on the losing end by having to pay $4000 to get 3-4 more panels. I faithfully hope that you consider this complaint and reach out to the company to respond to this. We have felt ignored and our concerns and issues with this whole situation have not been addressed appropriately. They claim that their mission is to serve homeowners through trustworthiness and efficient customer care. They state that they believe all homeowners should have equal opportunity to invest in simple, reliable, affordable, high-quality solar power. They have not been consistent with this.
Dear ***,
Our contracts guarantee annual production on systems that are designed to produce against a customer’s individual energy consumption measured at the beginning of the sales process. Joseph and *** have been producing energy since May 18, 2018 and have produced within 99% of the kWh expected at this point in their system’s life. Any additional energy consumption will fall outside the guaranteed production and would indicate a change in energy consumption, which is what our evaluation of recent utility bills shows.
We designed a 4.72 kW system (with an annual production estimate of 7813kWh) based on the energy usage provided to us by the customer at the beginning of the sales process. Solar production is calculated annually because the majority of credits are sent back to the grid not during summer, but spring and fall where usage is lower but production is still high. Therefore, a larger system size would have only been beneficial for the first few months of the system life. Still, the ***’s have the advantage of our Blue Power Plus promotion of 18 months of free solar power allowing them to go solar and start the credit cycle before paying the solar loan.
Solar panels are a long-term investment and we make the annual production guarantee clear in our sales materials and contracts. We will continue to honor that guarantee as well as the others that the ***’s signed on to, but nothing more.
Joseph W
Blue Raven Solar
855-205-2530
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because: We are still waiting on April W to respond to our email regarding the agreement they have come up with to install the additional panels. It's been weeks since we agreed on the resolution, but they just sent me a copy of the invoice and conditions of the agreement a few days ago. They had very specific conditions that we felt needed some adjustments. So, it's taking a while and I don't know how motivated they are to settle this at this point. As for us, we have zero credit with our electric company from Summer's passed and even with whatever energy we have managed to collect during the sunny days here. So we are paying an electricity bill AND our monthly for the panels... it's a good thing they are shouldering the first 18 months, I don't know how we would have handled it without that. I don't see much point in the panels now really... they just feel like 20,000 dollars worth of headache we decided to take on.
Sincerely
I have spoken with April and she has confirmed that she's received an email from ***. April said that she would call *** by end of day tomorrow to help resolve her concerns.
Joseph
Blue Raven Solar
855-205-2530
Blue Raven sold us a system claiming it would provide 100% offset. In their sales pitch and the quote, they claimed that we would replace our power bill with a solar panel loan instead. This has turned out to be true so far for only a couple months of the year. It IS NOT true for late spring/summer months. The original quote they provided us was for a 16 panel system. They based this on "efficiency upgrades" (ecobee thermostats). I was skeptical and had them add two panels on for a little bit of a cushion (and to ensure our offset would last for more years, as the panels degrade in efficiency by .5% every year). The 18 panel system was installed in January and activated in early February. We had a small power bill for the month of February, then just a grid connection fee for March and April on top of our solar panel loan. This were looking great, except once our May bill rolled around we were hit with a small electricity bill (on top of our solar loan and grid connection fees). Come to find out, Duke Energy resets "stored up energy" on May 31st of each year, which Blue Raven DID NOT DISCLOSE to us during the sales process. All of our "stored up energy" was zero'ed out right before the time we really needed it - big air conditioning season. During June/July/August we're only producing enough to offset only about 57-60% of our usage. This is a far cry from the 100% offset and "replace your power bills" sales pitch and quote they gave to us. Had Blue Raven communicated that we would have power bills during the summer months (I was required to give them my 12mo historical usage, so they knew the summer months were the highest up front) our decision would've been different. Now we not only have a large solar panel loan to pay, we have a large electricity bill to pay on top of that. I've reached out to Blue Raven and have been jostled around between a couple of different folks (lately I've been communicating with Joseph W). He indicated that Blue Raven would offer a discounted retrofit to add 4 more panels on my roof. Before we even got to that point, I told Joseph that I would not be willing to spend another dime, since the loan had already been taken out, taxes filed, etc. and because this is not what Blue Raven sold to us. I'm not willing to go through the hassle of figuring out taxes/loan stuff again. Blue Raven should've been truthful during the sales process or we would not be in the predicament we're in now.
We have been working with *** to clarify the commitments to production made in our contracts. Our contracts cover the annual production, not energy consumption offset. Still, considering ***'s situation, we want to work with him toward a solution. His account has been escalated and we will be reaching out again shortly to resolve.
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because:
After 6 days I have not received any correspondence from Blue Raven to try to resolve my situation. The last correspondence I received (besides their Revdex.com response 6 days ago) was what I already stated: they offered to give me a discount to retrofit my system with more panels. A discount is not good enough, as I have not received what I was promised in the first place. I've attached the quote for the 18 panel system they installed. As you can see on page 3, the solar system offset quoted is "Utility Power: 0%" and "Solar Power: 105%", based on the utility information provided to my sales rep (also attached so you can see what I provided them). On page 4 of the quote, you'll see "after solar average monthly power cost, Solar $91 Utility: $0". This has not been the case. I've also attached the last two utility bills showing the power I've been charged from the utility company the past two cycles. As you can see, Blue Raven made claims in their quote that they are not living up to in terms of offset. They need to retrofit my system at their cost to meet the expectation they set in their quote. However, as I've stated they still have not reached out to me to try to resolve my situation.
Sincerely
All of our systems are sold and guaranteed on the basis of annual kilowatt hour production, not system offset. We provide the offset percentage to help customers see how their annual production can offset consumption, all things remaining equal. After reviewing ***’s particular situation further, we saw that there was reason to reevaluate the impact of Duke’s net metering credit reset. ***’s consumption and production fall outside our typical understanding of Duke Energy customers – for whom the credit reset impact is typically low. To mitigate the impact of this reset for ***’s home, we will be installing 4 additional panels at no cost to the customer. This will help bolster his production in summer months to achieve a higher offset of his current consumption. This solution has been communicated to the customer and the logistics of the additional panel install are being orchestrated today.
Tell us why here...
Well started off nice with the sales man, but of course he just want his sale and commission off me, lots of promises, first of off it took 7 months until my panels got turn on, was told maybe 3 or 4 months, apparently the installers had too many mistakes, so I had to get an inspection after an inspection after inspection to fix issues, sales man told me that I wouldn't have any energy bills besides the solar, wrong! The panels didn't offset my energy usage like I was told and I don't care if the panels are working fine and doing what it's supposed to do, I am still getting utility bills. The salesman told me I would only get one bill and you wouldn't have to worry about 2 bills. What I didn't know is that there's a connection fee which is almost $20 a month if I knew that I wouldn't have gotten this ,of course it probably varies by state but the salesman didn't mention anything about no connection fee or even remotely said anything about it. Like another complaint on here salesman said it would offset a hundred percent which it doesn't, only thing that was mention was if you have some crazy thing going on like you get a hot tub or two frigerators added or five more people living in your house to generate more energy, and the salesman said that you shouldn't worry about two bills because you have a lot of play in there so you shouldn't have to worry about that, so if you go with this company make sure you read the fine print and maybe even tape-record your sales men promising all this stuff
expresses concern over a few key issues, 2 relating to his conversation with his sales representative. First are his concerns with the persistence of an energy bill (and connection fee) and second with the offset. The other expressed concern is about his timeline.
While each of these concerns are addressed during the process of going solar, we are working closely with *** to find a resolution that addresses some of his offset concerns. Our contracts guarantee system production, not offset, but we want to find a resolution that meets ***’s needs. We will continue working with him directly to resolve.
I am filing a complaint with Blue Raven Solar Company for their false advertising and deceitful business practices to make a sale. Lies about company guarantees that when come up they have excuses as to why this does not apply. I would like them to implement new training for their sales people so that others are not caught up in their lies and find themselves in the same hardship as I am in now. I have 3 witnesses to these next 3 facts as they were also told the same things from the salesman. There are 3 major things that I am filing this complaint with and I have talked with the company several times in resolving this and I just get the usual runaround and fluff of “oh well I’d like to help you but that is above my level.” I have all email documentations to these requests. I feel I did my due diligence on these 3 issues and only then felt comfortable in signing with them. Only to find out later I should have dug a little deeper or I would probably have not bought the system or had a little more thought to it. We do not have buyer’s remorse as we love this solar system. My complaints are the deceitful business practices that have now caused a hardship for me financially. I will list the 3 areas of complaint below, followed by what I would like to see happen.
1. I was told by the salesman that Blue Raven had a guarantee that if the solar did not produce like it was supposed to, (we produce 100% solar coverage) then we just send them our electric bill and they would pay the difference. No questions asked. I of course said this is too good to be true, what is the catch? I was reassured over and over there was no catch and I just send the electric bills in. This proved to be false. I received 4 winter bills this year for a total, minus the PGE monitoring fee, of $261.86. The very 1st bill I received was in January for $112.38. I promptly sent this in. Their response was, “Here at Blue Raven we guarantee our solar production on a yearly basis (not monthly) due to the fact that solar production varies greatly by season. As of now, your system has been producing more than expected month over month. If production ever drops below 10% on a yearly basis then we would be more than happy to talk about a reimbursement plan for you.” This was NOT what is proposed to you when you are sitting down with the sales rep. Again, I have 3 witnesses who went through this process (one bought the solar system) and everyone was told what I was told.
2. This one I just found out about as I was preparing all of my documentation and have not yet wrote into the Company to see what this excuse would be. We received 3 tax credits this year. 1. Energy Trust of Oregon Incentive 2. Federal Tax Rebate of 30% 3. State Tax Rebate of $6000. We will be addressing #1-Energy Trust and I will also discuss the other two tax rebates in the 3rd point. My net system cost was $42,251.00. Blue Raven said if I signed over to them this Incentive from Energy Trust of Oregon, in the amount of $3784.50, then this would bring my total net system cost to $38,466.50. Someone needs to really explain something to me because since the Incentive was bringing down my system cost, then why was my loan to Moasic Loan still $42,251.00?? Shouldn’t my loan have been for the $38,466.50? We were using the Energy Trust Incentive to bring down the cost of the Solar! This did not benefit me. This to me is very deceptive and misleading. I would have received the Energy Trust myself and applied it to my loan if I would have known Blue Raven was going to keep the incentive for themselves.
3. This brings us to the taxes. Once again this is based on trusting a sales rep and a reputable solar company to a fault. Yes, I did receive the $15,000 Fed tax credit and the State $6000 credit. Problem is I did not receive it in a way that you are “promised” while going over everything with the sales rep. At NO time during any of our conversations did it come up that “you need to check with a tax professional”. Once again, I have 3 witnesses to this fact. My friends got the same system and they got ALL of their tax credits like they were promised and doing further due diligence, I didn’t see anywhere at that time that something like this could happen. The tax money I got back this year was NO different than the past years. It is ALL just one big carry over. This is so deceitful, and it is also set up with the Loan company that you have a “target balance”, which is in line with getting the tax credits back from the IRS & State. I emailed about this and this was the response, “I am sorry to hear you are dissatisfied with the product you purchased. I understand the issues you are looking at here and actively try and avoid these situations. We take several steps to ensure our customers understand the production and tax credits. We include a notice on the installation agreement reminding potential customers that our sales representatives are not tax professionals and we recommend talking with a tax professional before continuing the process. Additionally, we have a welcome call in place to go over and review both the production and tax credits.” This statement is so blatantly disgusting. Pure garbage. They DO NOT take several steps. This was the first I had heard about it! They do not once show you the little fine print where they do say consult a tax professional. If they did this they wouldn’t have as many sales. He said they have a welcome call in place to go over and review tax credits. NOPE never happened. It is told however, over and over, that you WILL receive all these credits, this is why the loan company works with them to get that “target” down. I was told to do this with the tax credits, which in my case does not work because there is no credits per say… “You will receive the tax credits over the next several years until you have claimed the full amount. You can use that money to help offset the higher monthly cost by putting it into the account the loan auto-drafts from and leaving it there. The monthly payments are higher, but because you have the extra money in the account from the tax credit you don’t feel the effects of the higher payment.” This statement is absolutely ridiculous. Again, The whole point of the sale was to receive the tax benefits, which is the reason the loan company gives you 17 months, to apply to the solar loan so you don’t have a high payment.
I was cringing at paying the solar loan company $190.15 a month to have the solar panels. Well, its solar. That’s cool, I can live with that. Can you imagine what is happening now when they go up to $272.63 a month because I have not met my “target” payoff? My PGE bill used to be around $60-70 per month. Yes I have not had a bill during the summer, but I have about 4 in the winter, around $100. So basically 8 months out of the year I am paying almost 3x. The 4 winter months I am paying almost 5x what I was paying before solar. When my payment goes up in September it will just be outrageous. Paying almost $400 a month for electricity?! My problem with all the deceitful business practices that are going on here are really going to send someone over the edge, if not me. No one in their right mind would want to pay 8-10x what they were paying before, and they shrug it off with an oh well.
In contract negotiation, it is only a legal contract if both parties benefit. This is based on that everyone has had the correct information. I am not benefiting and a HUGE Loan on my credit is hindering me from doing anything. Even to remedy this situation. I’m dead in the water so to speak. I am tired of this company who keeps on practicing in a dishonest and/or misrepresentation just to get a quick sale. The sales reps are still at it. I have talked to ones recently who are receiving the same sales pitch. They need their policies changed and act on them.
submitted a complaint regarding several aspects of her experience with Blue Raven Solar, LLC. She identified three major factors contributing to her dissatisfaction: production guarantee, incentive discounts, and tax credits. We now submit our response.
Blue Raven’s production guarantee and information concerning state incentives and tax credits are clearly disclosed in the sales contract signed by *** and the supporting documents. And, to further reduce confusion and eliminate any disagreement between the sales contract and any representation made by the sales representative, we conducted a separate welcome call with *** where we discussed that her estimated system production is an annual estimate based on the utility bills she provided, and that tax credits are not guaranteed. In more recent discussions with ***, she has acknowledged that the sales contract and supporting documents cover these topics, but she remains concerned about her initial conversation with the sales representative. We have shared ***’s feedback with the our sales department and believe that it has been adequately addressed through better training.
We have addressed with *** her concern about how the Oregon Energy Trust incentive was applied to her loan amount by reviewing her the initial proposal, sales contract, and other supporting documents. For example, the proposal demonstrates how the incentive is applied to the initial system cost (per requirement of the incentive provider) and therefore lowered her loan amount at the outset. We believe *** has accepted this clarification and now has a better understanding of how the Oregon Energy Trust was applied to her system cost.
While it is our position that the sales contract, supporting documents, and welcome call are designed to prevent the kind of confusion experienced by ***, we are sensitive to her individual situation. We are still working with *** and remain committed to resolving this matter amicably.
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because:
We were in the process of coming to a resolution when this message came up and I needed to reply to this last message from Blue Raven to me. So I am only rejecting this last communication as Blue Raven and myself have seem to have come to a resolution. I would like to see that resolution on the next communication and then I will accept the resolution we have come to.
Sincerely
We have reached a resolution with ***. We are sensitive to her individual situation and chose to provide a resolution that will benefit her specific circumstances. We have provided her the necessary documentation outlining that solution. We will continue to work with *** throughout the lifetime of her solar panels.
They sold me a pack of lies about how much I would pay, then the first installation crew screwed up, and they had to send another crew out, then later had to come back a couple times to turn the damn thing on. Then when it came to tax time to apply for the energy credits they hyped me up about, they were nowhere to be found, and I had to try and navigate that bureaucracy on my own. If you do go with them, be sure to read the fine print, and you might want to record your conversation for legal purposes as well. If I had the foresight to do that, I'd be taking legal action by now.
I am so sorry that the experience did not meet your expectation in going solar. I hope the recent call with our Director of Operations about navigating the tax credit process was helpful. I’m glad to see your system is now functioning well and that your tax application is underway. If you have further concerns with the application or your system, please let us know. Our goal is to help you see the benefit in going solar and obtain the results you were expecting.
I purchased solar from Blue Raven Solar based upon a proposal made to me by a representative of the company named Mike F. Mr. F presented at my door to sell the system in August 2017. He represented that Blue Raven Solar would design a solar system for me that would meet 96% of my energy needs. At the time in mid August, I disclosed to Mr. F that my current usage had increased from last years usage and I wanted him to take that into account. Mr. F said he could only design the system on last years numbers and proceed to get numbers for energy usage from Xcel Energy by phone. Mr. F further stated that Xcel only allows him to design a system based on some subset of numbers but never explained fully why my current years usage could not be used. When we were discussing the proposal further for signing, I made known to Mr. F that I wanted the system to meet my current needs because I would have no use to have a solar system on my house that does not meet my current energy needs. Mr. F represented that he would address my concerns at a later date. Thereafter, I signed his proposal for my solar design using last years numbers but that also included several statements on it that it would be designed to meet 96% of my energy needs. Based on reading this, I signed the proposal because I felt comfortable that Blue Raven was going to design my system to meet my needs. The proposal showed my loan amount as $16,906 and producing 6,788 kwh a year. Now the system is built and my production is looking to produce 6,500 a year and my projected usage will be 9,000 kwh a year. After discussing with the company that my current usage again is higher, Blue Raven's rep Mitch instructed me that their only proposal to bring my system up to 96% of my current usage is to add 10 more panels and increase my loan to over $28,000. This is unacceptable. I believe the original agreement is that Blue Raven agreed to produce a system that meets 96% of my energy needs and not 75% of my energy needs. Also, with my old loan terms, Mr. F statement that my monthly statement on my loan for solar would be less than my utility bill for electricity is true. with a new loan of $28,000 +, my monthly loan payment would be higher than what I pay for electricity. I think there was a fundamental misunderstanding by the parties and/or mistake by both parties in forming this agreement. I want my system to produce 96% of my energy needs as discussed. agreed to at the time of contracting.
got a proposal for his solar panels in August 2017. At that time, we calculated the yearly energy consumption for *** using data from his utility company, Xcel Energy, showing consumption between Aug 2016 – Jul 2017 (attached). Mike, ***’s rep, tried to reassure *** that we use previous, but recent data to create these proposals because we are data driven company. So, when *** keeps referring to the usage as the “last year’s” that misses the fact that the usage used is representative of the previous 12 months – including any in the current year, in this case Jan – Jul 2017.
Mike got *** an initial proposal showing a system designed to produce 6,788 kilowatt hours (kWh) in its first year. This initial proposal uses remote analysis and is not the final proposal, which Mike shared. A final proposal is shared after an on-site visit to obtain more measurements. We scheduled this visit with *** and explained its purpose, so he was aware even then the final proposal may have changes. After concluding our on-site visit, we sent the final proposal to ***. The final proposal showed a system designed to produce 6,597 kWh in its first year. The change from our initial to final proposal is the result of updating the measurement of the pitch of the customer’s roof – which can affect system production because pitch affects the amount of sunlight the panels receive. *** signed off on this final proposal, yet another touch point where we clarify production expectations.
*** acknowledges that Mike, his rep, would address the consumption vs. production concerns at a later date. Mike is right to do so, as we want make smart suggestion based on actual data before we proposing a larger, more costly system size. Waiting ensures we have all the right information, which we shared with ***.
And to be fair, I understand ***’s concern that his consumption offset percentage of 96% is not being met, but this is due to ***’s energy usage being different than that provided on past utility bills, and his contract only guarantees the energy production of his system, not the offset (see image001.png attachment)
The offset on the proposal is only meant to represent how the proposed production in kWh compares against the customer’s consumption as determined by the provided utility data. In this case, 6,788 kWh (initial proposal) is 96% of 7,081 kWh (***’s consumption from the year’s data we had). Also, the final proposal only represents the proposed system in kWh, since this is the best representation of the product sold and also what the customer signs off on. In this case, the final proposed production is 6,597 kWh.
*** was installed in November and turned on in early January. He is on track for estimated production in January. When he requested additional panels in early January to reach his more recent consumption, we reviewed the consumption from the 6 months not available at the time of his initial proposal. That data would suggest the increase in panel count that *** refers to in his complaint. Our policy of making data-based decisions and ***’s misunderstandings of our contract is the reason why his concern arose. We have been in communication with the customer regarding this situation and will continue to work with him on this as needed.
Tell us why here...
Complaint: ***
I am rejecting this response because: my conversation with mike currently requires further analysis of system needs. We agreed to wait until July 2018 to determine real usage. I think when the system was built, more consideration should have been given to projected future usage as previous months indicated such an increase. If Xcel would not approve the system based on projections as mike stated at the beginning, mike should have recommended waiting until usage was known. I am happy with mike’s response to this complaint but would ask the company revise its sales tactic to include future projected usage just to give homeowners notice of the potential true costs ahead of time.
Sincerely
We were able to speak to *** this last week to review the complaint and come up with a resolution.
April spoke with ***, and at this time we are waiting for more information on his energy consumption so we have good information to base an estimate for an upgrade to his system. We will review his bills and help find the balance between offsetting all his energy consumption and a reasonable price for an upgrade.
We will reach out to *** in May per our discussion to review and take the next steps.
Thank you.
We had already thought about solar for a decade, just bought a new home and they showed up to our area. Wasn't pushy and the install went great. Took a while to get turned on with the state/county inspectors, but once they gave he ok our power company installed the net metering within a week. Solar panels were on same day. Customer service is fast and there's almost not waiting on the phone. Email communication is also descent. I've communicated with the same three people during the process and get responses with 2-3 days if not immediately.
Thank you for your review! We're thrilled that you've had a good experience. Please let us know if there's ever anything we can help with! We're always here to assist. Welcome again to the Blue Raven family!